Best way to tell detonation
03-18-2005, 06:50 PM
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Best way to tell detonation
I'm trying to tune my motor, 12 psi on a d16. What's the best way to tell when detonation is occuring? I know about reading the plugs, but is there any other way.
03-18-2005, 10:06 PM
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Re: Best way to tell detonation (fled)
you'll hear it.. just have your windows up and drive around 35 miles and put it 5th and then give it full throttle.. if its there you'll hear.. clink clink clink...
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03-19-2005, 05:12 AM
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Re: (Tchleung)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Tchleung »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">If the detonation is enough to be audible to your ears. It's pretty much too late hehe</TD></TR></TABLE>
No it's not. You obviously have never been there.
No it's not. You obviously have never been there.
03-19-2005, 05:21 AM
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Re: (Zakar)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Zakar »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">a wideband is the only way to get a perfect tune anywaz.. might as well pick one up.. then you can rent it to people</TD></TR></TABLE>
Hmm, what about timing...
Hmm, what about timing...
03-19-2005, 07:14 AM
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Re: (PrettyLude)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by PrettyLude »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">egt gauge</TD></TR></TABLE>
Can you elaborate more.
Can you elaborate more.
03-19-2005, 07:32 AM
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Re: (93hatched_projekt)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 93hatched_projekt »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
Can you elaborate more.</TD></TR></TABLE>
Generally the hotter the cylinder temperatures become. The leaner you are becoming and therefore.. Knock. But you also have to know which side you are on, as running too rich can also cause high EGT temps. Wideband and EGT are a good investment
Can you elaborate more.</TD></TR></TABLE>
Generally the hotter the cylinder temperatures become. The leaner you are becoming and therefore.. Knock. But you also have to know which side you are on, as running too rich can also cause high EGT temps. Wideband and EGT are a good investment
03-19-2005, 07:33 AM
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Re: (Flr Power)
You're right. I tune my car with my wideband and EGT to a safe level so I am far away from knock.. 
And if you didn't realize. There was sarcasm in that post 
And if you didn't realize. There was sarcasm in that post
03-19-2005, 07:43 AM
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Re: (Tchleung)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Tchleung »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
Generally the hotter the cylinder temperatures become. The leaner you are becoming and therefore.. Knock. But you also have to know which side you are on, as running too rich can also cause high EGT temps. Wideband and EGT are a good investment</TD></TR></TABLE>
Ideally what af/r is best for daily driving and in boost. At what temperture would you consider to be too hot. Not to hyjack the thread , but just would like to hear more feedback.
Generally the hotter the cylinder temperatures become. The leaner you are becoming and therefore.. Knock. But you also have to know which side you are on, as running too rich can also cause high EGT temps. Wideband and EGT are a good investment</TD></TR></TABLE>
Ideally what af/r is best for daily driving and in boost. At what temperture would you consider to be too hot. Not to hyjack the thread , but just would like to hear more feedback.
03-19-2005, 08:05 AM
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There was a neat table that someone posted that had a good outlien of what A/F is recommended in vacuum and in boost but I can't seem to find it... In boost. I would stay under 12.5. In vacuum I like to be in the mid 13's at partial throttle and cruising/idling I run it 14.5
03-19-2005, 09:04 AM
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Re: (Tchleung)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Tchleung »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">There was a neat table that someone posted that had a good outlien of what A/F is recommended in vacuum and in boost but I can't seem to find it... In boost. I would stay under 12.5. In vacuum I like to be in the mid 13's at partial throttle and cruising/idling I run it 14.5</TD></TR></TABLE>
Thanks.........
Thanks.........
03-19-2005, 09:33 AM
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Re: (Tchleung)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Tchleung »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">There was a neat table that someone posted that had a good outlien of what A/F is recommended in vacuum and in boost but I can't seem to find it... In boost. I would stay under 12.5. In vacuum I like to be in the mid 13's at partial throttle and cruising/idling I run it 14.5</TD></TR></TABLE>
That's pretty much how I've got my JRSC set up, throttle response is great, and no detonation.
That's pretty much how I've got my JRSC set up, throttle response is great, and no detonation.
03-20-2005, 09:24 AM
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Re: (sharkcohen)
thanks... but the answers kinda strayed from the question... neither a wideband nor a egt gauge will tell you if you're detonating... they will give you a hint, but a number of things can make those gauges read certain information... I guess I'll just run it rich and stick to reading plugs... thanks...
03-20-2005, 09:28 AM
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Doa WOT run in 3rd egar. at the top of 3rd. Shut down the car competlely keep teh cltuch in so the engine fully stops rotating. Pull to the side. then check plugs. Best time to chech plugs for detonation
03-20-2005, 09:36 AM
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Reading the plugs is the best way to do it.
You can look at raw knock sensor values as well. However, all a knock sensor does is pick up vibration. The knock sensor will pick up vibration from detonation, normal combustion process noise, as well as mechanical noise so it's not all that accurate.
EGTs are just about worthless unless you have one on each cylinder to check cylinder balance. Timing advance will change EGTs MUCH MORE then A/F ratios will. With aggressive timing advance you could run 15:1 A/Fs on a high boosted motor and never know it was running lean. Drop the timing advance down though and you could be running 12:1 and think you were dead lean because of incrediably high EGTs.
You can look at raw knock sensor values as well. However, all a knock sensor does is pick up vibration. The knock sensor will pick up vibration from detonation, normal combustion process noise, as well as mechanical noise so it's not all that accurate.
EGTs are just about worthless unless you have one on each cylinder to check cylinder balance. Timing advance will change EGTs MUCH MORE then A/F ratios will. With aggressive timing advance you could run 15:1 A/Fs on a high boosted motor and never know it was running lean. Drop the timing advance down though and you could be running 12:1 and think you were dead lean because of incrediably high EGTs.
03-20-2005, 10:08 AM
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Re: (99_GS-T)
Uberdata forums are the roxor!
http://www.ecimulti.org/uberda...ard=6
the site is down now, but this should take you to the tuning strategies forum. Clikc on one of the two stickies in there and there is a spreadsheet that basically says:
24-18inches = 15:1
18-6inches = 14:1
6-1inches = 13:1
0-3pounds = 12.5:1
3-100 million billion pounds = 12:1 or even less as you approach higher boost/rpm levels
http://www.ecimulti.org/uberda...ard=6
the site is down now, but this should take you to the tuning strategies forum. Clikc on one of the two stickies in there and there is a spreadsheet that basically says:
24-18inches = 15:1
18-6inches = 14:1
6-1inches = 13:1
0-3pounds = 12.5:1
3-100 million billion pounds = 12:1 or even less as you approach higher boost/rpm levels
03-21-2005, 03:02 PM
#23
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Re: (Tchleung)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Tchleung »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Doa WOT run in 3rd egar. at the top of 3rd. Shut down the car completely keep teh cltuch in so the engine fully stops rotating. Pull to the side. then check plugs. Best time to chech plugs for detonation</TD></TR></TABLE>
You should not push on the clutch pedal because the engine water pump will stop turning and same goes for oil pump starving the turbo of oil after a hard run.
The proper way is after your 4th gear pull, switch off ignition and coast until you almost have no speed and then pull over to check plugs. Your turbo and engine will thank you.
You should not push on the clutch pedal because the engine water pump will stop turning and same goes for oil pump starving the turbo of oil after a hard run.
The proper way is after your 4th gear pull, switch off ignition and coast until you almost have no speed and then pull over to check plugs. Your turbo and engine will thank you.
03-21-2005, 04:54 PM
#25
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I was going to say egt also...
I mean its simple,
aside from knock,
if your egt's are overlly high, you know you have something wrong going on with your tune
I mean its simple,
aside from knock,
if your egt's are overlly high, you know you have something wrong going on with your tune