SteveeeO

alright, this is getting me going and my mind is going crazy.. this is going to be a daily driven car / drag race once to maybe twice a week... so I'm going to have a pretty good suspension / braking setup with some power hopefully...

this is a quote from a guy on http://www.jdmuniverse.com/forum/vie...d.php?tid=3803

"well, let's see.. b16 swap is how much? 3 grand.. that's 160 flywheel. 135~140whp. crx si is about 90~95whp. for 3 grand, i can easily make that much power. now let's talk about turbo...i can make a d16 to run 250~300whp SAFELY and it still still be cheaper for a b16 to hit 250~300whp. And downside of hybrid cars is that you have to sacrifice a lot of comfort. AC's gone, car vibrates like crazy..etc. Plus the motors are 10+ years old, there are all sorts of problem w/ the car. How I know? I have 2 b16 crx and a ZC b16....first gen b16 is like a failure experiment of all b series motor. a rebuild is a much and it will cost you hella money.

not a big man w/ big words. just being realistic and experienced. I'm a turbo guy but I know turbo is not the savior of hondas."

this makes a lot of sense, but if I can't build my own D16 engine what would you guys say? How much would it cost me for someone to rebuild it for turbo specs (around 10-12 PSI) What would it take? Is it "better" than a B16? The whole b16 swap is going to cost me $3100 including swap price / new clutch and all that good stuff... My estimate on the D16 is around $1000 for a built one maybe? *Clueless* - maybe around 2k for a good turbo setup to push around 10 PSI... and some installation cost

guys please help me make a choice! I know I sound clueless, that's because I am - but maybe someoen could help me out a little

thanks

FCdrifter

bump for my d16 brothers

Finest

Make a D16 run 250-300whp? For less than $3k? BUHAHAHAHAHAH!

And who said that you have to lose A/C, and all comforts with a hybrid? If anything, you might have to lose those with a turbo, depending on turbo manifold.

Diablo Tejano

hmmm... 300 reliable fwhp, on a D16? For less than what 300whp would cost on a B16? Riiiiight.

I don't have A/C, my car already vibrates like a 13 inch wall mounted *****, and my engine is almost 14 years old. But that doesn't mean that a hybrid will have the same characteristics.

I'm kind of in the same boat as you and I am leaning toards boosting my D16A6 rather than swaping. This is because if I get a little over-zealous with the boost and pop my block, no big deal, D16 blocks are a dime a dozen. Plus I'm obsesive about weight savings.

If you're on a budget go for the SOHC, and add another cam later on. (figuratively speaking) Spend the cash you save on springs, shocks, strut braces tires etc.

My $.02
James

Boo Boo'n

there was NOTHING funny about that statement. it was true, a factoid. it is very possible and rather easy, maybe you should learn more before you speak. I don't know the most but i atleast know that.

BudaKai

That's classic ...

300whp on a D16 is quite possible for less than a B16 if you know how to do it frugally, and look for the right parts. The B16 swap alone cost as much as an engine build-up and turbo. You just have to think a little harder. Be smart do it right the first time to avoid spending more than you need to.

AR Fab

Well I know ourselfs and TurbodCX have been pretty succesful running our SOHC D16Z's up around 20 psi.....I look at it and see that its more practical to do the turbo and built D-series. The built D-series with a turbo is ess than buying a B16 swap and adding a turbo with alot less worries about torchin the B-series cause its not built at that price.....

Howard

SteveeeO

ac doesnt matter to me, I was giong to remove mine either way just to lose the weight... but all that matters to me is a cheap / good daily driver that I can drag race and brag to all my friends...

u can add another cam to the D16A6? to convert it from SOHC to DOHC? I have never heard of this ... but if that is true, how hard is it to do? how much would it cost? I want to get this thing boosted pretty good, so I am going to pay someone to redo the internals for me

no one has still really told me which way to go, b16 is more costly... which I dont have money and it sounds like the D16 route being around the same price with a decent turbo setup would be a lot quicker, then I could worry about all my suspension mods

Diablo Tejano

No, I was speaking figuratively. I was referring to a DOHC swap, not literally adding another cam. As you're still undecided, shop around to see what each route will cost you, then compare the results to your performance goals. The best thing you can possibly do is learn more about your car so you can make a more informed decision.

James

Jefnes

Stick with the D16.

The 1st gen B16 seems to have not so strong ringlands.
I blew the ringlands on all 4 cylinders running just 8 psi.
The newer B motors (B16 and B18) seem to be able to
handle a little more boost before failure.

My B16 has since been re-built and makes 333 whp on 18 psi.
(in an '88 CRX)

The B16 is a great motor, but even with a turbo its still a torqueless
wonder. The D16, with the longer stroke should (in theory) make a better
turbo engine.

The cost of truly building an engine, forged rods/pistons will cost you
roughly the same for either. $3g's would cover a decent build, not
the turbo and engine management, but the build...

If you want over 250 you'll need to build it as the stock rods won't
take that kind of power for very long.

Just my opinion,
Jeffrey Atwood

SteveeeO

3000 for the engine alone?! that is completely out of the question ... how much is labor on that? I wouldn't think too much if I got everything that was made for the engine... I was thinking around $200 for a D16 someone has lying around, about $400-500 pistons / rings, another $400 for rods, and I was looking at a Crane Cam that is supposebly supposed to spool the turbo faster for another $360

these should handle the turbo fine, shouldn't it? the main reason I want to upgrade all of this is for reliability, not to push it to it's 100% max

SteveeeO

alright guys, it is sounding like b16 is a cheaper route now ... if this is the case, I think I will just stick to it, $2200-$3000 is not my idea of spending for a daily driven civic - W/O a turbo! my idea was about $3500 with a pretty good turbo setup, all good internals, and runnin low 13's maybe even 12's

so is b16 the way to go on a budget? it sounds like it to me if these people are serious about the cost of a built d16

Drew Peacock

Well with your B16 whether 1st or 2nd gen you are only going to have about 145whp with your stock D16a6 with 6 psi of boost you will have about 155whp and a lot of torque.... You can boost upto 10psi on the stock engine( I DO) I make 196whp at 10psi (only boost that high at the track) cars done about 20000kms since boost no problems apart from a blown clutch... Use your head do some research. But I reccomend boosting what you have.

SteveeeO

well... your not really understanding waht I mean, I want a rebuilt d16 just so it runs like new, and if it gets rebuilt, I don't see why I shouldn't just get it ready for boost - so it can handle 8lbs constantly for daily driving, and maybe up to 15lbs for track? and also so I wouldn't have to worry about any problems like OIL BURNING and coolant leaving off a HORRIBLE smell - you know all the wear and tear of older engines

BudaKai

Build the D!... Don't fall for the vtec sham.Bisi ran a 10.77 with a 1535cc D-series. They have more torque down low where it counts on the street.

SteveeeO

how about zc's with boost? what can they handle safely daily driven? those are cheap and are pretty easy to swap it sounds like

Boo Boo'n

you my friend, know nothing good day