viet_boi_racin

So, I got a B16 motor. I've bought the sleeved block for a reasonably good deal. and been working on it. I'm almost done with it. motor consist of:

block:
-GE sleeves
-bored and honed to 84mm
-Arias pistons
-Eagle rods
-upgraded ARP rod bolts
-ITR oil pump, ITR water pump
-ARP head studs
-balanced rotating assembly
-micropolished crank
-ACL bearings
-all new seals

Head:
-B16 head
-skunk2 springs and retainer
-GSR cams
-Skunk2 cam gears
-AEM fuel rail
-AEM FPR
-Victor X manifold
-AEBS 68mm TB.

turbo set up:
SC6159S ported S housing
custom top mount
3" downpipe and exhaust
Garrett 12x31x3 intercooler
2.5" charge pipe on hot side and 3" on cold side
Tial BOV
Walboro 255
..........
.......

one of my concern right now is the compression of the pistons. I purchased them from a friend. His buddy is pretty sure its 9.0 or 9.1. He said it wasnt an off the shelve piston that Arias make. But my buddy is unsure he say it ma be like 8.5 or something that low.

second concern is, I'm not impressed with the torque numbers the B16's put out. After all this is going to be going into my DC.

Should I just run the damn motor? or I'm really contemplating on selling my block and build a GSR or a LS block and put the head on there.

really torn right now between these options.

tony413

good gearing usually makes up for low torque my thing is with boosted cars rpms dont matter cause after 7800k torque lowers anyway so why have a high reving 9k motor ??? its usually gonna kill the turbo anyway

miyagi

if he still has the specs of the pistons (dish cc, etc), you can put them in one of the many compression calculators online and see what your compression will end up being when it's all said and done.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by tony413 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">good gearing usually makes up for low torque my thing is with boosted cars rpms dont matter cause after 7800k torque lowers anyway so why have a high reving 9k motor ??? its usually gonna kill the turbo anyway </TD></TR></TABLE>

good gearing, i agree with. But what good gearing is, depends soley on one's setup.

If your torque falls off after 7800 rpm, then there's something choking your flow ... head, intercooler piping, etc. My last b16 held it's own to 9300 rpm, if it did fall it wasn't anything significant. This one's going to see well past that.

Why have a high revving motor? Maybe so you can keep deeper in your powerband, have better use of your gearing, etc.. For example, if you make more power from let's say 6000 on, why stop at an RPM that'll make you drop much lower than that after a shift... Also, if you have the option to raise the limit and trap in 4th instead of 5th, why would you even think of not doing it if your motor can handle it? On top of that, he's running a b16 ... they're rev happy as it is with they're rod/stroke ratio.

To the OP, rev it until it stops making power... nothing better than still having 1000 rpm+ to go when the person beside you is already shifting to the next gear

I run a built b16 in my integra as well ... it's not that bad... torque numbers aren't the best, but they're not awful. at 365whp, it made ~260. At 410 whp, it made 283 tq. My integra got around just fine. Felt relatively stock out of boost.

Right now, to get figure some bugs that i had with my last 2 motors (which blew, out of the blue while running fine), i'm on stock block, built head w/ a cometic headgasket making it roughly 9:1 c/r with a 30r (.82 a/r) ... this one feels better out of boost than the last 2.

You've already got the everything you need for this block, don't even bother selling it. Slap it in there, get it tuned and go for it.

Besides, having b16 stamped on your block makes it easier to hustle some fools

tony413

your turbo dictates your powerband just because your car can rev to 10k doesnt mean the turbo is gonna be happy or in its most efficent spot where power is made the best. also most torque dies on MOST cars after 7800k or MAYBE 8.2k if you have a good V.E. after the torque fails out of the powerband then what are you gonna do ? thats where gearing would come in but that can be tricky

miyagi

i'm pretty sure an sc61 will be efficient past 7800 rpm ... if he was running a 50 trim i'd say differently.

I'm not saying rev to 10,000 ... i said rev till it stops making power...

tony413

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by miyagi &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">i'm pretty sure an sc61 will be efficient past 7800 rpm ... if he was running a 50 trim i'd say differently.

I'm not saying rev to 10,000 ... i said rev till it stops making power...</TD></TR></TABLE>

haha if could rev to 10k if he used the turbo from a hayabusa lmfao

miyagi

turbo'd hayabusa's probably don't run anything larger than something equivalent to a 50 trim anyway haha.

That's apples and oranges brotha.

miyagi

FYI - the turbo i revved to 9300 rpm with was a standard 57 trim t3/t04e with a .63 a/r... nothing too big...

viet_boi_racin

hey Miyagi. what kind of times are you runnning with your set-up? with the 30R.

miyagi

haven't had the chance to hit the track with the 30r, i'm on a weak 3psi street tune for now, going to up the boost at the dyno on saturday, i have a carshow the following weekend, and the weekend after that i'm going to hit the track.

At 3psi, it 'feels' faster than my car did while JRSC GSR, and that ran 13.60's all day on non-drag radial street tires.

If I stay at 3psi, i'd like to run a 13.59 or better ... if I up it to 8ish like i hope to be able to, i'm shooting for a 12.99.

There's a guy on here that made ~350whp @ 8psi on a stock block/head b16 ... i'd like to see just above 300 and call it a day.

I'll post here once i get to the track.

... God I feel like such a pansy talking about 3 psi ... even 8psi

RedEj8

Just run the b16. You've already got it built so id say just drop it in and run. And with a 84mm bore you're somewhere in the neighborhood of having a 1.8 liter so you should probably make around the same torque as a stock bore 1.8liter block.

miyagi

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by RedEj8 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Just run the b16. You've already got it built so id say just drop it in and run. And with a 84mm bore you're somewhere in the neighborhood of having a 1.8 liter so you should probably make around the same torque as a stock bore 1.8liter block.</TD></TR></TABLE>

viet_boi_racin

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by miyagi &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

... God I feel like such a pansy talking about 3 psi ... even 8psi </TD></TR></TABLE>

hahah yeah. I'm planning to run 20-24lbs what ever it takes to get me between 500-550whp. but as of now from what i'm seeing. I dont like the idea of making 500-550whp with 280lb of torque.

Its like ****, my old LS-T made 220-230lb of torque. My thousands of dollar motor makes 50-60lbs more?

miyagi

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by viet_boi_racin &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

hahah yeah. I'm planning to run 20-24lbs what ever it takes to get me between 500-550whp. but as of now from what i'm seeing. I dont like the idea of making 500-550whp with 280lb of torque.

Its like ****, my old LS-T made 220-230lb of torque. My thousands of dollar motor makes 50-60lbs more? </TD></TR></TABLE>

I'm shooting for ~500whp at under 20 psi ... i don't see it being a problem looking at my setup.

what 500+ whp motors have you seen making 280 tq? Most make that with 100 whp less. My 84mm b16 did.

believe me - you won't be nearly as disappointed as you'd think. B16-T's aren't completely torqueless. They might make less, but it's not THAT drastic.

boosted92

I have an 81.5mm B16 with a T3/T67 HO and I don't regret it. Sure, a GSR/LS would make more torque and spool up faster, but I just crank a few more pounds of boost into it and spin the **** out of it. Run a 5-bar map sensor, crank that SC61 up, and make 630 WHP

HiProfile

If you're shooting for 300whp, I wouldnt' bother checking the piston CC's, but I'd make sure they were dished at least a bit. Otherwise 500whp+ on med-high boost with 11:1 CR is an easy way to find the detonation threshhold by accident, in which case you'd be forced to get the right pistons after the current ones melt. I'd suggest tearing it apart a bit to check that it has said parts, as well as to CC the chaimbers and pistons, then you'll know for sure what CR it has.

Seriously though, I've never been a big fan of sleeving any 1.6L honda motor, let alone putting that much stuff on it. After all is said and done, its all of 5% or less of the total build if you had upgraded to a GSR block. But if you got a sleeved b16 w/all those parts for a great deal, then get it tuned & rock out with your **** out.

viet_boi_racin

thanks for the input guys. Feel a little better now. but I'm still searching around looking at diff dyno graphs of B16 turboes.

for the last guy. the block is already sleeved and has Arias pistons compression is under question right now. its somewhere between 8.5-9.1. I was told the pistons were not off the shelves. so its not on the website.

miyagi

there won't be MUCH difference between 8.5-9:1 ... as long as they're dished you'll be golden.

viet_boi_racin

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by miyagi &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">there won't be MUCH difference between 8.5-9:1 ... as long as they're dished you'll be golden.</TD></TR></TABLE>

what do you mean by dished? they're Arias inverted dome. they look like this:

viet_boi_racin

up. for more opinion. and Dyno if possible

boostedcivicsir

i made 540 wheel with a simmilar setup it was 540 / 313 not too bad. got me in the 10's in sfwd trim.

short list on the setup:
84mm b16
9:1's
gsr cams
t3t67ho full race kit
255 and 1200's
vic x bored b16 throttle body
basically the same.
and the boost is like a light switch. man was it fun
this was our first tune on bigger than 750's and first high hp honda tune.
this plot was with less timming. we added more later and didnt get a plot from it.

Boner_Ben

I went 10.4 @142 on my stock sleeved junk b16. I personally liked the B16 becuase it did not make a ton of torque so traction was not too bad.

miyagi

dish = inverted dome.

G"UNIT

Like to see more b16 numbers

CivicVX94

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by miyagi &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">turbo'd hayabusa's probably don't run anything larger than something equivalent to a 50 trim anyway haha.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
ot..but there was a turbo busa on here w/ a gt35r putting out ~560whp.
I'll try to find the link for ***** and giggles