black works t3 b series top mount problems
#1
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black works t3 b series top mount problems
hello everyone, I recently purchased a t3 top mount turbo manifold from blackworks with a 38mm wastegate flange and yesterday I sent it to profunction to tune it and I ran into some major problems with the manifold. Car was run on a 13 psi spring and 5% duty on the PWM. Boost was uncontrollable. Spring was dropped to a 8psi spring, duty still at 5%...still uncontrollable. We undid the boost controller from the top port of the wastegate, boost did drop a little but still uncontrollable at high RPM's. We then threw the smallest spring(4 psi) and ran it with nothing on the top port of the gate. The boost was much lower but again uncontrollable at the high rpm's. The wastegate does it's job just fine on low cam but on high cam once we exceed 7,000 RPM's there's not enough flow going to the gate.for reference - boost on the 13psi spring was 18@6,000 RPM, on the 8psi pring it was 14@6,000 RPM, and on the 4psi spring it was 11@6,000 RPM. Boost cut is set at 25psi and was reached on every spring at anywhere from 7,100 to 7,600 RPM. The wastegate is operating. The issue does not occur when the car is ran just on low cam.
if anyone had this problem please let me know, I contacted many at bwr and didn't get any solution from them
if anyone had this problem please let me know, I contacted many at bwr and didn't get any solution from them
#2
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Re: black works t3 b series top mount problems
when I contacted manny at bwr he just told me that the wastegate is to small, but that has nothing to with it, at first he told me that the tuner might not know about the s300 but that's just bs.
#3
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Re: black works t3 b series top mount problems
how much boost do you get if you remove the wastegate completely?
without even looking up what the manifold looks like, i can bet it's at a 90 degree angle to the collector.
without even looking up what the manifold looks like, i can bet it's at a 90 degree angle to the collector.
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Re: black works t3 b series top mount problems
1.8L B-vtec, 9:1 compression on a mild cam. t3 6266 with a .82 AR
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Re: black works t3 b series top mount problems
Well for starters a 38mm wastegate on a top mount is ludacris. you need a large gate to control boost on a top mount manifold unless its dual gates, then two 38's would work. Im having the same issue with a 45mm wastegate but its not uncontrolable just creeps like 6-7 pounds. Its partially due to the wastegate outlet not being teardrop shape on my manifold but mostly because of the 66 exhaust wheel, this is a known issue. You need dual gates to control boost and if your having that bad of boost creep i highly recommend dual 44-45mm gates and that they are setup priority if you have the room or at least teardrop
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Re: black works t3 b series top mount problems
Even on a strait 38mm flange it wouldnt be enough, the 6266 is a very efficient turbo. A properly placed 44 is what its going to take. But probay gonna take a 60mm to really control boost at lower levels
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Re: black works t3 b series top mount problems
a single 44 gate will not work unless its setup priority straight as possible in line with the collector. especially with the .82 housing. a single 60 gate will work perfectly or two 44-45's
#10
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Re: black works t3 b series top mount problems
Lol, crappy manifold layout with a single 38? On that turbo and setup?
Next time purchase a manifold and appropriate tech support from a real company.
Next time purchase a manifold and appropriate tech support from a real company.
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Re: black works t3 b series top mount problems
My buddy had one of their ramhorns. It was a solid piece BUT it hit the hood when he would accell hard even with stiff mounts. It just want put together properly in the sense of how it was layed out
#13
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Re: black works t3 b series top mount problems
BWR Units are good units and the company stands behind them. a 62 pte turbo flows every well. Its all about matching the combo correctly when doing a turbo setup. I am sure if you would have told Manny the turbo you wer running he would have advised to run a bigger gate. It doesn't matter who designed it. 38mm 2 bolt with the turbos these days is crazy. I have rejected customers that insist on 2 bolt gates with bigger turbos.
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Re: black works t3 b series top mount problems
BWR Units are good units and the company stands behind them. a 62 pte turbo flows every well. Its all about matching the combo correctly when doing a turbo setup. I am sure if you would have told Manny the turbo you wer running he would have advised to run a bigger gate. It doesn't matter who designed it. 38mm 2 bolt with the turbos these days is crazy. I have rejected customers that insist on 2 bolt gates with bigger turbos.
#16
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Re: black works t3 b series top mount problems
the thing that really pushed my buttons is the first problem they had with the manifolds, the wastegate flanges were made to thin and when I installed the wastegate I could actually spin the gate with my hand, I contacted manny at BWR, and he told me that he know's of the issue. if he knew of the issue why didn't they inform there authorized distributor's?? I had a couple of them instock and I was never informed about it.
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Re: black works t3 b series top mount problems
hmmmm some odd comments in here about a single 38mm gate
this is what i run on my topmount and had a 6265 on it with the 1.15 devided housing i made 757@32psi with no issues at all
now im on a 6766 the little gate is doing just fine
this is what i run on my topmount and had a 6265 on it with the 1.15 devided housing i made 757@32psi with no issues at all
now im on a 6766 the little gate is doing just fine
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Re: black works t3 b series top mount problems
that's because you're running high pressures, which means very little exhaust gas bypasses the turbine.
Totally different story with a big turbo trying to run 10psi.... it takes a very large or even multiple wastegates to bypass enough exhaust gasses around the turbine to maintain lo pressure levels.
Totally different story with a big turbo trying to run 10psi.... it takes a very large or even multiple wastegates to bypass enough exhaust gasses around the turbine to maintain lo pressure levels.
#21
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Re: black works t3 b series top mount problems
I have a top mount on a 6266 with a Tial 44 and the thing crept uncontrollably after 7500rpm. I pulled the gate off completely and still crept to 11lbs. Your gonna need at least dual 38's or bigger. Im going with a single Precision 66. I want to be able to run 8-9lbs in the first 2 gears.
#22
Re: black works t3 b series top mount problems
I have a 500hp turbo it holds 5psi on an inline pro cast manifold. The top mount must cause issues? Boost is going up and more rpm and its a 2 bolt 38mm..hopefully no spikes
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Re: black works t3 b series top mount problems
Thats because with a cast log there is considerably more back pressure than a tubular manifold which is forced out of the wastegate much better than a free flowing manifold where you really need to good WG placement or two gates