Krazy4379

I'm wantint to build up my 98 LS in my EG Coupe (2060lbs w/driver). I'm headstrong on boosting it. I'm wanting to bump it up to a 84.5mm bore 2.0L. What would u do resleeve it with some JE low CR pistons an boosting it. Or leave it a 1.8L an turbo it from there. I'm ordering an STR block saver keep in mind. It'll be mostly strip but streetable when i feel like taunting the RUSTangs an SLOWmaro's. But as the old saying goes "there's no replacement for displacement".
oh yeah what gains can i expect from the new bore and reliability.

What sleeves would u use an where can i find them via WWW

Krazy4379

anyone?

1bar

i would stay with stock bore that way u have a little room for error. and everyone here will tell u to consider a standalone like hondata. happy 4th

Krazy4379

Hondata 2b for sure....i forgot to mention that

93LSivic

Screw 84.5mm and screw hondata.

Stay 81mm, build it to rev. Go aem for management. Hondata is useless for setups that need to be worked on more then once.

Armaan

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 93LSivic &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Screw 84.5mm and screw hondata.

Stay 81mm, build it to rev. Go aem for management. Hondata is useless for setups that need to be worked on more then once.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Since your going straight LS, I wouldn't build it to rev (lack of LMA's). My setup sounds a bit like yours.

Engine: 1993 B18A1
Golden Eagle Mfg. Godzilla 84.5mm Sleeves
Wiseco 9.2:1 Pistons
Crower 4340 Rods (stock length)
Portflow Cyl. Head (B18A1)
Ferrea 1mm OS SS Valves
Crower Ti Retainers
Portflow DVS
Portflow Bronze Valve Guides
Crane Stage 3 #14 Cams

Turbo System
Precision SC61
Precision 850cc Injectors
Precision FMIC
AEM EMS Ver. 1.0

Websites:

http://www.GoldenEagleMfg.com
http://www.AEMpower.com
http://www.precisionturbo.net
http://www.Portflow.com
http://www.Crower.com
http://www.Ferrea.com
http://www.cranecams.com

Krazy4379

how would u build it 93lsivic...an explain why. I've done the research but every setup is different an all the information does not pretain to my setup specifically. thanks

boosted92

IMHO, 84.5MM doesn't give you any room to rebuild, and if you plan on pushing it to hang with some mustangs and camaros that seems like it's going to happen in your future. I'd stick with 84MM, or go down to an 83MM bore, which will still give you a bunch of power over stock, but let you bore it out again incase something goes wrong.

93LSivic

The lighter the moving assembly the happier the motor when revving high. LS can goto 9000 easily. I take mine to 8500 on the street all the time and have been to 9000 at the track.

LS motors need head work, period. Get them to flow and the power will come.
The setup above is nice, but like I said Im not a fan of large bore motors. For instance, there 84.5 9.0:1 pistons are 12 grams heavier then 81 9.0 slugs. Thats 48 grams in added pistons weight, then you have added pin weight also. IMO high revving motors should be kept lightweight.
There is a lot that needs to be looked into for this type of application. Bearing tolerances, piston/wall specs, etc will need to be looked at.

tony1

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 93LSivic &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Screw 84.5mm and screw hondata.</TD></TR></TABLE>

That's gotta be some of the worst advice i've ever heard...

DIRep972

iTrader: (1)

I kinda agree with Dan and I also agree with Arman.

about the bore size. From what ive seen between 81mm bore LS's and 84.5mm LS/B20 dynos boost for boost, set up for set up, the 2.0L LS's don't really make much more peak power. However, they do make a TON more torque, specifically from 4k-5500k rpm's. After 5500 if u compare a 2.0L LS dyno to a 1.8L the torque curves will be pretty close. Reason why is the stock LS head already struggles filling the 1.8L w/ air after 5500 you can see this by looking @ the torque curve fall off. Put that same head on a 2.0L it has the same problem after 5500. 2.0L will have alot of power in the area that ur not using it. This is on stock head of course.

IMO. The best thing you can do for an LS motor is shove alot of boost in it. The head design isn't as good but it can be improved on w/ headwork. The cams are low lift and the valves are 31mm opposed to 33mm like the vtec. Once u open up the head to flow more you will start seeing benifits of revving past 7k and the bigger bore would be more beneficial too.

Of course this is just my take on it. Big bore w/ stock head is just gonna make power where u aren't gonna use it and roast tires. Either run stock bore w/ alot of boost and make ur power that way, or spend alot of money on headwork, cams, valvetrain, and rev it up to 8500 big bore and all that jazz and make even more power.

DaveF

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by tony1 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

That's gotta be some of the worst advice i've ever heard...</TD></TR></TABLE>


to each his own right?

id say go with the new dfi gen 7, speed-pro(FAST), or autronic

go ls/VTEC as well, and add the block girdle...

screw an ls cyl head..damn paper weights.

tony1

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 2.2Lcivic &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">


to each his own right?

id say go with the new dfi gen 7, speed-pro(FAST), or autronic

go ls/VTEC as well, and add the block girdle...

screw an ls cyl head..damn paper weights.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Now that's a recommendation i'd agree with...

edit: recommending one thing over another isn't a big deal, but when you're saying screw this and screw that to products and ideas that have been proven, it just doesn't make sense.

Mr. Softee

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by tony1 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Now that's a recommendation i'd agree with...

edit: recommending one thing over another isn't a big deal, but when you're saying screw this and screw that to products and ideas that have been proven, it just doesn't make sense.</TD></TR></TABLE>

well put. hondata is nothing to say "screw" to, people have made some great setups with its simple user friendly software.

93LSivic

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by tony1 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

That's gotta be some of the worst advice i've ever heard...</TD></TR></TABLE>

Hey, well just because some of us work on 8 second race cars doesnt mean that advice needs to be taken from them either. I only said screw hondata simply cause its not a "racers" standalone......speaking primarily of the basic systems that offer no user interface options. For the money of their system that is tuneable, I would suggest a system that is capable of going beyond what the stock honda ecu allows in ways of features.

Seems like you always want to lash out at me, but its cool, no laws against freedom of speech and its great to express ones own opinions. But you gotta sometimes come down off that horse of yours....I like what you have to say often, but at times I dont agree with you either. I can easily say that you give wrong advice when your expect every persons turbo setup to be #1 in track condition form, but as a daily driven vehicle it may not be the best because there has to always be some kind of tradeoff when reliability and longevity is an issue as well.

tony1

Whoa, calm down tiger. The original post is asking about bore size and he states he going to use an str blockgaurd. That in itself should tell you he's not building a race car and more than likely will have a tuner tune the car and be done with it, perfect for hondata. There are a ton of other systems available that are good, but the benefits of almost all of them over hondata are extra features that most people (espicially street cars) won't need. Very few aftermarket computers are as good a computer as a honda...

I'm not out to lash out on you. If you look back, this time and the only other time i've contradicted you is when I felt you were giving wrong advice. You say screw hondata, fine, although it's one of the best systems available for a street car. You say ACL bearings are the best and that hondas are a waste of money, fine, although honda bearings are far superior to acls. Just out of curiosity, what is some of the wrong advice i've given. I try not to respond unless i'm absolutely sure of what i'm about to say, so i'm curious where i went wrong? I don't feel like i am on a high horse, I give advice and help tons of people with their problems. Maybe you think i only get on here to criticize you? Well, hate to break it to ya buddy, but i help alot more people on here than you know...

DIRep972

iTrader: (1)

hey guys get along. Tony and Dan both you guys give good advice, not quite as good as mine but still pretty good.

and oh yeh. Hondata is cool. now its 2 against 1.

Krazy4379

THanks for your help guys/gals. I'm keeping it non vtec to show all my B18c-r Gsr an h22 EG friends that one a coupe can be fast an non vtec turbo will be fast.....never underestimate the little people.

The head is going to be completely redone on my bosses flow bench an shop. i can't realy understand for one it'll be mostly strip with street fun.

Could u list the pros an cons of the 84.5mm bored b18b1 an at the bottom the explanations an opinons....thanx bunch u guys are helping soo much

93LSivic

I completly understand that you help lots of people on this board, Im not saying you dont. I listen to you just as everyone else. But it seems that when you disagree with someone then thats the bottom line, the other person is dead wrong.
About the ACL's, I do favor them in some rebuilds, some I dont. Why dont I see you in the threads where Earl and Rocket are talking about them.....both of those 2 stand behind them and often say they wouldnt use anything other.
Hondata is just another issue that often times I dont want to get into but its almost like Im biting my tongue when in every post people are like hondata hondata hondata. To me, the whole hondata issue is this. Its a beginners ems, when it comes time to take the next step and really expand the performance of anyones car then go with something else.....I push aem but FAST, autronic, DFI, haltek etc are all better systems then hondata will every be on any day of the week. But again, only for someone that wants more out of their car. Would you guys run it on the racecar? Does anyone who is fast run it on their turbo racecar? I know Im camparing apples to oranges in terms of use right there........but IMO that just what hondata and other systems are, apples and oranges.
I'll squash this now.

Oh, and Chris........you'll need to step up someday soon too. Your getting faster and faster and you know that you'll need to faze that hondata **** out soon enough

tony1

The only reason i like hondata so much is for the simple reason that it works. In my opinion it works just as good as Motec and much better than most systems available. The honda ecu is much better that most aftermarket ecus and consistently has smoother power curves than most ecus. Hnodata has more datapoints and has better interpolation beween cells than most any other computer. I do not like, however, all the **** you have to go through to change anything. That is why i would't run it on a race car where things do get changed alot. On a street car it's great though. I bet chris would make less power on an aem or speed pro. Just my opinion though. Oh, and Dan, I have no problem with you or your thoughts. The only reason i said anything on the acl topic was because you said anyone who uses honda bearings is just waisting money, and that's just not true. You can recommend them all you want, but don't stay stuff like that that's not true.

Krazy4379

Uh i'm not realy worried about my engine management right now this is about the bore size an thus far im still confused but hey i got some good ideas as far as EMS.

DIRep972

iTrader: (1)

on bore size you need to decide if you are going to run stock sleeves w/ block guard or sleeves. Cuase I noticed in ur first post u mentioned both.

With the stock sleeves/block guard the only option is stock bore.

With aftermarket sleeves its up to u, heres a thread that might help you decide on bore size https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=543984

basically my argument on big bore LS was that unless you are doing some serious head work you are just making power where you can't use it and you are better off just pushing more boost through it.

DIRep972

iTrader: (1)

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 93LSivic &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
Oh, and Chris........you'll need to step up someday soon too. Your getting faster and faster and you know that you'll need to faze that hondata **** out soon enough </TD></TR></TABLE>

Im hondata4life now haha. After the tuning seminar I realized why Hondata is so bad ***.

Speed PHreak

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by boosted92 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">IMHO, 84.5MM doesn't give you any room to rebuild, and if you plan on pushing it to hang with some mustangs and camaros that seems like it's going to happen in your future. I'd stick with 84MM, or go down to an 83MM bore, which will still give you a bunch of power over stock, but let you bore it out again incase something goes wrong.</TD></TR></TABLE>

I run a 2.0L LS, 84.5mm bore on darton sleeves with wiseco 8.5:1 compression slugs. Dartons are the ****, blow a cylinder guess what? pull that bitch and drop a new one in

93LSivic

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Speed PHreak &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

I run a 2.0L LS, 84.5mm bore on darton sleeves with wiseco 8.5:1 compression slugs. Dartons are the ****, blow a cylinder guess what? pull that bitch and drop a new one in </TD></TR></TABLE>

Good point Steven. Any other sleeve company you would be paying out the *** to get where you were before things went south.

Tony. As stated in the post about the acl's. I think I corrected my self on that statement i made about wasting money later in the thread......something like the money saved could have gone else where. I thought i did anyhow. You are right though, but sometimes people word things bass ackwards. Like for instance, if above you were to say "I dont agree with what 93LSivic says on this, I would suggest hondata for x, x, x reasons." If this was the case, then I wouldnt have taken offense and we wouldnt be having this conversation. Oh well, its all good.

Chris. I cant wait to attend the NJ Strader seminar, maybe I'll see the light and understand why hondata is just so "badass" Then again, maybe it'll open my eyes as to why my current standalone is better then i think it is already