calling people that know SOHC FI #'s well....
02-12-2004, 03:01 PM
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calling people that know SOHC FI #'s well....
thinking about waiting on all the extra goodies and hondata for awhile and finishing my car off with some 96-00 ex injectors and the greddy blue box on like 7-8psi. i would still run the FMU i have now if needed for A/F reasons.
all of this is for a 96 hatch with y7 and y8 intake mani and greddy kit. would that supply enough fuel to make it safe daily driven... any guesses at how much power might be expected?
later on i plan to do the y8 head and hondata.. some other goodies. but im sick of being broke every week right now so ill save for awhile..
all of this is for a 96 hatch with y7 and y8 intake mani and greddy kit. would that supply enough fuel to make it safe daily driven... any guesses at how much power might be expected?
later on i plan to do the y8 head and hondata.. some other goodies. but im sick of being broke every week right now so ill save for awhile..
02-12-2004, 03:17 PM
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Re: calling people that know SOHC FI #'s well.... (psi420)
and would this be safe on 8psi... should i keep the FMU in with all that stuff or not... and would i still need the check valves with the blue box? thanks
02-12-2004, 04:42 PM
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With stock injectors, yeah I wuld run the FMU.
The blue box should control the fuel for you, if you have the 310's that come with it.
I think, never used that box before.
And no check valves if you use the box.
I say ditch the box, run the fmu and a missing link.
The blue box should control the fuel for you, if you have the 310's that come with it.
I think, never used that box before.
And no check valves if you use the box.
I say ditch the box, run the fmu and a missing link.
02-12-2004, 04:48 PM
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Re: (psi420)
pick one or the other but not both.
the blue box raises the duty cycle on the injectors according to the map sensor reading from the boost it reads...while sending a fake signal to the ecu to keep it happy.
the fmu on the other hand raises fuel rail pressure according to boost sensed.
as you can see, running these two together = raised fuel rail pressure and higher duty cycle.
this gives you one or both of the following:
1. lessened life of fuel injectors
2. a really fucked up spray pattern from them being overloaded.
just go with the blue box if you already got it so you dont have to buy a missing link. sell the fmu and put that money towards a newer fuel setup.
the blue box raises the duty cycle on the injectors according to the map sensor reading from the boost it reads...while sending a fake signal to the ecu to keep it happy.
the fmu on the other hand raises fuel rail pressure according to boost sensed.
as you can see, running these two together = raised fuel rail pressure and higher duty cycle.
this gives you one or both of the following:
1. lessened life of fuel injectors
2. a really fucked up spray pattern from them being overloaded.
just go with the blue box if you already got it so you dont have to buy a missing link. sell the fmu and put that money towards a newer fuel setup.
02-12-2004, 06:01 PM
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Re: (stackz)
all i have right now are stock dx 180cc injectors. a vortech FMU (not sure which disk) and 4 check valves...... friend has some gsr 240cc's for $20 and i found a blue box for 65 shipped. mainly want a safe CHEAP way to run like 8psi and not worry about leaning out...
THANKS!!!!!!!!!!
THANKS!!!!!!!!!!
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02-12-2004, 07:49 PM
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Re: (turbo sol)
yea, the dx, lx,cx (d16y7) had 180cc. i am positive of this...
bump for the rest of the info im tirng to figure out before i make purchases...
bump for the rest of the info im tirng to figure out before i make purchases...
02-12-2004, 07:54 PM
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Re: (SOHC b00st)
Justin,
Get the 96-00 EX injectors, run the blue box at 8 psi, no need to upgrade your fuel pump, retard timing 1 deg. at the dizzy and be sure to use 92 octane. On open downpipe at 8 psi, you'll be scratching at 200whp, as JFK78 made 189whp at 7 psi on open downpipe.
Don't run the FMU either.
Get the 96-00 EX injectors, run the blue box at 8 psi, no need to upgrade your fuel pump, retard timing 1 deg. at the dizzy and be sure to use 92 octane. On open downpipe at 8 psi, you'll be scratching at 200whp, as JFK78 made 189whp at 7 psi on open downpipe.
Don't run the FMU either.
02-12-2004, 08:20 PM
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Re: (boostincoupe)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by boostincoupe »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Justin,
Get the 96-00 EX injectors, run the blue box at 8 psi, no need to upgrade your fuel pump, retard timing 1 deg. at the dizzy and be sure to use 92 octane. On open downpipe at 8 psi, you'll be scratching at 200whp, as JFK78 made 189whp at 7 psi on open downpipe.
Don't run the FMU either. </TD></TR></TABLE> I'm not sure the other turbo ninjas will agree with that 
If you want to run 8psi safely without moving up to hondata etc make sure you get it on the dyno to make sure the A/F ratios are correct. 
Get the 96-00 EX injectors, run the blue box at 8 psi, no need to upgrade your fuel pump, retard timing 1 deg. at the dizzy and be sure to use 92 octane. On open downpipe at 8 psi, you'll be scratching at 200whp, as JFK78 made 189whp at 7 psi on open downpipe.
Don't run the FMU either.
</TD></TR></TABLE> I'm not sure the other turbo ninjas will agree with that If you want to run 8psi safely without moving up to hondata etc make sure you get it on the dyno to make sure the A/F ratios are correct.
02-12-2004, 08:25 PM
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Re: (boostincoupe)
I'm running blue box at around 8 lbs of boost daily for 9 months. I retarded a couple degrees at the distributor and run 92 octane. (EXACTLY what he said before.) I've had no problems. I boost hard all the time and have been since it was installed. I do have some slight pinging at high rpm when I run 91...but I think it's a timing issue. It's weird to me that 1 point in octane makes a difference with this. Anyway. Do as I've done and you should have no problems.
Also...I will confirm my A/F's on a dyno soon, just so I will have some better proof that this setup is safe for my engine other than, "hmmm...it hasn't blown yet."
Also...I will confirm my A/F's on a dyno soon, just so I will have some better proof that this setup is safe for my engine other than, "hmmm...it hasn't blown yet."
02-12-2004, 08:46 PM
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Greddy blue box at 7-8psi w/ 310cc injectors. Retard the dizzy 1 degree. run the highest octane gas you can find on pump. That should be plenty to handle your fuel and all that good stuff. I would say 8psi=180whp with an exhaust system.
Sell the 180cc injectors and sell the check valves and FMU.
I disagree with running the blue box with 240cc injectors without a A/F reading. Basically the blue box is going to tell the car to have the injectors open for a shorter amount of time b/c you are supposed to use 310's. If you put 240's you will be getting less fuel than you would get stock. That doesnt sound safe to me.
Sell the 180cc injectors and sell the check valves and FMU.
I disagree with running the blue box with 240cc injectors without a A/F reading. Basically the blue box is going to tell the car to have the injectors open for a shorter amount of time b/c you are supposed to use 310's. If you put 240's you will be getting less fuel than you would get stock. That doesnt sound safe to me.
02-12-2004, 08:48 PM
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Re: (diputs)
yea well, luckily here in nc.. every stations premium gas is 93 octane.... so im good to go.... that "turbo ninja" haha... he bought my old greddy kit from my red hatch talked about in my sig. when he went from the fmy to the blue box he said he felt a world a difference?
02-13-2004, 05:52 AM
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Re: (turbozxi)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by turbozxi »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> I'm not sure the other turbo ninjas will agree with that If you want to run 8psi safely without moving up to hondata etc make sure you get it on the dyno to make sure the A/F ratios are correct. </TD></TR></TABLE>
https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=750611
184.5WHP @ 7 psi (spiked to 8), consistent 12.5:1 AF ratio under boost.
https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=208016
Quoted from his thread:
"I'm running the TD04-15G Greddy kit and intercooler, blue box, 255 in-tank pump,
B&M Commandflo, and RC 310 injectors.
The motor is stock internals, with ARP headstuds, Cometic HP headgasket, and ZEX 59300 cam. Ignition is stock.
All runs were on 92 octane, NGK BKR6E plugs gapped at .030, ignition timing at 1 degree retarded, open downpipe.
On 5 psi, it made 164.1 whp and 143.3 tq. A/F ratio was 12.5:1.
On 7 psi, it made 189.2 whp and 169.3 tq. A/F ratio was 12.5:1.
On 9 psi, it made 203.5 whp and 184.0 tq. A/F ratio was 12.0:1.
On 10 psi, it made 212.2 whp and 190.8 tq. A/F ratio was 12.0:1.
Not bad, huh? I was really surprised that I was able to run only 1 degree retarded ignition timing all the way up to 10 psi on pump gas, especially since the air temp in the dyno area was 90 degrees. Usually it's like 60 degrees around here.
And the runs above 7 psi I tuned it a little richer because I was wanted to be a little on the safer side. Maybe if I leaned it out to 12.5:1 at the higher boost levels I could make 215 whp or so."
The blue box makes the car run pig rich under boost, especially at 5.5psi. But when you up the boost, you are effectively leaning out the AF ratio so that it settles at about 12:0-12.5:1 under boost @ 8 psi. Also, by adjusting the base fuel pressure you can lean/richen the mixture.
Sure it doesn't use a laptop or have timing controls, but for $65 it's the best bang for the buck!
Any other questions?
If you want to run 8psi safely without moving up to hondata etc make sure you get it on the dyno to make sure the A/F ratios are correct. </TD></TR></TABLE>https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=750611
184.5WHP @ 7 psi (spiked to 8), consistent 12.5:1 AF ratio under boost.
https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=208016
Quoted from his thread:
"I'm running the TD04-15G Greddy kit and intercooler, blue box, 255 in-tank pump,
B&M Commandflo, and RC 310 injectors.
The motor is stock internals, with ARP headstuds, Cometic HP headgasket, and ZEX 59300 cam. Ignition is stock.
All runs were on 92 octane, NGK BKR6E plugs gapped at .030, ignition timing at 1 degree retarded, open downpipe.
On 5 psi, it made 164.1 whp and 143.3 tq. A/F ratio was 12.5:1.
On 7 psi, it made 189.2 whp and 169.3 tq. A/F ratio was 12.5:1.
On 9 psi, it made 203.5 whp and 184.0 tq. A/F ratio was 12.0:1.
On 10 psi, it made 212.2 whp and 190.8 tq. A/F ratio was 12.0:1.
Not bad, huh? I was really surprised that I was able to run only 1 degree retarded ignition timing all the way up to 10 psi on pump gas, especially since the air temp in the dyno area was 90 degrees. Usually it's like 60 degrees around here.
And the runs above 7 psi I tuned it a little richer because I was wanted to be a little on the safer side. Maybe if I leaned it out to 12.5:1 at the higher boost levels I could make 215 whp or so."
The blue box makes the car run pig rich under boost, especially at 5.5psi. But when you up the boost, you are effectively leaning out the AF ratio so that it settles at about 12:0-12.5:1 under boost @ 8 psi. Also, by adjusting the base fuel pressure you can lean/richen the mixture.
Sure it doesn't use a laptop or have timing controls, but for $65 it's the best bang for the buck!
Any other questions?
02-13-2004, 05:55 AM
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Re: (b18b1hmtlove)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by b18b1hmtlove »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Greddy blue box at 7-8psi w/ 310cc injectors. Retard the dizzy 1 degree. run the highest octane gas you can find on pump. That should be plenty to handle your fuel and all that good stuff. I would say 8psi=180whp with an exhaust system.
Sell the 180cc injectors and sell the check valves and FMU.
I disagree with running the blue box with 240cc injectors without a A/F reading. Basically the blue box is going to tell the car to have the injectors open for a shorter amount of time b/c you are supposed to use 310's. If you put 240's you will be getting less fuel than you would get stock. That doesnt sound safe to me.</TD></TR></TABLE>
Please stop spreading misinformation. We are talking about the SOHC kit. The SOHC kit comes with a blue box calibrated for stock injectors, not 310's, which is why the kit doesn't come with injectors.
This ALWAYS happens; B-series guys come in and talk about how we're supposed to be using 310's; the SOHC kits don't come with upgraded injectors because SOHC injectors are less prone to wearing out from running in open loop, whereas B-series injectors are. Greddy realized this early in the game, and thus included upgraded injectors for DOHC kits. Ask stackz about it, he'll have more info. for you.
Sell the 180cc injectors and sell the check valves and FMU.
I disagree with running the blue box with 240cc injectors without a A/F reading. Basically the blue box is going to tell the car to have the injectors open for a shorter amount of time b/c you are supposed to use 310's. If you put 240's you will be getting less fuel than you would get stock. That doesnt sound safe to me.</TD></TR></TABLE>
Please stop spreading misinformation. We are talking about the SOHC kit. The SOHC kit comes with a blue box calibrated for stock injectors, not 310's, which is why the kit doesn't come with injectors.
This ALWAYS happens; B-series guys come in and talk about how we're supposed to be using 310's; the SOHC kits don't come with upgraded injectors because SOHC injectors are less prone to wearing out from running in open loop, whereas B-series injectors are. Greddy realized this early in the game, and thus included upgraded injectors for DOHC kits. Ask stackz about it, he'll have more info. for you.
02-13-2004, 06:49 AM
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Re: (SOHC b00st)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by SOHC b00st »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">yea, the dx, lx,cx (d16y7) had 180cc. i am positive of this... </TD></TR></TABLE>
Actually, their all 240cc.
Actually, their all 240cc.
02-13-2004, 07:44 AM
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Re: (inline4hatch)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by inline4hatch »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
Actually, their all 240cc. </TD></TR></TABLE>
That's what I thought.
Actually, their all 240cc. </TD></TR></TABLE>
That's what I thought.
02-13-2004, 06:23 PM
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Re: (turbo sol)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by turbo sol »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">i agree that they are 240cc.</TD></TR></TABLE>
whatever. go read that damn accel injector size chart... the y7 was the only d-series that didnt have 240's... actually only the 96-00 ex were 240cc.. the rest were 235.. and the y7 were 180.. im sick of arguing with people this. ask "boostincoupe" he argued with me fro awhile and finally i found the chart and proved it to him.
and that guy was running rc 310's.... so wouldnt the 240cc make the car lean out at lower boost on the blue box since they are pushing 70cc less fuel than his were
whatever. go read that damn accel injector size chart... the y7 was the only d-series that didnt have 240's... actually only the 96-00 ex were 240cc.. the rest were 235.. and the y7 were 180.. im sick of arguing with people this. ask "boostincoupe" he argued with me fro awhile and finally i found the chart and proved it to him.
and that guy was running rc 310's.... so wouldnt the 240cc make the car lean out at lower boost on the blue box since they are pushing 70cc less fuel than his were
02-13-2004, 10:18 PM
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Re: calling people that know SOHC FI #'s well.... (SOHC b00st)
check my sig for my numbers...
this was all done with the blue box ONLY...and if u see my boost graph, it spikes to 8 psi and A/F looked good. pump gas (91 octane), stock ignition timing, 2.25" crush bent exhaust with a gutted cat.
this was all done with the blue box ONLY...and if u see my boost graph, it spikes to 8 psi and A/F looked good. pump gas (91 octane), stock ignition timing, 2.25" crush bent exhaust with a gutted cat.
02-15-2004, 10:03 AM
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Re: (SOHC b00st)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by SOHC b00st »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">whatever. go read that damn accel injector size chart... the y7 was the only d-series that didnt have 240's... actually only the 96-00 ex were 240cc.. the rest were 235.. and the y7 were 180.. im sick of arguing with people this. ask "boostincoupe" he argued with me fro awhile and finally i found the chart and proved it to him. </TD></TR></TABLE>
Here you go bub.
http://www.allmotorhonda.com/t...r.htm
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">and that guy was running rc 310's....so wouldnt the 240cc make the car lean out at lower boost on the blue box since they are pushing 70cc less fuel than his were</TD></TR></TABLE>
No, because the blue box is meant to the run the 240cc.
02-15-2004, 10:12 AM
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Re: (inline4hatch)
Hmm, well I wonder which is miss info now. This says 190cc...
http://www.robietherobot.com/s...e.htm
http://www.robietherobot.com/s...e.htm
02-15-2004, 03:02 PM
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Re: (inline4hatch)
thank you very much.... everybody thinks they are all 240 when they just dont read deep enough. it doesnt break down trim levels. the damn dx,lx, and cx... the d16y7.. are NOT 240..... so there you go "bub"