RaceCleaner24

Hey guys, my name is Brenden and I would like to thank you guys for the awesome information that you have had up on this website, it's helped me to many times to count. This will be my first post and I'm really hoping you guys can help.

The car:
2000 Honda Civic sir
B16 block with b16a2 head
Garret 57 trim turbo
Eagle rods
Cp Pistons
9:1 compression

About 2 mouths ago I rebuilt the whole engine. Got a new block and put in some eagle rods and cp Pistons. Grabbed my old head that I've always used and went through the whole head and put everything back together

For about day one it started smoking a little bit, but I figured considering it was a greasy built engine I needed to give it some time. After about 2 or 3 thousand km I started to introduce a little boost, about 6 psi. Car was running strong but the smoke keeped coming and finally at about 4 or 5 thousand I'm was so bad that it was obvious it wasn't just the break in. I had a small lose of power, good amount of white smoke and was loosing coolant. Not to mention the chocolate milk in my catch can and oil cap.

I figured I had a warped head because I didn't think to check it. Pulled the head and there was some coolant wash on all four cylinders, I checked the block and head to make sure they were flat and they seemed perfect. So I cleaned it all up and put it all back together. Right away without any boost I'm puffing white again. Much less then before but still there. I started to fear that there was a crack in the head so I kept driving it for about 800 km and to my surprise it got worse again. Lose of power more smoking. So I pulled the head again today. Coolant wash on two of my cylinders. I rechecked to make sure the block and head were flat... They are. No visible cracks in the head. I'm going to get my head pressure checked but I don't think that's it. It wouldn't get worse, better then worse if it was a crack in the head or block would it? Why won't it seal?

A little more information:
I have arp head studs installed
I am using arp Molly lube
I am torquing to 80 ft of torque in the Honda pattern
The first head gasket I used was the fel pro ultra torque
The second head gasket I used was from BECK
The third one I am going to use is the stock HONDA one
On a side note I have retarded my ignition timing Alot across the board, I'm 99% sure it's not pre det lifting the head

Any advice would be appreciated

Thanks in advance guys, I'm starting to pull my hair out

NotARaCist

iTrader: (1)

Exactly how are you checking your head and block for trueness? Are you torquing straight to 80 ft/lbs, or are you doing it in multiple steps?

tony_2018

What do you mean by this


How did this happen even though you stated you went through the whole head, whatever that means but I'm assuming you did get it checked out

All in all, whatever you meant by went through the whole head just went out the window and you should've taken it to a machine shop before even slapping it on your block. Not to mention the block should've been checked as well. You may say its a new block but to me it could be a used block that you honed yourself and didn't bother check for warpage.

White_EG1

So you started burning coolant/smoking while N/A, then you decide to turbo it?

RaceCleaner24

It was a head that I was just using on a know good motor, I put new valve springs and retainers, valve seals and checked valve guides, I also re lapsed the valves. that's what I meant by "went through the head". I didn't however check the head for warping mainly because I forgot and it was a head I have had check not long before. The block has maybe 30 000 km on it and I did check it before putting it in. I torqued down the head in 3 steps to 80, 20-50-80 I believe but can't remember exactly. And no I didn't turbo it after it was burning coolant lol. It was a boosted b16a2 with stock internals but as the km climbed and me wanting a little more power I decided to rebuild it with forged internals. It's burned coolant ever since. Always been boosted.

I went to a local machine shop and borrowed his straight metal bar used to check for warping (can't remember what it's called). And both the block and head look pretty much perfect. I used different angles and used a light to see if I could see through. I couldn't. Yesterday I took the whole head down to the machine shop to make sure I was attually checking it right and he said that the head looked near perfect and that I should be looking somewhere Elise. I borrowed his bar and re-checked the block as well and it looked just as good

RaceCleaner24

no I didn't turbo it after it was burning coolant lol. It was a boosted b16a2 with stock internals but as the km climbed and me wanting a little more power I decided to rebuild it with forged internals. It's burned coolant ever since. Always been boosted.

RaceCleaner24

RaceCleaner24

I torqued down the head in 3 steps to 80, 20-50-80 I believe but can't remember exactly

NotARaCist

iTrader: (1)

When was your torque wrench last calibrated?

RaceCleaner24

Never lol, I honestly didn't know you had to, it's about a year or so old. But it's a small one and maxes at 80 ft. Could that be an issue?

NotARaCist

iTrader: (1)

Well, is it a beam type, or a clicker? If it's a clicker, and you're storing it without loosening it first, then you've probably all sorts of screwed up the calibration. Bad calibration = bad reading = not the torque values you think they are = undertorqued head.

wantboost

iTrader: (2)

Are you going back and hot-torquing the head studs? Typically after a few heat cycles on a fresh engine everything loosens up.

RaceCleaner24

That's very possible, I do store it loosened but I don't trust it. I'll pick up a new one to be safe

RaceCleaner24

I haven't re torqued the head studs after a few heat cycles. But you gotta under stand that it's RIGHT away. It get worse over time but one I put the new gasket in last I literally drove it down a couple of blocks until the engine warmed up and parked it and it had already begun to smoke. Not a lot mind you but enough that it wasn't normal

RaceCleaner24

I also should mention that I replaced the intake manifold gasket to ensure it wasn't coming from that. I'm planning to get the head pressure checked and milled. Is there anything Elise I can do to try and make this the last time I have to pull the head? Any tips or tricks would be helpful

wantboost

iTrader: (2)

Are you sure you don't have any lines backwards? Swapping a coolant line and vacuum line is more common than you think and would explain why it only smokes after coolant gets up to temp because when the thermostat is closed there's no coolant flow.

RaceCleaner24

I don't believe so but I will check, never thought about that

wantboost

iTrader: (2)

Have you done a compression test yet? That would tell you right away if it's a headgasket. If it's bad enough to smoke it's bad enough to see there.

Also do you have a wideband? You would see an AFR change with the loss of compression. If it turns out it's an improperly connected coolant line you would also see an AFR change. Typically if the gasket is damaged enough to let coolant enter the combustion chamber the engine will run rough almost constantly. Maybe not on a cold start but once the coolant is up to temp and the system pressurizes you would notice a constant rough running condition. Sometimes the gasket can be gone enough to let coolant in under vacuum when it's cold but at that point the car would barely run and certainly wouldn't be drivable whatsoever. If it's a coolant line then it should be causing it to run rough all of the time.

Another way to tell is if you pull the radiator cap while the engine is running. Since air and pressure would be entering the cooling system you'd see bubbles.

Another thing to consider is a sunken or cracked sleeve. If the sleeves are stock then it won't be a sinking issue but you could have a crack somewhere. Coolant in the oil is a definite sign that something isn't sealing so it's either a sleeve or the gasket/head. If the studs were torqued properly you won't have any head lifting issues, especially not at the minimal power levels you're at.

How are you checking the block and head for flat mating surfaces? Are you using a calibrated straight edge or what?

RaceCleaner24

The first time the head gasket blew I used a compression test I was down on all cylinders and was missing all constantly. I pulled it from the road pretty quick once it got that bad. This time I did not however do a compression check. The Sytoms were the same and I I figured I would just get the head pressure checked. I checked the head and the block with a straight edge that I got from my local machine shop. It was a blue point used just for checking to make sure it was flat. I do have a wideband and it seemed to lean out across the rev range as it got worse. Not much but enough that it was noticeable ( it has also gotten a lot colder where I live which could also cause that). But it was rough missing at light throttle and idle. Full throttle seemed fine until lose of power

RaceCleaner24

Well my head is cracked between cylinders 1-2. Thank you for all your guys help and fast response

B and B

iTrader: (3)

I wonder why they didn't see it at that time?
Cracked inside somewhere hard/impossible to see?

wantboost

iTrader: (2)

That's a really weird place to crack a head. How big was the crack?