Tuning Part II: Back to the Dyno
 

As many of you know, I had the R tuned a couple of weeks ago with mixed results. Based on some of the feedback I received, I decided to go back to a different tuner - not to get higher numbers, but to fix the A/F ratio. The car was running way, way too lean.

Original thread:
https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=865098

I took the car to Protech Performance in Austin this morning. Tuning went well. Today was about 15* hotter than the first tuning session and we go about exact same hp numbers: 176 and gained a few in torque: 123. The real deal is the A/F ration is now much. much better.

This graph shows a weird drop at 4500 - he did a pass with VTEC set there and it failed. VTEC has since been set to 5300 so the curve looks a bit different, but I don't have that graph right now.

Overall I'm happy - the cars pulls hard and feels great and I now have some peace of mind. https://honda-tech.com/forums/images/smilies/emthup.gif

My mods are as follows:
TODA spec A cams
TODA Cam Gears
TODA Valve springs
J's Racing Intake
Spoon 4-2-1 Header
Carsound Cat
Fujitsubo RM-01A cat-back
TODA flywheel

http://www.we-todd-did-racing.com/we...MXk1NDE%3D.jpg

That is still way too low IMO. I've seen Type R's with a Hytech or SMSP setup make 190 whp pretty easily....with a broad powerband...and on stock cams...

Re: Tuning Part II: Back to the Dyno (Flux)
 

I wouldn't worry about the numbers that much. I have a similar setup (Toda A's, AEM, JDM DC 4-1 w/ Carsound and stock exhaust) and made almost that exact amount. In fact I even have that little flat spot at ~6500.

Re: Tuning Part II: Back to the Dyno (GeeReg)
 

4600-5500 looks like there is still power to be made.

Re: Tuning Part II: Back to the Dyno (Flux)
 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Flux &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Yeah, I'm not worried about the numbers at all. </TD></TR></TABLE>

Sorry, I didn't mean to imply that you were. I just meant not to worry if alot of people tell you you should be making more.

Re: (Justin Klemgold)
 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Justin Klemgold &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">That is still way too low IMO. </TD></TR></TABLE>

Well, that is what the number is on my car with my mods on this day on that dyno. https://honda-tech.com/forums/images...s/emsmilep.gif

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by GeeReg &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Sorry, I didn't mean to imply that you were. I just meant not to worry if alot of people tell you you should be making more. </TD></TR></TABLE>

I was agreeing with you. https://honda-tech.com/forums/images...s/emsmilep.gif I'm not concerned with the peak numbers.

Re: Tuning Part II: Back to the Dyno (GeeReg)
 

As long as your happy, then don't worry about what others think. I posted in your other post and mentioned the a/f ratio. It looks wat better now. https://honda-tech.com/forums/images/smilies/emthup.gif

Yep, it's your car...I was just giving my opinion.

Re: (Justin Klemgold)
 

Looks better.

That header is a huge bottleneck...that should be your next upgrade.

I don't get not setting Vtec at 4500?

Re: (Tweakmeister)
 

I know some of you ITR owners hate the 1/4 mile, but your trap speed will tell you how much your putting to the ground. Dyno is for tuning and supra's. https://honda-tech.com/forums/images/smilies/emwink.gif

Re: (AussieR)
 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by AussieR &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I know some of you ITR owners hate the 1/4 mile, but your trap speed will tell you how much your putting to the ground. Dyno is for tuning and supra's. https://honda-tech.com/forums/images/smilies/emwink.gif</TD></TR></TABLE>

Can't judge everything by the quarter mile either...it's pretty useless on a road course...you know, where the real drivers go. https://honda-tech.com/forums/images/smilies/emwink.gif https://honda-tech.com/forums/images...s/emsmilep.gif https://honda-tech.com/forums/images/smilies/emthup.gif

Re: (Justin Klemgold)
 

I looked at the other thread and didn't see anything I'd call too lean. Sort of like every engine is different widebands can read +/-0.1 different in error as well as as long as the car makes power and doesnm't detonate it probably isn't too lean. Assuming it isn't FI that is.

I would not worry too much about the numbers there could be any number of reasons the numbers alone don't match up. Do you beat on your car? I mean drive it hard and rev it high daily?

Re: (Asahi)
 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Asahi &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I looked at the other thread and didn't see anything I'd call too lean. Sort of like every engine is different widebands can read +/-0.1 different in error as well as as long as the car makes power and doesnm't detonate it probably isn't too lean. Assuming it isn't FI that is.

I would not worry too much about the numbers there could be any number of reasons the numbers alone don't match up. Do you beat on your car? I mean drive it hard and rev it high daily?</TD></TR></TABLE>

I was concerned about being too lean after some feedback by some respected members of this board - it probably wasn't anything too bad, but once the issue was raised by those I trust I needed some peace of mind before putting the car on the track.

I don't beat on the car - it is not a daily driver and when I do drive I often will not even go into VTEC at all when just driving around town. The car was autox'd hard for a few years though... https://honda-tech.com/forums/images...s/emsmilep.gif

Re: (Flux)
 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Flux &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

when I do drive I often will not even go into VTEC at all when just driving around town. </TD></TR></TABLE>

I think it's time to sell the car https://honda-tech.com/forums/images...s/emsmilep.gif

Re: (Tweakmeister)
 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Tweakmeister &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

I think it's time to sell the car https://honda-tech.com/forums/images...s/emsmilep.gif
</TD></TR></TABLE>

https://honda-tech.com/forums/images...s/emsmilep.gif

Don't worry, it gets plenty of days to stretch it's legs...

Re: (Flux)
 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Flux &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

I was concerned about being too lean after some feedback by some respected members of this board - it probably wasn't anything too bad, but once the issue was raised by those I trust I needed some peace of mind before putting the car on the track.

I don't beat on the car - it is not a daily driver and when I do drive I often will not even go into VTEC at all when just driving around town. The car was autox'd hard for a few years though... https://honda-tech.com/forums/images...s/emsmilep.gif </TD></TR></TABLE>

Good enough I'd say 13.9 is lean but not danerously as long as the ignition timing isn't too advanced.

I've found a direct correlation between power and how hard a car is driven. Many of my freinds baby their cars unbelievably and the majority seem to be down a few HP.

Re: (Tweakmeister)
 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Tweakmeister &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">That header is a huge bottleneck...that should be your next upgrade.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Actually for his setup it really isn't, he may gain a few hp with a Toda Header or Custom header like Hytech or SMS but the Spoon Header did pretty good for itself in tests like the Great header Test. (where it came in 3rd after the Toda and SMS)

Re: Tuning Part II: Back to the Dyno (Flux)
 

Glad to see it went well, I'm sure the car feels amazing https://honda-tech.com/forums/images/smilies/emthup.gif

Re: Tuning Part II: Back to the Dyno (Flux)
 

Did you get these guys https://honda-tech.com/forums/images/smilies/embeer.gif when you got there? https://honda-tech.com/forums/images...s/emsmilep.gif

glad it looks better. Does the butt dyno say more power?

Re: Tuning Part II: Back to the Dyno (Bbasso)
 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Bbasso &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Did you get these guys https://honda-tech.com/forums/images/smilies/embeer.gif when you got there? https://honda-tech.com/forums/images...s/emsmilep.gif

glad it looks better. Does the butt dyno say more power?</TD></TR></TABLE>

Butt dyno doesn't really say more power, but is does feel smoother and more intense in the power delivery. The rush to redline is unreal...

Re: Tuning Part II: Back to the Dyno (Flux)
 

thats great, smoother is faster.

https://honda-tech.com/forums/images/smilies/emthup.gif - good tuning.

Re: (Justin Klemgold)
 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Justin Klemgold &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">That is still way too low IMO. I've seen Type R's with a Hytech or SMSP setup make 190 whp pretty easily....with a broad powerband...and on stock cams...</TD></TR></TABLE>

We probably publish our dyno figures too quickly, because people get the wrong idea.

On a different Dynojet here in Virginia on, say, a 70 degree day with low humidity, maybe he'd have seen 190. https://honda-tech.com/forums/images...es/emsmile.gif

Dyno tuning means you're looking for the best the owner wants out of the car as far as the compromise between peak, power band and driveability. The actual figures mean less than the curve on the graph.

Re: (Tweakmeister)
 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Tweakmeister &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
That header is a huge bottleneck...that should be your next upgrade.
</TD></TR></TABLE>

If somebody already owned a Spoon header, I'm not sure I'd tell him to get a different one.

If somebody were starting from stock and going for ultimate, I would recommend SMSP or another, but it's not like the Spoon is a bad choice, is it?

Re: (George Knighton)
 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by George Knighton &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

We probably publish our dyno figures too quickly, because people get the wrong idea.

On a different Dynojet here in Virginia on, say, a 70 degree day with low humidity, maybe he'd have seen 190. https://honda-tech.com/forums/images...es/emsmile.gif

Dyno tuning means you're looking for the best the owner wants out of the car as far as the compromise between peak, power band and driveability. The actual figures mean less than the curve on the graph.</TD></TR></TABLE>


https://honda-tech.com/forums/images/smilies/emthup.gif https://honda-tech.com/forums/images/smilies/emthup.gif

Re: (George Knighton)
 

your car makes 78 more hp then this

http://autopix.homenetinc.com/2001/Suzuki/Esteem.jpg