0KStuned

I need more traction and overall performance from my FWD turbo H22 civic. I need to do what no one else is doing with FWD cars,... I want to hang with supercars as best I can. How can I go about getting more GRIP? Ever since I have gotten my car done (rebuilt engine, turbocharged, AEM EMS tuned) I have felt that it is untouchable,.. at least in the high gears I have been able to catch just about anything that could beat me off the line, I have beat a STOCK Dodge Viper, '02 Corvette z06 (from a rolling start). But last weekend I had an awakening. I went to a friends shop who has a Nissan Sunny GTI-R (available only in Europe) for those who don't know it is All wheel drive, this car had an estimated 275 horsepower and weighed in at 2800 lbs, and it felt sooooo fast! In comparison, my civic weighs 2,360 lbs. and has appx. 400 horsepower, and I am telling you that this GTI-R was AMAZING! The problem is that I have ZERO traction until 4th gear, I can roll into the throttle in 3rd gear and light the tires up,... it was fun at first but now it sucks, I need to HARNESS THE POWER! I know I can't be the only one who is realizing this, I could sell my car,.. but I would rather figure out how to make it hook up since I have built it myself from the ground up! I want to do what NO ONE else can do! I WILL make this car hook up. What are you guys doing for traction,.. MOTORMATRIX, GZRmoto, B18chybrid? Last night I went out and was racing a buddy of mine with an Eclipse GSX with 16G turbo, front mount, S-AFC, and bolt-ons, and he would get such a jump on me off the line that I wouldn't catch him until 130mph!!!

What can I do beyond traction bars, drag launch springs, and drag radials? Keep in mind that I have HUGE front brakes, and it will stay that way, so slicks aren't and option. This is an all around performance street car, it STOPS like hell, handles pretty damn well, and it sure does ACCELERATE LIKE HELL!

Cliffs notes:
I have too much horsepower, and no traction.
Mildly tuned AWD cars can whoop my *** off the line so bad that I can't catch them
What can be done besides traction bars, drag launch springs, and drag radials?
I know I can't be the only person with this problem, what can WE do???????

I LOVE my brakes,.. and they are staying, so 13" wheels with slicks is NOT and option!

Tinker219

Mid engine, rwd. Youd be surprised how accesible this can be if you can weld, and dont mind cutting your car.
Once my shop is done, any spare time I have will be used to convert my h22 Sol into a super-car EATER....
Either that, or run 325/55/16 tires....

VaporTrail

you have to sacrifice something, like steering radius. You can fit big drag radials under your front end with some cutting and if you don't make U turns. Another big option should be a multi stage boost controller, or one that is speed based. If you're trying to put down 400whp on street tires you're wasting time you could be spending acclerating.

MotorMatrix.com

you cant have your cake and eat it too. you have to give up some luxeries if you want to hook. those low pro tires wont hook ever. time to step up to a big drag radial, traction bars and soem stiffer rear springs and that will help.

TeStUdO

do you have a LSD?

0KStuned

Ok, so what's a big drag radial,... sizes:__________?
They must still be able to be on 16's?

I will cut, and reweld my fenderwells if necessary, as well as get a crazy wide wheel. But what are the sizes available. I know BFG doesn't offer a 16" drag radial, while nitto offers 1 rare size which is 205-50-16.

At this point I am thinking also about a larger diameter tire, I am currently running a 205-40-16, and I was shifting into 5th gear at the track, with 117mph ET's!

So: Big (as in taller and wider 16" drag radial) sacrifice some lock to lock steering, traction bars, drag launch springs. What are your 60' times on drag radials? All I want is CONSISTENT 1.9 60' times on drag radials, whaddya think? My buddy Dustin (H-T username: 1 2nv) has 1.69 60' times with 22-8-15 MT slicks, all motor!

Tinker219

My Gf has a quaiffe...doesnt matter if youre over 300whp, still a spinning frenzy. Mike, do you even hook up at all? Even w/255s on my gfs Sol, they still blew to pieces below 4th gear(well, lit up )

0KStuned

Yes, I have a factory LSD (JDM transmission) but when I watch my burnout video of me in the waterbox at the track,... only one tire is spinning!!! I don't know what's up with that!?

VaporTrail

I have a set of 225/50/16 drags made by Nitto that they no longer make, and I know that 245's will fit as well. If you don't have a real diff yet, then you need to get one. Lower suspension bushings will also help, along with proper amounts of camber correction

MotorMatrix.com

A big drag radial woul dbe a 255/50/16 bfg. they do make them you are looking at the gforce not the comp ta probably. here is a pic

0KStuned

Motormatrix: The tire in the picture of your car is the 255? It looks like a 15" rim, then a 225, or 235 tire.

camber correction; shouldn't camber be set perfectly at 0 degrees for max. contact patch. Toe as well set at 0?

The 245 nittos ARE in production still? I would need AT LEAST a 7.5 inch rim for a 245 Nitto, or 255 BFG right?

And are you recommending Quaife, KAAZ, or what for a BADASS street driven LSD.

Sorry to grill you with questions, but I am very interested in what is working for you guys,... and help is greatly apprciated!


Modified by Hondaddict at 2:50 PM 8/31/2003

VaporTrail

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Hondaddict &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">camber correction; shouldn't camber be set perfectly at 0 degrees for max. contact patch. Toe as well set at 0?

The 245 nittos ARE in production still? I would need AT LEAST a 7.5 inch rim for a 245 Nitto, or 255 BFG right?

And are you recommending Quaife, KAAZ, or what for a BADASS street driven LSD.

Sorry to grill you with questions, but I am very interested in what is working for you guys,... and help is greatly apprciated!</TD></TR></TABLE>

actually, you do want a little camber. The reason being with weight transfer, which no matter what you do, it will always be there. Giving a little negative camber when the suspension is loaded up front means when the suspension unloads, the camber will come in a tad. This will givey ou a scant bit more traction, if you're looking for every little bit, this is where you would want to look.

The main things that you are going to find make the biggest difference is tire size, and compound. They do have the 245's still, and they will fit on a 7' rim, i have that setup on my 240sx - they hook exceptionally well. The bigger you can fit though, the better, so long as you are not distorting the contact patch.

The Kaaz does not deal well with wheel hop, and will give. I'd recommend a Quaife, as will just about everyone here. Very heavy duty diffs.

0KStuned

SWEET! I will be ordering the 245's then, since you say they will fit on my 7" wide wheels!

Also, the lower suspension bushings,... front and rear? Would stiffer bushings be more helpful in the rear with less "squishyness?" I have been considering spherical bearings,(progress offers them) but they are damn expensive, I figure energy suspension bushings or aluminum rear LCA's w/ the stiffer bushings will do the trick right? Stiffer bushings will help just to reduce wheelhop as I understand it, has this been your observation too?

MotorMatrix.com

the tire on my car is a 255/50/16 on a 16x7 rim. it fits just fine on the rim. the nittos are nowhere near as sticky as the bf's but the bf's dont last as long either. i was spinning the nittos at 450whp and the bf's hooked at near 600whp. you dont have to go as extreme with the tire size but if you can afford it go with the bfg's over the nittos they are night and day.

i would go with a quaife over any other lsd on the market.

VaporTrail

spherical might be going a bit far for a street car, I'd be afraid of stress fractures to the suspension components. I think you want some give, but not much. There is no disadvantage other than ride quality and noise to doing poly bushings throughout the whole car.

lazerus

Coilovers and a nice set of adjustable shocks, help the weight transfer by having the rear coilovers set higher than the front, so that the weight emphasis will be on the front tires.

This on my car has made a dramatic difference in traction because the weight will tend not to shift towards the rear of the car as i accelerate.

0KStuned

Well f*ck yeah, if 255's will fit then thats what I'll get!!! How long they last is irrelevant, as long as I can get 6 months or so out of them then that's cool with me.

I currently have 350 pound springs in the rear, with tokico illuminas. I am going to put the skunk drag rear springs, totem traction bars, and the 255-50-16 BFG's. I am STOKED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Thanks, you guys are ****** pimps! I would have never thought a 255 tire would fit!
**** YEAH! Thanks again.

5thgencivic

The BFG's will only last a couple thousand miles I think. Mine are wearing pretty fast and I only ran them like 4 nights on the street, racing(25+passes though). I also was running the pressure a little high so it's hard to say. Tell you what though, they hook

Blindstuff

LSD

MiraiZ

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Tinker219 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Mid engine, rwd. Youd be surprised how accesible this can be if you can weld, and dont mind cutting your car.
Once my shop is done, any spare time I have will be used to convert my h22 Sol into a super-car EATER....
Either that, or run 325/55/16 tires....</TD></TR></TABLE>

definately post your progress...gotta see that!!

vactor

quaife LSD and race logic traction control. will get all the power possible to the ground in the most effective manner at a reasonable cost. wheels and tires are of course teh most important. something wide and sticky of course.

boosted92

Have you updated to the version 1.0 software of the EMS yet? That puppy has traction control built in, and it has gear-dependant boost control built in. That along with some BFG's, jim-fab bars, and a quaiffe should really help you hook up.

saso

Your first problem is that LSD, if only one wheel is spinning either your lsd is fuked or buy a Quaiffe, that is a MAJOR problem. Second, FWD + extreme power = no traction, period. You either need to learn how to drive the car (not hit the throttle flat) or get a multi stage boost controller like the greddy or even better the Innovative. Dont even waste your time and money on too much suspension on a street car, you will just sacrifice streetablility.

chidoks

i hope to follow in tinkers footsteps...have an h22 in my integra now...hoping to build a 600rwhp h22 ...rwd is the way to go... koni adj w/ground coilovers, quaiffe... 255/50/16.. tinker... keep detailed reports of the conversion and list of parts u used...it would definitely be fun to have a rwd honda with the weight of an integra

Furry in your eye

you have an aem ems... why not set up the traction control in the software..??