DragWerks

Stock 89' 1st Gen B16A Head & Cams
Stock 98' B20B Block
Stock 99 Si Intake Manifold
ARP Headstuds
2.5" Downpipe, 2.25" Exhaust (no cat), OEM Style Muffler
T3/T04B Turbo (.63 hotside, stg 2)
450cc (Maxed out), Walbro 255, Crome, Stock Map
BKR7E (1 stage colder) plugs, .028
~15psi with a couple psi creep around 7300rpm
10 deg total timing on vtec side
91 Octane

(Blue line is VTEC map, Red line is Non-VTEC map)





"B20 sleeves are weak"


Modified by DragWerks at 1:47 AM 10/27/2007

primetime

congrats on rockin stock sleeves that is awesome! I need to get my car on the dyno to get some numbers, I have pretty much the same setup.

0xenocron

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by primetime &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">congrats on rockin stock sleeves that is awesome! I need to get my car on the dyno to get some numbers, I have pretty much the same setup.</TD></TR></TABLE>

I would expect a little more out of a setup like that.

And those 450cc injectors must be SCREAMING...be preparred for one of them to lock up and make things ugly.

Get bigger injectors

blackeg

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by xenocron &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

I would expect a little more out of a setup like that.

And those 450cc injectors must be SCREAMING...be preparred for one of them to lock up and make things ugly.

Get bigger injectors </TD></TR></TABLE>


yeah please get bigger injectors.

air fuel looks very good, but i think you can add more timing up top. 10 degrees total at around 15 psi isnt a lot, and it could be why your graph kinda stops gaining around 7500ish

red_crx

iTrader: (2)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by blackeg &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">


yeah please get bigger injectors.

air fuel looks very good, but i think you can add more timing up top. 10 degrees total at around 15 psi isnt a lot, and it could be why your graph kinda stops gaining around 7500ish</TD></TR></TABLE>
even with the adding timing, more than likely, his power would still start to drop off ; Its those b16 cams

blackeg

^^^ overlooked the b16 cams. yah man get something more aggressive, **** even gsr cams

ghostskinner

what wastegate is that

VTEC_PRODUCTION

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by ghostskinner &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">what wastegate is that</TD></TR></TABLE>

ebay

DragWerks

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by xenocron &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

I would expect a little more out of a setup like that.

</TD></TR></TABLE>

I did too... Small cams, small turbo, small intake mani, small exhaust... Not Good for Big power. I also think a set of adj. cam gears would have really woke this motor up.


<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by blackeg &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

air fuel looks very good, but i think you can add more timing up top. 10 degrees total at around 15 psi isnt a lot, and it could be why your graph kinda stops gaining around 7500ish</TD></TR></TABLE>

Nothing against you but it's amazing how many (well known and aspiring) tuners think like this. Even though timing is always paired with boost (i.e. 1 deg per psi retard), it's not a direct correlation. Total timing is more dependent on your engine characteristics than your boost level. To all you aspiring tuners (and a lot of so called veterans), DO NOT think "x amount timing is good for x psi". It doesn't work like that. Find MBT - 10 deg. was MBT on this motor, anything less took away power, more timing did nothing. Tune for MBT and learn to read plugs and amaze your buddys with the insane amounts of power your motors will handle reliably.

blackeg

its cool i dont take any offense.

i just said that because you can often throw a little advance back into the timing map past max tq, as the cyl pressures are a little bit lower. if you tuned for mbt and kept checking plugs and the tq curve while trying different timing settings, then thats the best tune and stick with it.

i guess i would say that i was expecting to see higher timing, by no means that you should add more. my judgements were derived from my tuning of my motor, also an 84mm vtec.

now lets get some track times

DragWerks

^^ I'll be at fontana speedway tomorrow

b16a4

thanks for the tuning tip

so add timing until max power is reached
back off if it makes no more power

blackeg

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by b16a4 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">thanks for the tuning tip

so add timing until max power is reached
back off if it makes no more power</TD></TR></TABLE>

torque really. search up mbt.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by DragWerks &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">^^ I'll be at fontana speedway tomorrow </TD></TR></TABLE>

let us know how it goes. damn you people who live warm places with all year tracks haha

b16a4

pardon my ignorance but what is MBT
lol

blundar

I made 395whp / ? tq on a B20 with rods and pistons and it lasted for quite a few 11 second quarter mile passes and a lot of street tuning. XS power top mount @14 creep to 18psi

I made 454whp / ? tq on the same setup at 24psi. I also neglected to pay attention to injector duty cycle (650cc maxed out) and the motor grenaded in about 2 weeks. The owner wanted to blow it up so he had an excuse to pull it and put in a faster motor for next season anyways.

B20 sleeves are a LOT stronger than people give them credit for.

Minor Threat

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by blundar &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">B20 sleeves are a LOT stronger than people give them credit for.</TD></TR></TABLE>

People used to think all the other D and B sleeves were weak too, I think the reason people still think B20's are weak is the fact that not a lot of people run them.

SOHC_MShue

Check out this vid of a stock block b20vtec i tuned. Still holding up strong and he beats on the car way more than necessary every single day . I agree with everyone. B20 sleeves are stronger than people think.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=IIjxkDc-M2U

JALOP B16

So did you go to Fontana?

clayfight3r

Damn that's really impressive. Might consider this build for future set-up! Awesome!

DragWerks

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by JALOP B16 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">So did you go to Fontana?</TD></TR></TABLE>

Yeah, car ran great I just kept missing gears. I missed 3rd all 3 runs.

14.0 on bald street tires (missed 3rd) with 2.3 60ft at 107mph

14.0 on 22x8's with a 1.8 60ft (couldn't get into 3rd at all) - don't remember mph...

bad day