Balor_Gr

Anyone knows something about them? Little data about them online.
I found realstreetperformance post on the subi forum saying they went 1000+ 11000 with them on a honda.
Any data? I can find them with 625+ 150 euros cheaper from manley TT with 625+
The rod looks nice but BC parts are iffy some times thats why am asking. They also look identical to the CROWER steel billet i-beam.Probably the same rod?
Any results on them?

AZ_CIVIC

iTrader: (1)

I know you were asking questions about this before, why not contact a reputable engine builder and explain to them what you are doing and what they suggest? I specifically use Locash Racing/TSR for my engine builds because not only do they do everything in house but have one of the fastest cars in the country.

Guys like that can suggest proper parts for builds since they do it everyday, doing Google searches and asking random people gets you a thousand different answers. If I were you I would contact some good engine builders and explain what you are doing and what they suggest and go from there. Just my 2 cense

Oh and for my specific builds I ALWAYS overbuild just to be safe, I've done this too long to skimp on any parts because in the long run it is cheaper to spend a little extra in the beginning.

TheShodan

iTrader: (14)

I have to agree with my colleague here. That's something that a reputable builder could answer. (At least one that is reputable building these kinds of engines). Especially with the specifics of the +625 that you're asking about. I tend to overbuild as well, but not so much as the rod bolts, unless I'm doing a specific type of racing, in which that motorsport will determine the likelihood of whether or not I'll use those smaller upgrades.

Locash
Evans Tuning
RLZ
4Piston etc.

Balor_Gr

I agree with both you guys but because i also run a small business and i dont want to spend other buseness man's time without getting money from me since im located in Greece.
I also like and will overbuild since i like to hit my staff hard but i dont overuse all the time like morrons.
On the other hand i might want to hit the strip later thats why ill get at least simple H-beams with 625+.
The arp2000 is comfortable with me on b16 on 9500 with average weight rods since its perfect on piston acceleration and rod stroke ratio.
On the 1.54 r/s ratio much bigger torque much higher piston acceleration(and decceleration).
Id never use the heavy rods (Ibeams etc) on 9000++ rpm with the arp2000 bolts on B20 setup. Its just me,.. fear of the poor geometry AND large forces.
Id still use it on the very very nice weight carrillo pro-h beams each beam is like 50grams lighter from the i beams x-beam.

Chance EG

Everyone eventually either fails or learns this lesson. I definitely learned it the hard way a few years ago on my first major project.

TheShodan

iTrader: (14)

I guess, being conservative helps to keep that lesson at bay far longer than the risk takers, but I definitely see your point.

Balor_Gr

What im trying to say is since there is no clear border at when you should upgrade the pins to 625, in my opinion say for the most times its earlier from the rods.
I may be mistaken but i believe since we like to run our engines AT LEAST 9000, most h-beam failures are by the arp2000 saying "noooo" at the TDC on the exhaust stroke deceleration.
But thats just a theory.
EDIT I added the calculation on different forces based on rod stroke ratio on zealautowerks.
If you want to have the same force on the decel on the rod/bolt/piston pin a B16 has on 9700 rpm on your LSVTEC you must have
revlimit of 8900.
If you want 9700 on the LSVTEC you must have 20% strongest rod/bolt combo, if your piston/rod/bolt has the same weight.

TheShodan

iTrader: (14)

Yeah, no. Those of us really experienced will make slightly more rpm than the the peak amount of power made. We don'
really do AT LEAST 9000rpms "just 'cuz". We're not all drag racing. So, you have to look at your utility and be objective and realistic.

But if it's for your purpose, rock on! 10,000rpm!

Balor_Gr

What im trying to say is rpm per rpm on the same combo weight you allways need 15-20% stronger rod/bolt not accounting the extra torque thats it.
After i compared all this stuff and european cars with smaller turbo MUCH bigger torque compared to final hp number yes in my mind its the arp2000
that goes first.
Friend's 1.6L PSA engine hit 550lbft torque on 300 hp tiny turbo. Other 1,8l VW engines crazy torque numbers like 650lbft. All fine at classic h-beams with arp2000
and no rod failure. That huge torque on the cheap h-beams/arp2000.
Once they try the honda way of big turbo big peak number that requires high rpm for powerband you see failures start more and more.
Even on the same torque. Thats why im theorising that rpm on our engines "hits" the bols harder than we hit the torque margin of the rod.
I wont go crazy above 9000. Max like 9100-9200.

AZ_CIVIC

iTrader: (1)

9000 Rpms is not that high honestly, I ran Manley Turbo Tuff rods for 5 years at 10,500 RPMS before a rod bearing failed during a pass and took the block out.

Really, if you are worried about it just spend the money and buy the Turbo Tuff rods with the 625+ upgrade and you won't have to worry.

TheShodan

iTrader: (14)

Correct. I just wanted Balor_Gr to stipulate that being realistic about the rpm level that he's using didn't warrant the upgrade despite the great math and piston speeds he presented.. But peace of mind and personal choice are another matter, altogether.

If he wants to feel better by putting +625 bolts in, great, by all means, do so with confidence. But do it for your own reasons, not go through all the muck of trying to get us to help convince yourself of your own decision that you have already made. It's ok, no one judges you here, you're in the right path regardless.
Life is good... :-)

AZ_CIVIC

iTrader: (1)

Exactly, it's one of those cases where people already make the decision but want others to support what they are thinking LOL. I say for the couple hundred extra dollars if it makes you sleep better at night go for it.

Balor_Gr

Yes no prob. life is good yeah.I hope i manage to finish the sol before they call me to fight Turkey haha. Erdogan is holding the WW3 button this time.

Yeah now that you tell, i just realised that. hahhaha
It still itches me to get the BC's for no particular reason over turbotuff but ill fight it. haha

TheShodan

iTrader: (14)

I wouldn't play around with Brian Crower at all. If you want peace of mind, get the Turbo Tuff from the beginning... Not booty around with just the rod bolts.

Balor_Gr

hahaha yeah i know i removed it from my mind by force.