iheartintegras

Problem: Shifter wobbles back and forth about 4" even when in gear.

I've searched this and found a million threads, but everyone kept saying to replaced the bushings. I've already replaced the bushings and that did not help. The shift linkage is wobbling all the way to the transmission. What do I need to replace to fix this problem?

Diagram here:
http://www.hondaautomotivepart...LEVER

I replaced 17, 15, 20.


EDIT: Actually meant to post this in the civic forum but it's the same as a 'teg.

bmwe362006

make sure the 10 mm on 9 are tight. If so replace 8

forcefedferio

that and the bolt that connects the shifter to the linkage, i believe it is number 24 on the diagram

drive4aliving

iTrader: (1)

if all else fails

#13 is the problem

Dr. DC2

very unlikely

DC2-ProdUcTiOnS

iTrader: (2)

i was having the same problem....

i tightened #25 and slid a few new washers in there to tighten it up.....

oh and dont go too tight....i did and had to get back under there and loosen it....

you would have had to been Arnold to change gears.....lol

MUCH MUCH TIGHTER now....

babyboy53190

If it is in gear and it wobbles from left to right. it is number 13.

the hole where the "bitch pin" goes in has been damaged from using the incorrect tool/ size tool to remove the pin.

Lift your car up, and put it in gear, you will see it wobbles in that area. that is was happened to a few of my buddies, including me.

Replace number 13, or borrow somebody linkage, and you will most likely see the difference.

iheartintegras

Yeah I did notice that it shift linkage wobbles all the way to the transmission. However when I looked at the pin I didn't notice anything obviously wrong with it.

drive4aliving

iTrader: (1)

care to explain?

iheartintegras

Took another look at it yesterday, there is no play between the shifter (2) and the shift linkage (13). When I wobble the shifter back and forth, the linkage moves with it.

gourley

I would check #24,25,4,5,12. When I had a EK Hatch my shifter would move all over the place and it ended up being those bushings. Also like others said, check your "bitch pin" #28. Also I would take out the "bitch pin" and inspect the shifter shaft coming out of the back of the transmission and the hole where the "bitch pin" goes through. It might be worn and may need replacement.

drive4aliving

iTrader: (1)

hows the joint on number 13?

Mike_Rodriguez8

Did you ever fix this issue. I've got a 2000 dx with a whole lot of play from left to right even in gear. Ive been to busy to take a look, but maybe this weekend I can finally get under the car, and check some things out....!!!!

Ramirez428

Rather than starting a new thread i figured i would continue with this one so i can post my findings.

Recently i Purchased a transmission from Chris at WDR & he did a complete overhaul on it.

Prior to the install my shifter didn’t have much play. After the install i had a bit of play but wasn’t that concerned because i was too exited from the Straight cut gears lol.

Today I Replaced the shifter with a New Fastline shifter. It came with new Delrin bushings & all the other bushings got replaced with energy suspension bushings along with #8 in the honda diagram.

However because of the added hight from the Fastline shifter The left to right play while being in gear is allot more noticeable

video from inside the cabin.


A close up me moving the shifter linkage joint where it meets the tranny shaft. Which i think is the culprit! though i hope its not a tranny issue.


&


then a video of the play with me moving the shifter from inside (some fast side to side motions and some slow)


Do you guys think if i replaced the linkage (13 in the diagram) that would solve the play?
Im worried that it could be the hole in the transmission shaft itself (bitch pin hole) that could be the issue (slightly larger than the linkage) perhaps?
I would hate to take the tranny back out and ship it back to Chris if it is the tranny shaft.

Hopefully i provided everyone with enough footage and info to help me figure out the exact culprit.

thadon805

iTrader: (3)

I tried figuring this out on my '94 DB8 GS-R with 79k original miles for a whole YEAR..

The lateral movement was never crazy loose in neutral or in gear on my gsr but it bothered me because my 2000 ITR w/ 45,000 original miles was very tight in later movement in neutral or in gear.. I contributed it to the fact that the ITR had a different Shift Linkage (without the weight on it like gsr/ls etc)

It wasn't until I had purchased a 1994 Integra 4 door LS with 39,000 original miles... I noticed the side to side movement in neutral or in gear WAS very tight (like the type r), and i was pretty sure the shifter/linkage was the exact same as the GSR's. I knew i wasn't just OCD, it felt just a tiny bit tighter than the gsr's.

SO, I bought energy suspension polyurethane bushings #15 & #17 (on the oem diagram)... and DID NOT notice any improvement...

a month later I ordered #4 , #5, #12 , #24 (everything on OEM diagram that the bolt goes shifter bolt to linkage goes thru ) and sure enough, I DID NOT NOTICE ANY IMPROVEMENT.Also, the parts i took off STILL looked new.. had no play..

I should mention, I never had any problems with my gsr trans, no pop outs, no grinds or ANYTHING.

SO i took it to my buddy and asked him if he thought it could be the "U-Joint" on the shift rod (the joint right before where the bitch pin goes in. He didnt find ANY play in the U-Joint part of my shift rod... ansd he said it looked like play from the input shaft ( i believe thats what its called.. the part that the shift linkage attaches to via bitch pin)


Fast forward like a year later.. I buy a BRAND NEW IN BOX USDM ITR Transmission.. take it to synchrotech to get a oem 98 itr 4.785 final drive & LS 5th gear installed.. then to my buddies house to get the trans installed the next day..

soon as it was installed, the first thing I did was check the lateral play in neutral and in gear. and what do you know, it's tight like my '00 ITR wit 45k miles & '94 LS wit 39k miles.

So maybe there the input shaft part of transmission (where the shift rod attaches via bitch pin) gets loose over time ? I don't have experience with tearing down/building transmissions but thats my best guess..

Ramirez428

I appreciate your input brotha.

I hope thats not the issue in my case, since the transmission literally only has about 2000 miles at the most after Chris at Whoopee Doo racing rebuilt the entire thing. I would hate to miss trackways waiting on removal/shipping/labor time/install.

I have ordered a new itr shift rod from Honda (13) in the diagram, Around $50 not that bad. Hopefully that arrives soon so i can bolt it on real quick and test it.

I have a feeling its the Shift rod because you can see it has play where it meets the input shaft? the joint moves but the input shaft has no play until i get to the end of the lateral movements.

If the new rod and bitch pin doesn’t solve it then ill have to remove the tranny and ship it to back to Chris.

Granted i know NSX’s have cable shifters but every time i drive mine (literally almost no play) then i drive the Teg and it just annoys me.

Ill post my results as parts arrive.

Tough this also looks promising.


Its not released yet but I’m willing to give that a try also.

thadon805

iTrader: (3)

"I have ordered a new itr shift rod from Honda (13) in the diagram, Around $50 not that bad. Hopefully that arrives soon so i can bolt it on real quick and test it."

If you don't have one already, you might want to get a ITR weighted shift **** or skunk2 replica, or whatever shift **** as long that it's a weighted one. It's my understanding that because the ITR shift rod does NOT have the weighted part on the shift rod(#13 gs-r/rs/gs/ls shift rod above in diagram you posted, the weghted part is to the right of the "22" part number digit) compared to LS/GS-R , it needs a weighted shift **** to even shifting feel out.


Quoted from RockingaRHard from:

https://honda-tech.com/acura-integra...nkage-2507811/

The ITR shifter does not have a weight while the GSR does.
there is a difference is the way the shifter feels, one reason why the ITRs have a heavy shifter ****. To make shifting more percise and easy. The GSR's shifter **** is lighter there for requiring a weight on the linkage."


as for the new shift rod purchase, it definitely DOES NOT hurt to try especially with the U-joint free play you are experiencing. I have heard of people using "c Clips" (i think thats what they are called) in the u joint to prevent the freeplay, but a new shiftrod is doing it the RIGHT way. If the new shiftrod doesnt fix the play, then perhaps it could be your trannsmission input shaft. OR maybe it could be a worn out #8 in the part diagram ? Ive never replaced a #8 but maybe they can go bad, im not sure. I know mugen or either spoon sells a hard rubbber durometer shift bushing kit as well and it is part #'s 11 ,15 & 17 in above diagram.. I bought energy suspensions shift bushing kit but the only pieces are number 15 & 17 in Polyurethane.

OmarR

iTrader: (12)

This past summer I ordered all new OEM Honda parts in the first diagram except for #7 as that boot has no factor in shifter play and the linkage bushings in which I used Hardrace bushings instead. Yes, I even ordered a new shift lever even though my old one was perfectly fine.

Anyway, I still have a small amount of play in my shifter and honestly it's about the same amount as before I replaced everything. There was over 150k on the original shift linkage. I didn't want to leave any possibility overlooked so it's fair to say there really isn't one particular part that can fix the loose shifter feeling. I can make a video showing the bit of play I still have if anyone's interested.

thadon805

iTrader: (3)

so with that being said, maybe it is indeed play in the transmission's input shaft.. as i stated before, after my brand new transmission was installed, freeplay was eliminated.

Ramirez428

I appreciate the input guys.

I do still have my old ITR weighted shift **** but I’m not really concerned about the “feel” aspect of it since the fastline shifter has a big weight right above the pivot point/ball. If anything the shifts feel easier because of it.

Colin @ Auto fair honda should have my shift linkage in the next few days so ill have a confirmed answer here soon, hopefully.

My snap-on guy also had this on the truck today

HONDA?ACURA AIR HAMMER SHIFT LINKAGE PIN R&R TOOL #656

No more using bolts or rigs to remove the pin. This will also insure i don’t damage the new linkage during the pin install.

thadon805

iTrader: (3)

The heavier weighted **** "throws" it into gear with a nice & solid feel, and i imagine it combined with the extended length of the fast line shift extension would amplify the effect.

I encourage you to try it :D

IN VTEC

iTrader: (3)

I like the idea of a modularised piece to replace the components that wear, but don't like the new joint fixturing. I'd have to see some testing that twists the one end with the other fixtured to see if it'll either match the OEM piece or withstand the worst case torque.

IN VTEC

iTrader: (3)

Looking at the videos, it's isolated to 3 components. But you can probably rule out the outboard component because you'd be able to see the play in the video.

I'd separate the linkage which you'd have to do anyways to send it back for repair, then run the bitch pin through the ID of the other 2 components. Then replace any components where there's no interference fit.

If it's the shift rod, then it's one of the more minimally invasive procedures you can do on a Honda manual transmission. After the transmission is out I'd say it would take me about 15 mins to replace it and the seal then maybe another 15 to clean and reseal the transmission casing. Beats having to lug it, pay for 80-110 lbs of shipping, and the downtime.

Maybe have Chris comp you for the self repair if it was part of the original refurbish contract. I never check that part of the transmission when overhauling trannies but given this occurrence, consequence of the failure, and the ease of the inspection I would justifiably include it as a part of any overhaul now. I'd recommend Chris do the same given the aging transmissions out there.

IN VTEC

iTrader: (3)

To remove the pin without all the fancy pneumatics...5/16" rolled punch pin p/n 42218 if you don't want to buy the whole set but it's quicker to just go to the store and buy the set. I've never used any of the other pins if you think that you might justify the whole set.

http://m.sears.com/craftsman-6-pc-ro...a=00943167000P

Ramirez428

Just a bit of a update

Shift linkage came in today.

Itr Part number just Incase someone wants it


Actually the Air hammer I purchased was cheaper than the roll pin set. Came out to $19 and some change after a I used a coupon at Home Depot.



Literally 3 easy trigger pulls and that roll pin was out. It took me longer to jack the car up than roving and installing the the new pin

I got the shift linkage installed



Besides the weight missing on the shifter end, the neck is acutually a bit longer where it connects to the transmission shift rod. I know because I can no longer peel the boot far enough to expose the shift rod.

Unfortunately I still have the play. It did eliminate a little of the play, though honestly I think it's just the fact that I used a new roll pin.

I could visually see the transmission shift rod roll pin hole is worn out slightly larger (from years of being used).

In the future for anyone reading this thread that has replaced all bushings possible and shift linkage it's your transmission shift rod that needs to be replaced.

I'll contact Chris and see what we can figure out. I do have a helms though I honestly don't feel comfortable taking it apart. I also don't want to void any warranty I might have from him.

Thanks again guys. Ill post back up when I have the shift rod replaced.