Mr. Chainsaw

I just got a phone call from my tuner, that he is having issues with my car.
i've got a stock bore b16, built head, gsr cams, 9:1 JE pistons, victor x intake, ramhorn exhaust, 50trim turbo, 440 jectors and using hondatas200. he is saying on 10psi he is only able to get 200whp out of it. says it runs great, not missing, oil pressure is good. he is a very reputable tuner so i'm not doubting his abilities. I just dont know how it is even possible to make that low of a number. I was expecting every bit of 300. where are my other 100 horses at? anyone have any kind of idea or had this happen to them before? he did say that he was having problems getting vtec to work, which i found very odd considering i've got a jdm vtec solenoid (no oil pressure sensor in it) so it should kick on whenever its told no matter what. i'm just out of ideas.

digital sol

iTrader: (1)

no vtec=lower numbers

...fix your vtec issue and get it back on the dyno..numbers will be much better...i cant remember off hand but if your using a jdm motor without the vtec pressure switch you"ll need to ground that wire before you can just "set it" to activate using your fuel management...i had this issue with a jdm type r swap and hondata...vtec pressure switch wire had to be grounded before i could edit the engagements in hondata...its been a while but something to look into...

ps..your in st.louis..who is tuning it?

please tell me not adrenaline..if so remove your car from that shop before you are left with a paper weight...

Mr. Chainsaw

that's the thing, i've never had a vtec issue at all and i've had this switch for coming on 2 years now. he said vtec is kicking in now, its just not making any power. and **** no its not adrenaline, the shop is in illinois

digital sol

iTrader: (1)

hmm, ha glad to hear john @ loweperf is tuning it..heard good things about him just havnt got mine out there for tuning yet....

if it wasnt working and magically is now working id point towards maybe a bad ground somewhere?

what fuel management are you running?

this an ebay turbo?

duty cycle of injectors?

im my experiences vtec has only not worked for me when either A-i was low on oil, or b- when i first did the engine swap because it was a 96+ jdm motor which does not have a vtec pressure switch, and was using a chipped 28 with hondata which was looking for a switch that did not exist thus throwing code 22. I simply had to just take the VTEC pressure signal wire (D6) using the ECU side of the wire tap it into the VTEC solenoid signal wire (A4)

But considering this was not an issue prior to today it is obviously not the case

Speed_1

you are going to be pushing it with 440 injectors

hybrdthry911

dyno graphs would help. just because the ecu tells the solenoid to energize doesnt mean that the cams are engagine maybe its a mechanical issue or an oiling issue. ive seen vtec not engage for many reasons. there is a plug under the intake cam i forgot to put in last time and vtec wouldnt engage lol.

what ems are you using? ive seen corrupted files cause massive power drops as well. ask your tuner if he has tried starting with a brand new file just to test it.

perseverance

a jdm vtec solenoid works just like a usdm. the oil pressure sensor on the usdm vtec solenoid is just a precaution for the ecu, that way if the oil is low then vtec won't engage. if you're using a usdm ecu it will still look for an oil pressure sensor, and you'll have to bypass it.

turbociv910

was your head recently assembeled? ive seen some of the pins fall out and cuase vtec problems

exhaust leaks pre turbo?

viper_boy403

iTrader: (1)

what size exhaust are you running? Is the wastegate dumping to atmosphere or rerouted into the exhaust?

Mr. Chainsaw

the oil switch has been tuned out 2 years ago.

head was not recently assembled.

running hondatas200

vtec worked when i dropped it off just fine

running 2.5" open downpipe, no leaks, atmosphere dump

viper_boy403

iTrader: (1)

what is the graph looking like? Is power dropping off early?

What intake setup do you have, just straight filter on the turbo, no filter, or some sort of intake tube?

A plain 50 trim is a really small turbo, I bet it's just too tiny. Just for kicks I looked up a turbonetics 50 trim and it's only good to 250hp
http://www.turbo-kits.com/t3t4_turbochargers.html

TheShodan

iTrader: (14)

^^. If this is the standard 52mm inducer 74.76mm exducer "50" trim, then it is very capable of over 380whp or so. there are definitely some issues

viper_boy403

iTrader: (1)

good to know, thanks for the correction

quicksilver1689

seems like the basics need to be covered, first you believe the tuner to know what he is doing. good start. One of the first things to start with is the wastegate dump, there have been quite a few people on ht that had similar problems, basically wastegate dumping inert air back into the turbo, think of a giant EGR. what is a ramhorn exhaust? 200whp @10psi ask him what the afr and timing was around that range.

Mr. Chainsaw

well, i'm goin up there in about 7 hours to see what the deal is, i figure i'll give him half the day to mess with it and if nothing comes about, i'll just take the car as it is and bring it home myself and try to figure it out. i'll update later

Mr. Chainsaw

16 ATDC afr at 11.8

EsotericImage

iTrader: (8)

with 9:1 pistons.. i would def turn up the boost a little just to see what the engine is doing..

If your boosting 12 or 14 and the graph shows great gains, then u know.. If its still struggling, then theres def something wrong.

Also, i would goto 12.3- 12.5 AFR and run a tad lean to see how it reacts.


Edit: that is one smooth line! good job whoever tuned it.

wantboost

iTrader: (2)

that sounds about right for a 50trim @ 10psi... bottom end is built, turn up the boost...

Mr. Chainsaw

its running pig rich at driving speeds, if i'm at a stop light for an extended amount of time i really have to pump the pedal to get it to stop bogging. and every once in a while if i'm on it hard and shift it starts breaking up

HiProfile

Maybe the oil passages are clogged, and now it's only one cam switching over. The guy that machined my engine parts does only Hondas, and said the majority of heads he gets have scaring around the cams from junk shot through the head. Too much junk = vtec pins don't move to enable the rocker arms & vtec.

My current SOHC was originally making 189whp on a uber-conservative timing (misfiring due to firing so late) and a home-made sinktrap manifold. 8:1cr & stock head. I knew that was the issue when my tuner friend said he's seen the same issue. I've also seen a stock b16 with a 50trim T3 (not t3/t4) make 242whp with an VAFC hack, so the motor & turbo are more than capible.



So I'd be willing to bet it's vtec not working 100% in your case. If not, take a cue from my original timing issue - decrease plug gap to .020", and if that helps just add timing (and regap to compensate).

95civhb

x2..

Mr. Chainsaw

so take off the vtec solenoid and clean it out?

hybrdthry911

you could start with cleaning the screen on the solenoid but it might be a passage elsewhere. these are all just shots in the dark though very tough to say over the internet.