b16a Turbo Questions.(Will i feel the lack of torque when racing SRT-4's & EVO's?)
06-24-2005, 08:02 PM
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b16a Turbo Questions.(Will i feel the lack of torque when racing SRT-4's & EVO's?)
i have a 95 si with a jdm sir2 b16a. i wanted to avoid changing the bottom end to like a b20 or an ls. i just wanted some opinions...
heres an example, lets say i'm up against an srt-4 in a drag race...
i have a 1.6 liter DOHC turbo lightweight civic hatchback.
but he has a 2.4 liter DOHC Turbo like 3100 lb car.
lets say i'm at 6psi and he's at his stock 6psi or so, he's got about like 225 hp and 230tq to the wheels.
now the turbo b16 sir2 should be at like 205whp and about 150 wheel torque right? now i am just wondering...how badly will i feel this diffrence in torque? will a stock srt4 really beat a turbo b16 that badly with numbers like this? i know i have a weight advantage but thats a lot of torque difference, i just wanna build my b16 so that it can keep up with or even beat these srt4's, evo's and sti's
will it make that much of a difference if i got a b20 block and did a 2.0 liter dohc vtec turbo instead of the 1.6 liter dohc vtec turbo? obviously to keep with the cars i listed i would need to boost to at least 10-12 psi but i just wanna know how much this torque difference really matters.
heres an example, lets say i'm up against an srt-4 in a drag race...
i have a 1.6 liter DOHC turbo lightweight civic hatchback.
but he has a 2.4 liter DOHC Turbo like 3100 lb car.
lets say i'm at 6psi and he's at his stock 6psi or so, he's got about like 225 hp and 230tq to the wheels.
now the turbo b16 sir2 should be at like 205whp and about 150 wheel torque right? now i am just wondering...how badly will i feel this diffrence in torque? will a stock srt4 really beat a turbo b16 that badly with numbers like this? i know i have a weight advantage but thats a lot of torque difference, i just wanna build my b16 so that it can keep up with or even beat these srt4's, evo's and sti's
will it make that much of a difference if i got a b20 block and did a 2.0 liter dohc vtec turbo instead of the 1.6 liter dohc vtec turbo? obviously to keep with the cars i listed i would need to boost to at least 10-12 psi but i just wanna know how much this torque difference really matters.
06-24-2005, 08:06 PM
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Re: b16a Turbo Questions.(Will i feel the lack of torque when racing SRT-4's & EVO's?) (slammedef06)
This post is suited more for the Forced Induction forum. (torque = pulling power) roughly speaking .B20 or higher boost will make a difference
Modified by Del Sizzle at 9:23 PM 6/24/2005
Modified by Del Sizzle at 9:23 PM 6/24/2005
06-24-2005, 09:57 PM
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Re: b16a Turbo Questions.(Will i feel the lack of torque when racing SRT-4's & EVO's?) (Del Sizzle)
a stock srt pushes 15 psi.
if you want torque, you'll need displacement. throw on a b18 or b20 block and your compression could go up depending on which pistons you use.
becnh racing doesn't work but let's just try this
stock srt weighs about 2900 lbs and has 230 hp at the wheels... 2900/230=12.6lbs/hp
stock civic si weighs 2300 lbs and lets say you have 205 hp... 2300/205=11.22lbs/hp
as far as power to weight goes, you have an advantage. of course there are othe factors like driver skill and some other stuff.
just boost it and race to find out. if you dont win, turn the boost up a bit.
if you want torque, you'll need displacement. throw on a b18 or b20 block and your compression could go up depending on which pistons you use.
becnh racing doesn't work but let's just try this
stock srt weighs about 2900 lbs and has 230 hp at the wheels... 2900/230=12.6lbs/hp
stock civic si weighs 2300 lbs and lets say you have 205 hp... 2300/205=11.22lbs/hp
as far as power to weight goes, you have an advantage. of course there are othe factors like driver skill and some other stuff.
just boost it and race to find out. if you dont win, turn the boost up a bit.
06-24-2005, 10:08 PM
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Re: b16a Turbo Questions.(Will i feel the lack of torque when racing SRT-4's & EVO's?) (MiMiK)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by MiMiK »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">a stock srt pushes 15 psi.
if you want torque, you'll need displacement.
becnh racing doesn't work but let's just try this
stock srt weighs about 2900 lbs and has 230 hp at the wheels... 2900/230=12.6lbs/hp
stock civic si weighs 2300 lbs and lets say you have 205 hp... 2300/205=11.22lbs/hp
as far as power to weight goes, you have an advantage. of course there are othe factors like driver skill and some other stuff.
just boost it and race to find out. if you dont win, turn the boost up a bit.</TD></TR></TABLE>
Wrong forum but MiMik is correct you have the advantage on the power to weight ratio on many cars non honda.
if you want torque, you'll need displacement.
becnh racing doesn't work but let's just try this
stock srt weighs about 2900 lbs and has 230 hp at the wheels... 2900/230=12.6lbs/hp
stock civic si weighs 2300 lbs and lets say you have 205 hp... 2300/205=11.22lbs/hp
as far as power to weight goes, you have an advantage. of course there are othe factors like driver skill and some other stuff.
just boost it and race to find out. if you dont win, turn the boost up a bit.</TD></TR></TABLE>
Wrong forum but MiMik is correct you have the advantage on the power to weight ratio on many cars non honda.
06-24-2005, 10:24 PM
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Re: b16a Turbo Questions.(Will i feel the lack of torque when racing SRT-4's & EVO's?) (slammedef06)
you people amaze me. no motor under 2 liters is going to give you any decent amount of torque. Honda realizes this, so they decided to compensate it with higher RPMs. If you want more torque, get a 4.785 final drive. and get some more boost.
think about it like this, if you're at sea level, you have 14.7 psi, right?
so a NA motor at best is going to see 14.7 psi. so that means....
14.7 = 160 (stock b16a2 hp)
14.7 = 180 (stock jdm b18c hp)
now if you were to give each motor 7 lbs of boost that would be running at 21.7 psi instead of 14.7
now with simple proportions you can get this....
21.7 = 236.19 (stock b16a2 with 7lbs of boost)
21.7 = 265.71 (stock jdm b18c with 7lbs of boost)
now lets see, if your target number is that 265 (jdm b18c with 7lbs of boost)
then lets see how much boost you'd need....going back to the proportions.... and you come up with the magical number of....9.71 lbs of boost!
so there you have it, run 38% more boost than a b18c and you'll have the same numbers.
theoretically of course.
i'd just get a different final drive. cause afterall, the only difference between the b18 and the b16 is piston speed
think about it like this, if you're at sea level, you have 14.7 psi, right?
so a NA motor at best is going to see 14.7 psi. so that means....
14.7 = 160 (stock b16a2 hp)
14.7 = 180 (stock jdm b18c hp)
now if you were to give each motor 7 lbs of boost that would be running at 21.7 psi instead of 14.7
now with simple proportions you can get this....
21.7 = 236.19 (stock b16a2 with 7lbs of boost)
21.7 = 265.71 (stock jdm b18c with 7lbs of boost)
now lets see, if your target number is that 265 (jdm b18c with 7lbs of boost)
then lets see how much boost you'd need....going back to the proportions.... and you come up with the magical number of....9.71 lbs of boost!
so there you have it, run 38% more boost than a b18c and you'll have the same numbers.
theoretically of course.
i'd just get a different final drive. cause afterall, the only difference between the b18 and the b16 is piston speed
06-24-2005, 10:27 PM
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Re: b16a Turbo Questions.(Will i feel the lack of torque when racing SRT-4's & EVO's?) (MiMiK)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by MiMiK »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">becnh racing doesn't work</TD></TR></TABLE> yes it does, you just gotta know what you're doing 
06-24-2005, 10:42 PM
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Re: b16a Turbo Questions.(Will i feel the lack of torque when racing SRT-4's & EVO's?) (slammedef06)
I just installed a t3/t4 hybrid on my bone stock b16a3 with oem exhaust 
and i can run right beside my friend's mustang cobra svt with catback exhaust. My car is running insanely rich right now so its kind of inconsistent but when its running good i can pull him. So to answer your question im running 7-8 psi in a del sol and can beat srt-4s 
and i can run right beside my friend's mustang cobra svt with catback exhaust. My car is running insanely rich right now so its kind of inconsistent but when its running good i can pull him. So to answer your question im running 7-8 psi in a del sol and can beat srt-4s
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06-25-2005, 05:57 AM
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Re: b16a Turbo Questions.(Will i feel the lack of torque when racing SRT-4's & EVO's?) (o'malley_808
ok so even though im at 1.6 liter, the power + higher redline + weight will make up for all that torque/pulling power of the srt4/evo/sti. ok maybe i'll just stick with the b16 block. thanks also which would be better for my goal of eventually 400whp a t25 or a t3/t4 turbo?
06-25-2005, 06:05 AM
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Re: b16a Turbo Questions.(Will i feel the lack of torque when racing SRT-4's & EVO's?) (o'malley_808
Time and time again:
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by BauleyCivic »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Category 2 (Includes written warning from moderator, and editing/locking of thread or post in question):
NOTE: Any repeat violation of a Category 2 rule will warrant an automatic 2% deduction from your user rating.
2.E. Posting e-racing threads in '92-00 Civic / Del Sol is not allowed. Any thread that asks “Which car will win?” or “What will my car run with xxxx mods?” will be locked immediately. Do not post these threads unless you have a timeslip or dyno graph and can back up your claim with concrete information.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
Please read the rules and regulations posted:
https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=990205
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by BauleyCivic »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Category 2 (Includes written warning from moderator, and editing/locking of thread or post in question):
NOTE: Any repeat violation of a Category 2 rule will warrant an automatic 2% deduction from your user rating.
2.E. Posting e-racing threads in '92-00 Civic / Del Sol is not allowed. Any thread that asks “Which car will win?” or “What will my car run with xxxx mods?” will be locked immediately. Do not post these threads unless you have a timeslip or dyno graph and can back up your claim with concrete information.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
Please read the rules and regulations posted:
https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=990205
06-25-2005, 06:21 AM
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Re: b16a Turbo Questions.(Will i feel the lack of torque when racing SRT-4's & EVO's?) (bense)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by bense »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">you people amaze me.</TD></TR></TABLE>
Yeah. Same here.
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> no motor under 2 liters is going to give you any decent amount of torque. Honda realizes this, so they decided to compensate it with higher RPMs. If you want more torque, get a 4.785 final drive. </TD></TR></TABLE>
Everything else you said will definitely help, of course, but the JDM final drive is a lot of bang for the buck, and a modern Hondata will go a long, long way to providing whatever power you want.
Modern computers and tuning work wonders.
Yeah. Same here.
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> no motor under 2 liters is going to give you any decent amount of torque. Honda realizes this, so they decided to compensate it with higher RPMs. If you want more torque, get a 4.785 final drive. </TD></TR></TABLE>
Everything else you said will definitely help, of course, but the JDM final drive is a lot of bang for the buck, and a modern Hondata will go a long, long way to providing whatever power you want.
Modern computers and tuning work wonders.
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