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Discussion Topic: Tell us about your favorite turbocharger and why

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Old 03-20-2017, 04:40 AM   #101
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Default Re: Discussion Topic: Tell us about your favorite turbocharger and why

On the whole Precision vs. Garrett... i remember people having trouble with Precision long ago. they'd buy a turbo, barely have 5 minutes of run time on it and then something is jacked up. this is on like a baller v8 drag build, and due to construction it was like 2-3 years since initial purchase and the turbo didn't last at all. customers were furious...

come few years later, suddenly 6262 was all the rage and i saw import people make huge power with them but on the back of my head i was always very cautious thinking hmm, i remember reading about Precision not being reliable at all....

what about Turbonetics turbo's? from reading Turbo & Hi-Tech back in the days lot of fast v8 cars were always breaking records on their turbo. Ken Duttweiler comes to mind with the Grand Nationals... haven't seen their stuff in a while so i just google them.


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Old 03-20-2017, 06:07 AM   #102
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Default Re: Discussion Topic: Tell us about your favorite turbocharger and why

Well. I guess you hadn't really kept up with what's been going on the past couple of years regarding both Turbonetics & PTE. To sum up quickly, they're basically one company now. They were acquired by a locomotive conglomerate called Wabtec. First it was Turbonetics back in 2013, and this past November PTE was acquired.

There is some information about how the new things will turn out, but honestly, it's more speculative than ever, so, many of us on this particular thread decided not to put that kind of attention here. That's for another thread to be created to go into that. You're more than welcome to start one if you'd like. If you wouldn't mind, the topic was about a specific turbocharger that one liked and why. Not a particular company, or discussion of its politics, etc. We're trying to stick with that for now.

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Old 03-20-2017, 06:27 AM   #103
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Default Re: Discussion Topic: Tell us about your favorite turbocharger and why

hmm getting bought by a powerful company resources is not always a bad thing. in this case it looks promising. i stopped by Dinan Engineering (BMW tuner) recently and learned that Steve Dinan's company is now owned by the same company that owns Flowmasters (among other brands). it's called DP Brands... with their backing Dinan is putting in big time R&D and i got a tour and i was quite impressed. 30k facility dedicated to R&D and their parts matched by OEM warranty. pretty big time stuff. of course their stuff are tuned on the conservative side by majority of consumer wants that peace of mind.

Last edited by TheShodan; 03-20-2017 at 06:59 AM. Reason: Yep.. we keep it strictly to the Tech in this forum.. WE STICK TO THE DISCUSSIONS
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Old 03-20-2017, 06:49 AM   #104
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Default Re: Discussion Topic: Tell us about your favorite turbocharger and why

Right now my favorite would be the PTE 6870. I feel that this is the perfect mix between not too small and not too big but an excellent mid size turbo that can hang with the bigger turbo's out there. It is said to support 1100whp and the pricing is not too bad as well, depending on who you get it from and "hook" up prices around $2200 to $2500.

I think this turbo is a good 8.5 or 8.60 turbo for sure.
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Old 03-20-2017, 07:04 AM   #105
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Default Re: Discussion Topic: Tell us about your favorite turbocharger and why

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hmm getting bought by a powerful company resources is not always a bad thing. in this case it looks promising. i stopped by Dinan Engineering (BMW tuner) recently and learned that Steve Dinan's company is now owned by the same company that owns Flowmasters (among other brands). it's called DP Brands... with their backing Dinan is putting in big time R&D and i got a tour and i was quite impressed. 30k facility dedicated to R&D and their parts matched by OEM warranty. pretty big time stuff. of course their stuff are tuned on the conservative side by majority of consumer wants that peace of mind.
To end this part of the politics of the discussion. What I've noticed is that many of the companies that are absorbing / acquiring smaller ventures are mainly because the original owners are getting a little long in the tooth and basically want to retire. The acquiring company just wants the name/recognition that the smaller company had taken years to establish and expand upon the brand they've created. Meanwhile the original owners/shareholders get to step down with money in their pockets. Which is what many smaller ventures feel that they should do to walk away on a positive note, so no, you're right, it's not a bad thing..

The aftermarket industry can be fickle at times, and it's difficult to keep up with ever-changing demand by coming up with new formulas of investment to gamble on just to stay with that demand. Who's to blame them?

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Old 03-20-2017, 07:08 AM   #106
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Default Re: Discussion Topic: Tell us about your favorite turbocharger and why

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Right now my favorite would be the PTE 6870. I feel that this is the perfect mix between not too small and not too big but an excellent mid size turbo that can hang with the bigger turbo's out there. It is said to support 1100whp and the pricing is not too bad as well, depending on who you get it from and "hook" up prices around $2200 to $2500.

I think this turbo is a good 8.5 or 8.60 turbo for sure.
I love how you call an 1100HP unit a "perfect mix between too big and too small". Drag racing units sure has changed in its expectations lately. I love how technology has it to a point where you can say something like that with confidence. Tell us more about what it is you like about this... I'm curious to know, as a non-drag-racer.

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Old 03-20-2017, 08:01 AM   #107
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Default Re: Discussion Topic: Tell us about your favorite turbocharger and why

Well I guess I can explain what I mean between perfect combination of not too small and not too big from my point of view. I was talking from a drag racers perspective looking to make pretty big numbers, not the average street racer looking to make peak power at 6500RPMs. For a good amount of time now I have seen a lot of guys who want to run FWD automatically jump to a 72mm turbo hoping that it would be a solution. In the past few years I have seen what a lot of these smaller turbochargers have been capable of especially 62mm turbos.

Now I have stated that I have seen an off the shelf PTE 6266 make over 1000whp and always get the no way, it's the dyno, it's manipulation etc. etc. Yet that same turbo laid down an 8.49 @ 175mph pass in Phoenix Arizona of all places. Now obviously this is not your typical car but it does set the bar on what a turbo like this is capable of with the right combinations of parts. I mean there are a lot of 72mm car that struggle to get into the 8's. I would put money that if this Integra makes it out to World Cup, with how good track prep is, DA's being in the negative numbers, running 50 to 60 degree temps, this car is good for 8.3's.

Now onto why I like the PTE 6870. Now of course not all of us can have a badass setup like Locash LOL. Guys like me who want to run 8's with my setup probably can't do it on a 6266 but at the same time I don't want to run a big old 72mm turbo either. If I were to run a 72mm turbo I would want to run the PTE 7285 but wasn't ready to drop the $4,000. Now I tried the Garrett 67mm turbo and made 860whp which was a surprise since I made more on the Garrett 62mm turbo.

Anyways, I heard some good reviews on the 6870 from some Subaru and Mitsubishi guys saying it was a powerful turbo yet it was a pretty quick spooling turbo for the size. So I went ahead and ordered the 6870 and literally all I did was take the 67 off and put the 6870 on and boom made 1042whp.

So bam gained almost 200whp
For the size of the turbo it spools up pretty quick
It carried power all the way up
I like the fin design
I like the size of the turbo, especially for fitment purposes - Didn't have to cut anything to make it fit.
So far it has carried me into 8.8's and my big goal this year is to get it in the 8.6's
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Old 03-20-2017, 09:45 AM   #108
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Default Re: Discussion Topic: Tell us about your favorite turbocharger and why

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Well I guess I can explain what I mean between perfect combination of not too small and not too big from my point of view. I was talking from a drag racers perspective looking to make pretty big numbers, not the average street racer looking to make peak power at 6500RPMs.
Well, you're right. This is specifically from a drag racer's perspective. Honestly, the average street car likes making peak torque before 6000rpms. When it comes to power, they really don't know what to do with it at that rpm level anyway. They usually want the "stop-light-to-stop-light" higher torque-to-weight ratio and fast acceleration rate. You're on a whole new level from them with this description.

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Now onto why I like the PTE 6870. Now of course not all of us can have a badass setup like Locash LOL. Guys like me who want to run 8's with my setup probably can't do it on a 6266 but at the same time I don't want to run a big old 72mm turbo either. If I were to run a 72mm turbo I would want to run the PTE 7285 but wasn't ready to drop the $4,000.
Well, you of all people know that when you're at that type of 1/4mile level, sometimes $4,000 is what it's going to take to do that. Now, since I'm sure the 6870 is much less than that, the fact remains that the higher-than-average level of investment is needed in order to reach those E.Ts. To think you can do it, and not have to pay the cost is naive thinking, wouldn't you agree?

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Now I tried the Garrett 67mm turbo and made 860whp which was a surprise since I made more on the Garrett 62mm turbo.
Ahh. Be careful. Be specific When you use words like "The Garrett 62mm turbo" or "The Garrett 67mm turbo." When you say that you're implying that its an off-shelf unit that is from Honeywell-Turbo Technologies like a GTW series or GTX. Not from what you're describing that's available from an aftermarket company. You know there's a difference, so, yes, you need to acknowledge that what you're describing is not really what most here would consider to be "Off-shelf". It may be off-shelf from that company, but it's not off-shelf from Garrett. See the difference? . I just didn't want you to confuse this for others that are reading your responses, that's all. I'm not giving you any ****, really..

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Originally Posted by AZ_CIVIC View Post
Anyways, I heard some good reviews on the 6870 from some Subaru and Mitsubishi guys saying it was a powerful turbo yet it was a pretty quick spooling turbo for the size. So I went ahead and ordered the 6870 and literally all I did was take the 67 off and put the 6870 on and boom made 1042whp.

So bam gained almost 200whp
For the size of the turbo it spools up pretty quick
It carried power all the way up
I like the fin design
I like the size of the turbo, especially for fitment purposes - Didn't have to cut anything to make it fit.
So far it has carried me into 8.8's and my big goal this year is to get it in the 8.6's
Nice reasoning! Now, THAT makes sense.
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Old 03-20-2017, 12:48 PM   #109
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Default Re: Discussion Topic: Tell us about your favorite turbocharger and why

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Well, you're right. This is specifically from a drag racer's perspective. Honestly, the average street car likes making peak torque before 6000rpms. When it comes to power, they really don't know what to do with it at that rpm level anyway. They usually want the "stop-light-to-stop-light" higher torque-to-weight ratio and fast acceleration rate. You're on a whole new level from them with this description.



Well, you of all people know that when you're at that type of 1/4mile level, sometimes $4,000 is what it's going to take to do that. Now, since I'm sure the 6870 is much less than that, the fact remains that the higher-than-average level of investment is needed in order to reach those E.Ts. To think you can do it, and not have to pay the cost is naive thinking, wouldn't you agree?



Ahh. Be careful. Be specific When you use words like "The Garrett 62mm turbo" or "The Garrett 67mm turbo." When you say that you're implying that its an off-shelf unit that is from Honeywell-Turbo Technologies like a GTW series or GTX. Not from what you're describing that's available from an aftermarket company. You know there's a difference, so, yes, you need to acknowledge that what you're describing is not really what most here would consider to be "Off-shelf". It may be off-shelf from that company, but it's not off-shelf from Garrett. See the difference? . I just didn't want you to confuse this for others that are reading your responses, that's all. I'm not giving you any ****, really..



Nice reasoning! Now, THAT makes sense.
As far as off the shelf I wasn't describing my Garrett turbo chargers, I was describing the PTE 6266 which was an off the shelf unit that anyone can buy that was on Locash's Integra. My Garrett Turbo's utilized Turbo Directs billet wheel designs in order to make additional power.

Now as far as running the times I am running, it isn't too sophisticated or actually hard to do. There are a couple factors that make my car what it is..
PPG Gearset
Motec M400 Not even an M800/880 or M1 stuff
Tuner.

My block actually isn't anything special, I see a lot of guys with just as simple of a setup. I don't have custom pistons, no custom aluminum rods
84mm Golden Eagle Sleeved Block
Off the shelf 9:1 CP pistons I ordered from Real Street Performance. Nothing Custom
Off the shelf Manley Turbo Tuff steel rods I ordered from Real Street Performance. Nothing Custom no special coating, no special lengths.
GSR Crank
Stock Oil Pump, Water Pump
ACL Bearings.

My head when I ran an 8.93
Ported and Polished head
Stock Size Ferrea Intake and Exhaust Valves
Ferrea 80lb Valve Springs and titanium retainers
Skunk2 Pro 1 cams
Edelbrock Victor X with a Blox 76mm throttle body.

Comp Twin Disk
Off the shelf PTE 6870
Used Top Mount Manifold by Boost Junkyz
Just got DSS 5.9 axles 4 months ago.

So honestly I am not running any high dollar setup minus Motec and PPG gearset. Those are the two big ticket items for my car. I am just lucky enough to have Joe tuning my car and being able to tune the thing to handle to power we though at it.
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Old 03-20-2017, 02:45 PM   #110
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Default Re: Discussion Topic: Tell us about your favorite turbocharger and why

Well. that's fine. this was more about the turbocharger itself than the full monty of parts. I'm sure you know what you're doing. Any other turbochargers that are comparable that would tickle your fancy? Or are you strictly a PTE man after your encounter with the Garrett line over the last year or two?
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Old 03-20-2017, 04:07 PM   #111
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Default Re: Discussion Topic: Tell us about your favorite turbocharger and why

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Well. that's fine. this was more about the turbocharger itself than the full monty of parts. I'm sure you know what you're doing. Any other turbochargers that are comparable that would tickle your fancy? Or are you strictly a PTE man after your encounter with the Garrett line over the last year or two?
Well I used Garrett turbos for 10 years always on my street setups and ran my first 9 with a Garrett t3t61 ptrim turbo. I like Garrett turbos, they are reliable and make power. As far as any other Garrett turbos recommend me a Garrett turbo that would make 1100 plus whp and I will gladly look into it.
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Old 03-20-2017, 06:47 PM   #112
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Default Re: Discussion Topic: Tell us about your favorite turbocharger and why

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Well I used Garrett turbos for 10 years always on my street setups and ran my first 9 with a Garrett t3t61 ptrim turbo. I like Garrett turbos, they are reliable and make power. As far as any other Garrett turbos recommend me a Garrett turbo that would make 1100 plus whp and I will gladly look into it.
X2

I'd love to see what he'd recommend for a all out drag car!
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Old 03-21-2017, 07:34 AM   #113
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Default Re: Discussion Topic: Tell us about your favorite turbocharger and why

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Well I used Garrett turbos for 10 years always on my street setups and ran my first 9 with a Garrett t3t61 ptrim turbo. I like Garrett turbos, they are reliable and make power. As far as any other Garrett turbos recommend me a Garrett turbo that would make 1100 plus whp and I will gladly look into it.
I will do just that, sir.. I will say, so far I'm impressed with the GEN II GTX series, ( a little late coming to market, in my opinion). But I'm just glad they put some real work in this line up. Too bad the initial cost is pretty high for most grassroots runners. But , like with all things, you gotta pay to play.

You've given me a challenge. I'll look into that for you, as I'm normally not a Guru in Drag-Racing. But in my mind, calculations are calculations, regardless of the motorsport.

I'm working on some twin turbo R&D for a 2016 Dodge Charger setup now.


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Old 03-21-2017, 08:02 AM   #114
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Ok. Back to the fun here. I hate that this thread died.

My next favorite is the T.M.E Evo 6.5 RS 16G.

I never got to talk briefly about this turbocharger from my "lunch" that took over a year to eat. (heh

What I liked about it was that it was manufactured for use at a time when performance was the main goal (so that it could qualify as a usable car in Group A WRC) and the fact that this was when MHI had a "no-holds barred" mentality.
This was one of the only production turbochargers that used a titanium-alloy turbine wheel and shaft, (20 years before the EFR Borg-Warner series utilized it for aftermarket consumption). The wastegate flapper was a very nice 35mm

The best thing about it this turbo is that it had an absolutely astonishing boost threshold of over 32psi (2,2Bar) before it ran out of efficiency, as long as the supporting hardware were in place. The damn thing was absolutely indestructible, continually being used for dozens of anti-lag filled races before needing to be serviced. The thrust bearings were 360* and made of a bronze alloy that was much stronger than even Garrett or Borg-Warner (I think that was their "secret sauce" to success. ). All the turbochargers were balanced to over 250,000rpms on their VSR machines, (verses the typically 100,000rpms on most VSRs, and about 14,000 on your average rebuilder's shop machine). So you didn't want to take these apart much, because the balancing was so damn...perfect.

It's a shame nowadays that these are $3,000 to get now. They used to be about $1200 or so about 10 years ago. Companies like CBRD would make similar products out of the ever-popular 16G6 out of the Evolution 8-9, but it would never, never come to the robust capability of the T.M.E...

I would love to have integrated a turbocharger of this size to even today's factory turbo vehicles. It would be a dream come true. No billet wheel, no fanciness, just good ole' fashioned love for the game put into a compact package.

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Old 03-27-2017, 06:40 PM   #115
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Default Re: Discussion Topic: Tell us about your favorite turbocharger and why

My favorite turbo is the Holset HX25 installed on a bone stock D16Z6 on a 90 CRX HF. I have had this set up for over 5 years on an unknown mileage junk yard Z6.
It spools super fast, keeps a steady 8psi, and runs strong all the way to 6500 RPM which where I have the rev cut set at. I have a P28 with a base map from phearable that I "tuned" with a wide band adjusting the fuel pressure and distributor timing until I got it to run w/o knock. It's the most fun car I have ever driven and owned and super reliable.
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Old 03-27-2017, 08:42 PM   #116
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My favorite turbo is the Holset HX25 installed on a bone stock D16Z6 on a 90 CRX HF. I have had this set up for over 5 years on an unknown mileage junk yard Z6.
It spools super fast, keeps a steady 8psi, and runs strong all the way to 6500 RPM which where I have the rev cut set at. I have a P28 with a base map from phearable that I "tuned" with a wide band adjusting the fuel pressure and distributor timing until I got it to run w/o knock. It's the most fun car I have ever driven and owned and super reliable.
I see. Please, if you would, indulge us with the details of the turbocharger itself. (adiabatic compressor and turbine exhaust flow maps, photos of the turbo.) Let's see what you're talking about here.
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Old 03-28-2017, 01:52 PM   #117
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Default Re: Discussion Topic: Tell us about your favorite turbocharger and why

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I never got to talk briefly about this turbocharger from my "lunch" that took over a year to eat. (heh

What I liked about it was that it was manufactured for use at a time when performance was the main goal (so that it could qualify as a usable car in Group A WRC) and the fact that this was when MHI had a "no-holds barred" mentality.
This was one of the only production turbochargers that used a titanium-alloy turbine wheel and shaft, (20 years before the EFR Borg-Warner series utilized it for aftermarket consumption). The wastegate flapper was a very nice 35mm

The best thing about it this turbo is that it had an absolutely astonishing boost threshold of over 32psi (2,2Bar) before it ran out of efficiency, as long as the supporting hardware were in place. The damn thing was absolutely indestructible, continually being used for dozens of anti-lag filled races before needing to be serviced. The thrust bearings were 360* and made of a bronze alloy that was much stronger than even Garrett or Borg-Warner (I think that was their "secret sauce" to success. ). All the turbochargers were balanced to over 250,000rpms on their VSR machines, (verses the typically 100,000rpms on most VSRs, and about 14,000 on your average rebuilder's shop machine). So you didn't want to take these apart much, because the balancing was so damn...perfect.

It's a shame nowadays that these are $3,000 to get now. They used to be about $1200 or so about 10 years ago. Companies like CBRD would make similar products out of the ever-popular 16G6 out of the Evolution 8-9, but it would never, never come to the robust capability of the T.M.E...

I would love to have integrated a turbocharger of this size to even today's factory turbo vehicles. It would be a dream come true. No billet wheel, no fanciness, just good ole' fashioned love for the game put into a compact package.

Weren't the Ti turbine wheels prone to shattering like the EFR turbos when overspun?
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Old 03-28-2017, 04:24 PM   #118
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Weren't the Ti turbine wheels prone to shattering like the EFR turbos when overspun?
Nope. Never seen or heard of that in over 20 years of that. OEM is not aftermarket. Simply because both companies may use Titanium alloy in their turbine wheels, metallurgical compounds were completely different, so they won't reveal the same hiccups.
Hadn't seen an EFR do that either.. At least not based upon the metallurgy of the turbine wheel, anyway...
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