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Balor_Gr's Evo X TD05h-152G6-12T B16 Turbo Build Results

Balor_Gr's Evo X TD05h-152G6-12T B16 Turbo Build Results

 
Old 05-08-2017, 03:23 AM
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Default Re: Balor_Gr's Evo X TD05h-152G6-12T B16 Turbo Build Results

Originally Posted by TheShodan View Post
That's not what I said. In fact, I stated the opposite. Re-read that again, my friend.

I was beeing sarcastic translating a joke from a language to another most of the times fails


They don't change your static compression. that's the quench pads of the GS-R vs. the B16 head.
I know.I meant lower the big static compression.That via overlap.I cant seem to find cam overlap data

Glad to see someone do this...I had a setup like this in mind, especially since Evo turbos are very responsive
Thanks

Last edited by Balor_Gr; 05-08-2017 at 02:55 PM.
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Old 05-11-2017, 09:03 AM
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Default Re: Balor_Gr's Evo X TD05h-152G6-12T B16 Turbo Build Results



Got a pair of slightly used 225/45/17 R888 toyo's.They almost dont fit.But once warmed they are fun.
Spin the 1st gear to get traction for 2nd
Ill put the bumper back on next week when we finalise the boost presure with the new efr
0.6 bar(8.7 psi) actuator i ordered from germany.I dont want a boost controller yet so the boost setup will be done withe the old way
and for that bumper must be off.
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Old 05-12-2017, 01:32 AM
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Default Re: Balor_Gr's Evo X TD05h-152G6-12T B16 Turbo Build Results

looks awesome!
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Old 05-18-2017, 02:39 AM
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Default Re: Balor_Gr's Evo X TD05h-152G6-12T B16 Turbo Build Results

Originally Posted by Cabletie View Post
looks awesome!
Thanks man.
Now a quick video showing were i got oil for the turbo from and how the piping goes.
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Old 05-18-2017, 06:22 AM
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Default Re: Balor_Gr's Evo X TD05h-152G6-12T B16 Turbo Build Results

Interesting. Oil feed from the back of the head. For that size turbo that works. But not for the bigger ones.
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Old 05-18-2017, 07:29 AM
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Default Re: Balor_Gr's Evo X TD05h-152G6-12T B16 Turbo Build Results

Originally Posted by TheShodan View Post
Interesting. Oil feed from the back of the head. For that size turbo that works. But not for the bigger ones.
Actually id like some evaluation of this point for turbo oil feed.Whats your thoughts?
The idea of suplying the turbo with oil from there seemed fine im my mind, but
in life small number of times you are correct.Even smaller number of times you know you are wrong

Last edited by Balor_Gr; 05-18-2017 at 09:01 AM.
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Old 05-18-2017, 10:30 AM
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Default Re: Balor_Gr's Evo X TD05h-152G6-12T B16 Turbo Build Results

Originally Posted by Balor_Gr View Post
Actually id like some evaluation of this point for turbo oil feed.Whats your thoughts?
The idea of suplying the turbo with oil from there seemed fine im my mind, but
in life small number of times you are correct.Even smaller number of times you know you are wrong
Well, really, this is not as uncommon as one would think, but in the Honda world, where usually larger turbos are being used for the same application that require a more "standard" location, what you have right now really isn't bad. If it were any other non-OEM turbocharger I would feel differently, but in this case, it can work.

If I were to say really anything of merit, my only concern particularly, is the material of the line itself. Unlike the oil return line, the oil feed line is subjected to a lot more chances of it being destroyed due to its proximity to so many hot items that could cause problems (e.g. oil leak, fire, smoke, damage to the turbo, etc). At minimum I would put a thermal sleeve around the entire length of the oil feed line. Optimally, a nice, steel braided oil feed line with a thermal sleeve is optimal.

I'd also check to see what actual oil pressure that the oil line is seeing and research whether or not that particular location could cause oil starvation to the cylinder head itself; this is crucial because although the cylinder head technically doesn't have bearings within the caps themselves, there are oil orifices that help the camshaft stay lubricated over time, which is important in cold starts, and higher rpm driving. The B-series was designed to protect the head and bearings first, everything else is a sacrifice. I would just hate to see the cylinder head have damage on it simply because the source you used, drew too much oil away from the head into the turbocharger. After all , that is a large piece of hose you have there. Much larger than what that turbocharger would require.

That's really it, I guess..
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Old 05-19-2017, 10:04 AM
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Default Re: Balor_Gr's Evo X TD05h-152G6-12T B16 Turbo Build Results

Originally Posted by TheShodan View Post
Well, really, this is not as uncommon as one would think, but in the Honda world, where usually larger turbos are being used for the same application that require a more "standard" location, what you have right now really isn't bad. If it were any other non-OEM turbocharger I would feel differently, but in this case, it can work.

If I were to say really anything of merit, my only concern particularly, is the material of the line itself. Unlike the oil return line, the oil feed line is subjected to a lot more chances of it being destroyed due to its proximity to so many hot items that could cause problems (e.g. oil leak, fire, smoke, damage to the turbo, etc). At minimum I would put a thermal sleeve around the entire length of the oil feed line. Optimally, a nice, steel braided oil feed line with a thermal sleeve is optimal.

Thats fair.The hose is hydralic controll hose or what ever its called.63 psi working pressure(230 burst) and working temperature -40 to 100 celsius.Oil temperature
gets higher than 100 for sure some times but ifrom other boosted b-series data i have is like most of them hit 210-250F or 100-120 Celsius max.
But im thinking of these temp protection sleeves.Ill probably get one for the part of the hose its from the turbo all the way to were the downpipe ends.


I'd also check to see what actual oil pressure that the oil line is seeing and research whether or not that particular location could cause oil starvation to the cylinder head itself; this is crucial because although the cylinder head technically doesn't have bearings within the caps themselves, there are oil orifices that help the camshaft stay lubricated over time, which is important in cold starts, and higher rpm driving. The B-series was designed to protect the head and bearings first, everything else is a sacrifice. I would just hate to see the cylinder head have damage on it simply because the source you used, drew too much oil away from the head into the turbocharger. After all , that is a large piece of hose you have there. Much larger than what that turbocharger would require.
Im thinking of trying to measure pressure buti dont know if there is a difference between measuring presure from a hole thats just blocked with a bolt
and measuring presure when oil flows through.Because it would not be wise to measure with the engine running with the turbo without having oil.So ill have to "pass through" measure oil pressure.The turbo has a build in resrtictor of, if i measured correct, 1-1,2mm.Using online calcs at lets say 6 bar the flow is ~ 2litres per minute make it 3 lpm to be super safe, an oem oil pump at 600 rpm flows 5.5 lpm ,
at 5000 rpm 32 lpm.The average b series with some miles on it hits 6 bar close 8000rpm.The oem pump at 8000 rpm should flow at least 40lmp, so the turbo steals like less than 10% flow.
Im considering the stolen flow ok.At least it looks ok im my mind.Lets hope im correct.

That's really it, I guess..
Thanks for discussing this.
1 brain is allways the least amount brain you can use.

Last edited by Balor_Gr; 05-20-2017 at 01:33 PM.
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Old 06-17-2017, 10:47 AM
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Default Re: Balor_Gr's Evo X TD05h-152G6-12T B16 Turbo Build Results

New attempt 0-60 mph or 0-100 km/h if youre from europe.
R888 225/45r17 Boost by right foot.
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Old 06-20-2017, 09:50 AM
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Default Re: Balor_Gr's Evo X TD05h-152G6-12T B16 Turbo Build Results


So i installed a borgwarner "medium boost internal wastegate thats supposed to be 8.8 psi to 15.9 psi depending on preload.
At 0mm preload its supposed to be 0.6 bar.Strangely enought with small amount of preload it was about 7 psi.
Fuark it i said lets try to tighter the screw a lil bit.And yes i was hitting 0.62 bar aka 8.8psi.While we were doing a tune on the street ECU programmer said
it holds stable boost arond 0.6 bar with a small peak like 0.62 around 4000.

A week later i did some street runs and i noticed that during 2nd and 3rd gear after 5500 the boost was droping at ~0.45 to 0.5 bar or ~6.5 to 7.5 psi
On the 4th gear the boost is droping less.


Any ideas on what this could be?


Last edited by Balor_Gr; 06-20-2017 at 01:58 PM.
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Old 06-20-2017, 09:57 AM
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Default Re: Balor_Gr's Evo X TD05h-152G6-12T B16 Turbo Build Results

Load. The load on the engine changes depending on what gear you're in which will affect the boost pressure. You can tune this out if you have boost by gear or gear compensation.

It also depends on where you are picking up the boost reference for the MAP sensor and if the WG is plumbed off the same line. There can be a discrepancy otherwise.
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Old 06-20-2017, 10:53 AM
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Default Re: Balor_Gr's Evo X TD05h-152G6-12T B16 Turbo Build Results

But isnt it strange that the boost drops below actuator's physical lowest boost?
Did a test today just now.It gradualy goes from 0.6 bar to ~0.45 even on fourth gear.
I thought it was droping less on 4th than 3rd but i was mislead by the fact that rpm raising is much slower on 4th than on 3rd gear.
Im loosing like ~3 psi from 4500 to 8000

Last edited by Balor_Gr; 06-20-2017 at 11:40 AM.
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Old 06-20-2017, 11:10 AM
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Default Re: Balor_Gr's Evo X TD05h-152G6-12T B16 Turbo Build Results

Not really. These mechanical devices arent perfect. Have you tried tightening the screw more? Might not be enough preload. I think with your particular turbo you are seeing a spike in pressure that is dropping off as the WG tries to react that quickly to the changes. I had similar issues with my GT2560r where it would flash into power so fast it would hit peak torque and boost would fall back a couple psi as it stabilized. This was an issue I assumed was due to the internal WG as well. It might just be bleeding off too much at the gate itself because the spring is so small it has trouble holding it shut at high VE.
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Old 06-20-2017, 11:41 AM
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Default Re: Balor_Gr's Evo X TD05h-152G6-12T B16 Turbo Build Results


Im adding a curve of about what happens
This is what i see on the boost gauge not on crome via map sensor
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Old 06-21-2017, 04:39 AM
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Default Re: Balor_Gr's Evo X TD05h-152G6-12T B16 Turbo Build Results

Neat setup
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Old 06-23-2017, 02:00 PM
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Default Re: Balor_Gr's Evo X TD05h-152G6-12T B16 Turbo Build Results

Originally Posted by jim chuck View Post
Neat setup
Thanks mate.


Bump for some ideas on whats going on with me loosing boost ?

Bonus video of the journal bearing slowing down time.

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Old 09-15-2017, 01:45 AM
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Default Re: Balor_Gr's Evo X TD05h-152G6-12T B16 Turbo Build Results

Id like you to give me your thoughts about my injectors.I have no idea what im watching haha.
What do you think? One of them seems different.The injectors have like 2-3000 miles.
HALP



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Old 09-15-2017, 07:55 AM
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Default Re: Balor_Gr's Evo X TD05h-152G6-12T B16 Turbo Build Results

Spark plugs seem a bit on the lean side. The injectors themselves may be fine, but the mapping may be off. Go ahead and check you data and head to the Engine Management forum if you have the ability to save any data files for those in the know to see.
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Old 09-16-2017, 04:02 PM
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Default Re: Balor_Gr's Evo X TD05h-152G6-12T B16 Turbo Build Results

I was speaking about injectors cause one of them looks without black on the start of the tip. The first spark plug on the photos.
hmm
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Old 09-16-2017, 05:02 PM
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Default Re: Balor_Gr's Evo X TD05h-152G6-12T B16 Turbo Build Results

Originally Posted by Balor_Gr View Post
I was speaking about injectors cause one of them looks without black on the start of the tip. The first spark plug on the photos.
hmm
Doesn't mean it's an injector issue. You're looking at resultant spark from the injectors. Unless the injector is on a butane flowbench to test flow rate the plugs aren't going to tell much of a story about the injectors.

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Old 10-12-2017, 09:01 AM
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Default Re: Balor_Gr's Evo X TD05h-152G6-12T B16 Turbo Build Results

Since im thinking about forging the engine, ill get valve spring retainers too. Will this valve springs work for turbo with 9-9500 redline?
Cams will be ITR max.Probably GSR since my TD05 has airflow of like 360-400 hp

Item Specifications & Spring Pressure:
Seat: 1.350" @ 80 lbs / Open: 0.900" @ 220 lbs / Coil Bind: 0.765"


Its brian crower.I found a kit with steel retainers on ebay.
BRIAN CROWER RACING DUAL VALVE SPRINGS + RETAINERS KIT HONDA ACURA B16 B18 VTEC | eBay

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Old 10-13-2017, 04:27 AM
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Default Re: Balor_Gr's Evo X TD05h-152G6-12T B16 Turbo Build Results

Originally Posted by Balor_Gr View Post
Since im thinking about forging the engine, ill get valve spring retainers too. Will this valve springs work for turbo with 9-9500 redline?
Cams will be ITR max.Probably GSR since my TD05 has airflow of like 360-400 hp

Item Specifications & Spring Pressure:
Seat: 1.350" @ 80 lbs / Open: 0.900" @ 220 lbs / Coil Bind: 0.765"


Its brian crower.I found a kit with steel retainers on ebay.
BRIAN CROWER RACING DUAL VALVE SPRINGS + RETAINERS KIT HONDA ACURA B16 B18 VTEC eBay
Meh. Never did trust Brian Crower products. Leaves a bad taste.
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Old 10-13-2017, 08:28 AM
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Default Re: Balor_Gr's Evo X TD05h-152G6-12T B16 Turbo Build Results

Yeah somehow me neither.But again you can only be sure with ferrea but this engine wont break the bank haha.
What about the 80lbs tho? Strangely enough its about "preference" ( ) Some run 80lbs some run 85 lbs some run 90lbs.
If i can rev that GSR/ITR cams to like 9300 with the 80lbs cams id take em over the highest wear 85 or 90lbs springs.

Last edited by Balor_Gr; 10-13-2017 at 08:48 AM.
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Old 10-13-2017, 12:07 PM
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Default Re: Balor_Gr's Evo X TD05h-152G6-12T B16 Turbo Build Results

Originally Posted by Balor_Gr View Post
Yeah somehow me neither.But again you can only be sure with ferrea but this engine wont break the bank haha.
What about the 80lbs tho? Strangely enough its about "preference" ( ) Some run 80lbs some run 85 lbs some run 90lbs.
If i can rev that GSR/ITR cams to like 9300 with the 80lbs cams id take em over the highest wear 85 or 90lbs springs.
I wouldn't go over 90 on the seat pressure with such a mild camshaft. It may close the valve too quickly. Heavy isn't always better. For most Honda camshafts no more than 70 pounds of seat pressure are more than enough.
Again, you can always go with another company, like even Supertech. But I've never trusted Brian Crower and their measurements and numbers, sorry.
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Old 11-30-2017, 09:09 AM
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Default Re: Balor_Gr's Evo X TD05h-152G6-12T B16 Turbo Build Results

Looks like im 30 years late with the dual-Y turbo manifold. Found this today:



Rest of the story and why this manifold had an open T4 turbo straped on it at the end haha.
THE FORD SIERRA RS500- A LEGEND THAT WOULD'VE BEEN EVEN BETTER IF FORD DIDN'T OVERRULE COSWORTH'S PLAN... - STAV-TECH

I wouldn't go over 90 on the seat pressure with such a mild camshaft. It may close the valve too quickly. Heavy isn't always better. For most Honda camshafts no more than 70 pounds of seat pressure are more than enough.
Again, you can always go with another company, like even Supertech. But I've never trusted Brian Crower and their measurements and numbers, sorry.
I changed plans and im going full FERREA on the head. Id like to be on the safe side with mixing head components. With what i know so far im with you on the lbs i wouldnt go more that 85 lbs. Strangely enough the 4pistons recomend the 110lbs for every setup ??? Is this maybe because of the pressure the air creates opening the valve on the FI applpications?
Isnt this gonna cause premature cam and rocker(dont remember how its called a english) damage?

What would you recomend from the ferrea? Redline 9500 maybe 9700 max. Cams will get bigger eventually but not much. I wont go super big cams cause ill try to keep a/r low(probably divided too)
Im considering the 95lbs cam


Last edited by Balor_Gr; 11-30-2017 at 09:34 AM.
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