Ge sleeved block. Copper or stainless o-rings?? help?? Jotech or any experienced engine builders??
12-09-2002, 02:12 AM
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Ge sleeved block. Copper or stainless o-rings?? help?? Jotech or any experienced engine builders??
I have a GE sleeved block and noticed after the first time I pulled the head the copper o-rings were smushed down a lot. The machine shop I used suggested going with a stainless o-ring so it doesnt smush down and bites the head better.I decided to do it and it has been working fine so far up to 28 lbs but i plan to go 30-35psi.Is there any drawback to running the stainless o-ring over the copper?? thanks for any help you guys can provide.
12-09-2002, 05:30 AM
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Re: Ge sleeved block. Copper or stainless o-rings?? help?? Jotech or any experienced engine builders
Man I'd get on the phone with Vince. After all he's the man to talk to about anything GE related. Keep us updated.
Noel oh yah free
Noel oh yah free
12-09-2002, 05:37 AM
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Re: Ge sleeved block. Copper or stainless o-rings?? help?? Jotech or any experienced engine builders
The stainless wire is gonna help alot, i wonder why they even thought of using copper since its so maluable. you need to make sure on the wire you get that it is the right diameter so it will protrude off the deck the right height, are you using a copper head gasket? aslo is your head reciever groved ? the receiver grove in the head will help out big time as it will let the wire in your block have some where to go. if you need the stainless wire i have some at the shop, its high quality stainless we use on our 7 sec pro 5.0 cars. i have a question on a 60-1 turbo, i have decided to not get the T3/T04B , because of the limited capabilities so iam gonna order the 60-1 will i have problems with the standard or should i go with the HIFI model.also what A/R will a .63 be to nasty.???? also what trim size and housing?? let me know
12-09-2002, 08:42 AM
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Re: Ge sleeved block. Copper or stainless o-rings?? help?? Jotech or any experienced engine builders
I'd stay with copper, I am not too care about lasting longer, but as the smushed down when the head is pressed on, you know they're sealing well...
I am trying to remember the size of the copper wires, I know, they're the softer material than the standard copper
stan
I am trying to remember the size of the copper wires, I know, they're the softer material than the standard copper
stan
12-09-2002, 08:46 AM
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Re: Ge sleeved block. Copper or stainless o-rings?? help?? Jotech or any experienced engine builders
i have a question on a 60-1 turbo, i have decided to not get the T3/T04B , because of the limited capabilities so iam gonna order the 60-1 will i have problems with the standard or should i go with the HIFI model.
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12-09-2002, 10:19 AM
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Re: Ge sleeved block. Copper or stainless o-rings?? help?? Jotech or any experienced engine builders
In reply to all the posts I was refering to a stainless steel o-ring with a copper head gasket from sce and a reciever grove in the head....obviously these guys are not running a reciever grove because they think a maluable seal is acceptable...sorry I am used to dealing with 1900hp mustangs with BIG THUMPER 108s from precision turbo just ask harry....
12-09-2002, 11:37 AM
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Re: Ge sleeved block. Copper or stainless o-rings?? help?? Jotech or any experienced engine builders
The stainless wire is gonna help alot, i wonder why they even thought of using copper since its so maluable. you need to make sure on the wire you get that it is the right diameter so it will protrude off the deck the right height, are you using a copper head gasket? aslo is your head reciever groved ? the receiver grove in the head will help out big time as it will let the wire in your block have some where to go. if you need the stainless wire i have some at the shop, its high quality stainless we use on our 7 sec pro 5.0 cars. i have a question on a 60-1 turbo, i have decided to not get the T3/T04B , because of the limited capabilities so iam gonna order the 60-1 will i have problems with the standard or should i go with the HIFI model.also what A/R will a .63 be to nasty.???? also what trim size and housing?? let me know
thanks,
Mike
12-09-2002, 01:38 PM
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Re: Ge sleeved block. Copper or stainless o-rings?? help?? Jotech or any experienced engine builders
The GEM o-ring is made to fit 18 gauge copper wire.
12-09-2002, 03:51 PM
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Re: Ge sleeved block. Copper or stainless o-rings?? help?? Jotech or any experienced engine builders
Hi Mike,
When you asked me this weekend about your O-ring wire I had no idea it was copper, I just assumed it was stainless. I apologize, I misunderstood you. The reason why many machine shops use copper is beacause they are hoping that it compresses out and doesn't hold the head up when it has the fire ring from the head gasket sitting on top of it. If the O-ring had dents in it you must replace it. I would replace it with stainless .041 wire if the groove was cut for .041 wire. You must check the depth and width of the groove. The groove should be approx. 75 percent of the wire deep which would leave 25 percent protruding. Usually most copper o-ring wire is .060 thick. Any time you have a dent in any wire it must be replaced. The problem with copper is it is very hard to install for that reason. You have to install copper wire with something softer than the copper. What is good is that the factory head gasket, depending on where the groove is in the block, works perfect with stainless wire and a circular groove. A head gasket that doesn't work with this set-up would be the cometic. The way the cometic wire is within their gasket overlaps unevenly and will not seal. Let me know if you need any wire, I have some in stock. Talk to you soon,
Bob
When you asked me this weekend about your O-ring wire I had no idea it was copper, I just assumed it was stainless. I apologize, I misunderstood you. The reason why many machine shops use copper is beacause they are hoping that it compresses out and doesn't hold the head up when it has the fire ring from the head gasket sitting on top of it. If the O-ring had dents in it you must replace it. I would replace it with stainless .041 wire if the groove was cut for .041 wire. You must check the depth and width of the groove. The groove should be approx. 75 percent of the wire deep which would leave 25 percent protruding. Usually most copper o-ring wire is .060 thick. Any time you have a dent in any wire it must be replaced. The problem with copper is it is very hard to install for that reason. You have to install copper wire with something softer than the copper. What is good is that the factory head gasket, depending on where the groove is in the block, works perfect with stainless wire and a circular groove. A head gasket that doesn't work with this set-up would be the cometic. The way the cometic wire is within their gasket overlaps unevenly and will not seal. Let me know if you need any wire, I have some in stock. Talk to you soon,
Bob
12-09-2002, 05:59 PM
#12
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Re: Ge sleeved block. Copper or stainless o-rings?? help?? Jotech or any experienced engine builders
Hi Mike,
When you asked me this weekend about your O-ring wire I had no idea it was copper, I just assumed it was stainless. I apologize, I misunderstood you. The reason why many machine shops use copper is beacause they are hoping that it compresses out and doesn't hold the head up when it has the fire ring from the head gasket sitting on top of it. If the O-ring had dents in it you must replace it. I would replace it with stainless .041 wire if the groove was cut for .041 wire. You must check the depth and width of the groove. The groove should be approx. 75 percent of the wire deep which would leave 25 percent protruding. Usually most copper o-ring wire is .060 thick. Any time you have a dent in any wire it must be replaced. The problem with copper is it is very hard to install for that reason. You have to install copper wire with something softer than the copper. What is good is that the factory head gasket, depending on where the groove is in the block, works perfect with stainless wire and a circular groove. A head gasket that doesn't work with this set-up would be the cometic. The way the cometic wire is within their gasket overlaps unevenly and will not seal. Let me know if you need any wire, I have some in stock. Talk to you soon,
Bob
When you asked me this weekend about your O-ring wire I had no idea it was copper, I just assumed it was stainless. I apologize, I misunderstood you. The reason why many machine shops use copper is beacause they are hoping that it compresses out and doesn't hold the head up when it has the fire ring from the head gasket sitting on top of it. If the O-ring had dents in it you must replace it. I would replace it with stainless .041 wire if the groove was cut for .041 wire. You must check the depth and width of the groove. The groove should be approx. 75 percent of the wire deep which would leave 25 percent protruding. Usually most copper o-ring wire is .060 thick. Any time you have a dent in any wire it must be replaced. The problem with copper is it is very hard to install for that reason. You have to install copper wire with something softer than the copper. What is good is that the factory head gasket, depending on where the groove is in the block, works perfect with stainless wire and a circular groove. A head gasket that doesn't work with this set-up would be the cometic. The way the cometic wire is within their gasket overlaps unevenly and will not seal. Let me know if you need any wire, I have some in stock. Talk to you soon,
Bob
My o-ring is stainless now.When i got it from GE it was copper and the first time we pulled the head it was smushed. When I sent the block to the machine shop it we redid the o-ring in stainless. I noticed when i pulled th head this time the orings were not competely circular in the head. you could see indentations where it did bite the head and where it didnt. the spots that didnt were lower on the block so i know they werent even. Can your guy re ring it w/o me pulling the motor?? We could probably redo it ourselves chris said but i would rather have it done at a machine shop that has all the tools and gauges necessary to make sure they are in there properly. thanks for any help you can give me on this.
12-09-2002, 06:07 PM
#13
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Re: Ge sleeved block. Copper or stainless o-rings?? help?? Jotech or any experienced engine builders
Ok, copper orings are designed to be used with a steel head gasket. Steel orings are designed to be used with a copper gasket. Anytime i've used steel rings with a steel gasket we've had problems. The oring is supposed to crush into the gasket but it's not the only form of sealing. We use copper orings and stock gaskets with great success. If you use steel rings and a steel gasket it doesn't compress enough and you will usually have sealing problems everywhere else. I'm very surprised yours is working right now. Maybe they aren't coming off the deck very much. How high are they off the deck?
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