BlueShadow

Hi guys,

I was trying to find someway to change my highest vacuum number in CromePRO. I read somewhere that John does not recommend changing the first and last column. I found out why after I started doing that...the numbers go way out of whack.

I was trying to set the first column to read at least 30 in/hg. I tried a bunch of different numbers and see what would randomly come up. For the hell of it I put in 1782 mbar, the same number that was in my last boost column. The number came out the same. I then entered 1800 mbar in the first column and the number randomly changed to -52 mbar 31.36 in/hg!

I then changed it to 1787 and it randomly changed to -59 mbar 31.57 in/hg. changed to 1792, and still -59 mbar. Changed it to 1797 and it randomly went to -52 mbar 31.36in/hg. I went to 1777 in the first column and it changed stayed there as I predicted. I added 59 mbar to 1782 and entered 1841 in the first column again and got -8 mbar 30.07in/hg.

From here it looks like constantly increasing the first columns mbar will make it randomly change to a different value. But the changes aren't so random. You guys remember how I said if you put in 1787 in the first column it will revert to -59? well if you take that 1787 and add 59 + 1787 to it you get 3633. Now put 3633 into the first mbar column and it will revert to 1782 mbar, but if you put in 3640 it will revert to -59. Do you guys see the pattern? It looks like after 1787 for every 1841 mbar (59+1782) you enter into the first mbar cell the number will do a loop into the next cycle. It's hard for me to put into words but there is a pattern there.

is this something new I stumbled upon? not the part about messing with mbar numbers, but about just the first mbar number.

Right now I had my highest vacuum point at column 1 showing -59 mbar and my highest boost point at B16 showing 1782. Since I am running the stock MAP sensor would this cause issues with my fuel tuning? since my first column is -59, should I subtract from my last column so that the same mbar range is being displayed now as before?

TIA

BlueShadow

hey again guys,

I was thinking about something else too. Is it a good or bad idea to modify the vacuum readings at the top of the columns?

For example I changed my vacuum portion of my map. I tok a stock P30 map with boot tools enabled and I took out the 4.36 in/hg column and the fuel numbers beneath it. I then took the fuel numbers fir the cells to the left of it and moved it over to the right. Then I manualy edited the vacuum numbers at the top so everything was moved over one vell to the right.

Now that I've changed the vacuuj m numbers at the top, will my map trace still go to the correct vacuum and RPM cell? for example if I drive my car and hold it at 7-8 in/hg of vacuum will it map trace to column 7 which is where I manually inputed 7.75 in/hg or will it still go to the old column on col 6 even though it says 11.16 in/hg. Cause col 6 is where 7.75 in/hg used to be until I shifted it to the right to col 7.

Here is the new map I made up which has a lower vacuum column at col 1.



And here is the old map before I added started moving stuff around.

adseguy

This has been covered before. Don't mess with the first and last map scalar readings. The ECU uses these 2 as the "limits" for voltage. That's why on a 3 bar map sensor you can change anything you want in the middle, but don't touch the first or last map scalar even if you arn't going to 29PSI. My second to last cloumn is 16 PSI then the last one is 29 PSI. No big deal since I only boost 16 PSI.

BlueShadow

I'm trying to change just the first one though not the last column. So that way it will read vacuum lower then 26.48 in/hg or 114 mbar.

The reason is when I was done tuning my partial throttle AFR's it was at 15:1 for the first 3-4 columns. But I noticed that when cruising around at really high vacuum it would read rich like 12:1. At this point the vacuum was between 30-28 in/hg with very light throttle input. I thought that maybe the reason my really high vacuum AFRs were rich is cause I could not adjust fuel from 31 in/hg to 28 in/hg. So by putting that vacuum column in the map I'll be able to adjust the fuel for that vacuum column.

A few hours ago I replaced Boost Tools+ with the Advanced Boost Tools script that Mind-Eracer wrote. It looked like once I had the advanced boost tools installed I didn't have to mess around with the first column vacuum number like I did before. If you put in 10 mbar in there it will put down 10 mbar, instead of some other number.

EE_Chris

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by adseguy &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">This has been covered before. Don't mess with the first and last map scalar readings. The ECU uses these 2 as the "limits" for voltage. That's why on a 3 bar map sensor you can change anything you want in the middle, but don't touch the first or last map scalar even if you arn't going to 29PSI. My second to last cloumn is 16 PSI then the last one is 29 PSI. No big deal since I only boost 16 PSI.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Is this a limitation with only Crome? Or also Uberdata too? Kinda sucks you loose a 1/16 of your resolution if you're not boosting up near 29lbs.

adseguy

Yeah it's for both. I did a write-up for it http://uberdata.pgmfi.org/foru...=3494

You cannot change the first and last ones. These are used for references for 0-5volts. If change this your entire map will be off. Just leave those alone. How are you getting 30"? That's B-A-N-A-N-A-S! Is this confirmed on your boost gauge, or just datalogging?

BlueShadow

It's on my boost gauge. It's it's somewhere above 26 in/hg, probably 27 or 28 in/hg, that's what my gauge reads.

adseguy, When I made my initial discovery on the first post I noticed that changing just the first mbar number and not the last mbar would change the range of the map sensor. it would go from a 1.7 bar to something like a 1.8 bar. I thought about changing the first mbar number from 114 to 1 and then subtracting 113-114 from the last mbar number. That way there is still 1.7 bar being covered by the whole fuel map, but I dont know if this would work.

EE_Chris,

Mind_Eracer on the Crome forums just created a new advanced script that give the boost tables a lot more resulution. Before there were only 7 columns as seen on the pics I posted above. But with the new advanced boost tools you can have as many as 15 <u>user defined</u> boost columns or breakpoints. The vacuum columns can also be user defined. So you can increase or decrease the amount of resolution in the vacuum or boost columns as you see fit. I would post a pic of newer maps, but just picture a 20 x 24 (rpm x load) map. I'm pretty excited about it...I cant wait to get my car up and running so I can try it out.

EDIT: also if you decide that 15 boost columns is too much, you can select just 7 like before, or you can choose to have 9, 11, or 13 boost coluns or 15 like I was talking about earlier.

nfn15037

Mind-Eraser's new Advanced Boost tools r0cks!

adseguy

yeah 20x20 tables ROCK!......faster spool times because of better resolution and better overall power. I think Crome is the only one to do this and for that big a . Crome is def. looking better by the minute, but tha $150 price tag is killer to my <u>CHEAP</U> ***

BlueShadow

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by adseguy &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">yeah 20x20 tables ROCK!......faster spool times because of better resolution and better overall power. I think Crome is the only one to do this and for that big a . Crome is def. looking better by the minute, but tha $150 price tag is killer to my <u>CHEAP</U> *** </TD></TR></TABLE>

20x24

It's definately a huge leap forward for Crome. If auto-tune or Live auto-tune could be perfected, then that would be another huge leap forward.

adseguy

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by BlueShadow &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
Live auto-tune</TD></TR></TABLE>

you are making me drool....lol. It would put a lot of street tuners out of business, but it would be awesome

nfn15037

I dont't have any troubles with the lambda logging/auto tune feature of Crome.

dustin

I've never seen "live auto-tune" work right anywhere. Not in AEM, not in hondata....

nfn15037

Well I should have phrased differently: it works as well as any others. It still requires a 'tuner' to be present, so in that sense it is not full auto tune. It is, however, very good and the data filtering is great.

dustin

Actually allowing the "auto-tune" to update your map results in a really ugly fuel map... hehe.

BlueShadow

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by dustin &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I've never seen "live auto-tune" work right anywhere. Not in AEM, not in hondata.... </TD></TR></TABLE>

Doesn't the Autronic auto tune work pretty well?

dustin

I've not used Autronic personally. So it might...

MindEracer

iTrader: (1)

Blue shadow I think your looking at this the wrong way, U should be looking at your gear correction. That's what will solve your problem . I think blundy said something in your post on pgmfi.org..
Be carefull with what your doing..Not sure the end result will be what you want.
NICE, sceen shots
FYI, IAT correction will be a new feature in crome soon

BlueShadow

I haven't messed with gear correction yet, and I wont be able to mess with Crome and my car for a while. When my car is running again though I will give it a look.

nfn15037

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by dustin &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Actually allowing the "auto-tune" to update your map results in a really ugly fuel map... hehe.</TD></TR></TABLE>

It does? From my own personal experience it works pretty well. Like I said, it isn't 100% auto hence still needing a tuner, but it helps speed the tuning process tremendously.

Txdragon

Last post prior to yours in this thread is only 2 weeks older than my daughter. Lol!

These_upgrades

hhahaha yeah it’s 3 years older than me 😂😂 I hate how development just came to a stop at like 2005 nothing truly new has come out since

JRCivic1

Well, engine management evolved. WAAAYY better choices have been created during that time.

How do you feel about tube TV's and Rotary Telephones ?

Txdragon

HAAAAAHAHAHAAAA!!! How about VHS and cassettes?

highschooler

Chrome and Neptune are knock offs of Hondata as far as I know. I recommend using actual Hondata. I think it’s worth spending the $500 or so. I haven’t used chrome or Neptune, however I was pleased with Hondata. My last turbo car put out over 300whp and was tuned in a few hours with no tuning problems at all. It drove good for years after that. I never messed with that one tune. I got it professionally done by Jason “StOOpid” Herrera in Houston Texas. I might look him up again for my next tune this summer/fall. I don’t know if he’s still tuning, but I saw a TV show with him on it last summer, no joke. A car he tuned did 900horsepower!. So I think he’s high up on the tuning software and is experienced.