Full Race B-series GT Stage I (plots, impressions and comparisons)
07-21-2005, 12:04 PM
#1
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Full Race B-series GT Stage I (plots, impressions and comparisons)
visit below link for more information:
https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=1330493
--------------------------------------------------------
Full Race Stage I GT (non-AC)
GT28RS (Disco) with T3 hot housing
B18C1
81.5mm
Stock sleeves and crank
Stock cams and gears
Stock TB
750cc
AEM EMS
Eagle rods
9:1 Mahle pistons
Toda valve springs
ATS Carbon Clutch
USDM P73 tranny
P73 head with very, very mid port job
Victory X intake manifold
-------------------------------------------------------
First off, I can't tell you how fun this setup is to drive. I've done lots of big "make boost after 6K" setups on Honda's and this, by far, is the most enjoyable to drive around town. Linear power with lots of area under the curve makes this package very nice to shoot around on the back roads as well as the interstate.
Most of the SR20DET crowd are in love with this turbo and I do agree, it makes the RWD platform more "driftoslaptackular", but this little guy on the B-series is
<U>P.S.
Boost controller will be installed this weekend......I'll have ~18psi plots up next week
</U>
Anyway, long story short:
Previous setup was a completely stock OBDI USDM B18C1 with a 8psi JRSC, 440's, Kamikaze 3inch header and the AEM EMS. Put out 181 on the Mustang Dyno.
Then the mods at the top were installed and ran at 9.5psi putting out 265
Note: NOT DYNOJET numbers
See below:
Before and after overlaid (JRSC at ~8psi, Turbo at ~9.5psi)
Same data from above, but shown in a "deltas" format
And just for a different type of comparison:
"Jordo" 's old Full Race Stage III non-GT plot on a completely stock B18C5 at 9psi.
Same data from above just shown in "deltas" format
Note: the massive about of mid range the Disco gives over the t3/67
https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=1330493
--------------------------------------------------------
Full Race Stage I GT (non-AC)
GT28RS (Disco) with T3 hot housing
B18C1
81.5mm
Stock sleeves and crank
Stock cams and gears
Stock TB
750cc
AEM EMS
Eagle rods
9:1 Mahle pistons
Toda valve springs
ATS Carbon Clutch
USDM P73 tranny
P73 head with very, very mid port job
Victory X intake manifold
-------------------------------------------------------
First off, I can't tell you how fun this setup is to drive. I've done lots of big "make boost after 6K" setups on Honda's and this, by far, is the most enjoyable to drive around town. Linear power with lots of area under the curve makes this package very nice to shoot around on the back roads as well as the interstate.
Most of the SR20DET crowd are in love with this turbo and I do agree, it makes the RWD platform more "driftoslaptackular", but this little guy on the B-series is
<U>P.S.
Boost controller will be installed this weekend......I'll have ~18psi plots up next week
</U>
Anyway, long story short:
Previous setup was a completely stock OBDI USDM B18C1 with a 8psi JRSC, 440's, Kamikaze 3inch header and the AEM EMS. Put out 181 on the Mustang Dyno.
Then the mods at the top were installed and ran at 9.5psi putting out 265
Note: NOT DYNOJET numbers
See below:
Before and after overlaid (JRSC at ~8psi, Turbo at ~9.5psi)
Same data from above, but shown in a "deltas" format
And just for a different type of comparison:
"Jordo" 's old Full Race Stage III non-GT plot on a completely stock B18C5 at 9psi.
Same data from above just shown in "deltas" format
Note: the massive about of mid range the Disco gives over the t3/67
07-21-2005, 04:03 PM
#2
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Re: Full Race B-series GT Stage I (B18CXr)
i agree 
this is a sick street setup, and the nissan guys love this turbo. response is under-rated on here. most of the guys who work at the shop (just not me and javier) have little turbos like these. lots and lots of fun
this is a sick street setup, and the nissan guys love this turbo. response is under-rated on here. most of the guys who work at the shop (just not me and javier) have little turbos like these. lots and lots of fun
07-21-2005, 04:18 PM
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Re: Full Race B-series GT Stage I (B18CXr)
Looks good - but you ever consider a GT28R? The smaller turbine tends to make it REALLY outspool the GT28RS. For comparison, on an SR20DET, a GT28R will make 16 psi by ~3400 RPM, while a GT28RS needs until about 4100 RPM to do that. Compressors are very similar, and the turbines are close enough with the nod slightly going to the RS for both. The RS only flows a bit more at higher pressure ratios anyway, which you wouldn't be using on a Honda.
FYI - most SR20DET guys don't like the GT28RS. It's too laggy for the power. The GT2871R with a 0.64 A/R turbine is the darling turbo for SRs now, since it'll spool up 400 RPM sooner than a GT28RS and make way more power up top(I've seen a bit over 370rwhp on it).
FYI - most SR20DET guys don't like the GT28RS. It's too laggy for the power. The GT2871R with a 0.64 A/R turbine is the darling turbo for SRs now, since it'll spool up 400 RPM sooner than a GT28RS and make way more power up top(I've seen a bit over 370rwhp on it).
07-21-2005, 05:37 PM
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Re: Full Race B-series GT Stage I (Def)
one of the guys here had a 28R on his s13 and it just had no top end. it had plenty down low, but the lack of top end was disappointing. the 2871R as well as a few of the newer bushing turbo combos have proven to work a bit better.
07-21-2005, 05:42 PM
#7
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Re: Full Race B-series GT Stage I (Full-Race Geoff)
Jack, I need to fly out there and just hang out for a few days. 
You do all of these neat tests all the time. I had a similar experience tuning a stock GSR block with a GT2871RS turbo... It was amazing having full boost (and torque) down low. Keep the tests and comparisons coming.
You do all of these neat tests all the time. I had a similar experience tuning a stock GSR block with a GT2871RS turbo... It was amazing having full boost (and torque) down low. Keep the tests and comparisons coming.
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07-21-2005, 06:16 PM
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Jack, in your opinion, if I have a stock b16 in an '00 Si what would you recommend to setup a basic full race stage 1 GT kit and have it be reliable? I don't want to adjust boost-I just want to set it and leave it. Would I need to build the block, get a better intake manifold, etc? I don't want to go overboard I just want some good power for a reasonable price especially since I am not made of money and the kit alone is $3800. However, I am definitely getting a clutch to handle the added power. Would I need to add a 3" cat back exhaust with this kit? I live in Georgia so the drive wouldn't be much to get your help in person when it all comes together.
07-21-2005, 06:20 PM
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Also I was thinking of getting an evo instead of turboing my car. Do you think that I would get more enjoyment out of this kit on my car than a stock evo? I am at a crossroads and I don't have much of a reference point to make a decision. The only turbo car I have ever driven was a friend's STi.
07-21-2005, 09:10 PM
#11
Re: Full Race B-series GT Stage I (Full-Race Javier)
sick...cant wait to order mine hopefully in the upcoming two weeks. how would you feel about a gt2871r .62 a/r on a stock block b18c1? im looking for great midrange...while not just falling on my face on the top end...
07-21-2005, 09:16 PM
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Re: Full Race B-series GT Stage I (yehiknowrite)
I know the GT28RS did 350whp and 340wtq on a SR motor at dontblinks shop so on a honda motor with a better flowing head it would do more I am sure
07-21-2005, 11:23 PM
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Re: Full Race B-series GT Stage I (Full-Race Geoff)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Full-Race Geoff »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">one of the guys here had a 28R on his s13 and it just had no top end. it had plenty down low, but the lack of top end was disappointing. the 2871R as well as a few of the newer bushing turbo combos have proven to work a bit better.</TD></TR></TABLE>
The 28RS is the same way since the compressor has almost the same flow capacity as the 28R wheel.
The reason why the 28RS keeps climbing on a smaller displacement Honda is the higher flowing head, bigger cam and low pressure ratio. On an SR the engine wants to make the power in the midrange, so you run more pressure to make the power. Ends up with a relatively weak topend. Takes something with a much bigger compressor wheel(like a 2871R) to keep the power up on top.
Anyway, my point was it's worth a try if you wanted really quick spool and wouldn't think it's the end of the world if your power peaked somewhere other than redline. I think a GT28R would work especially well on a B16A since it'd need more help spooling a turbo and it'd be efficient all the way to redline.
The 28RS is the same way since the compressor has almost the same flow capacity as the 28R wheel.
The reason why the 28RS keeps climbing on a smaller displacement Honda is the higher flowing head, bigger cam and low pressure ratio. On an SR the engine wants to make the power in the midrange, so you run more pressure to make the power. Ends up with a relatively weak topend. Takes something with a much bigger compressor wheel(like a 2871R) to keep the power up on top.
Anyway, my point was it's worth a try if you wanted really quick spool and wouldn't think it's the end of the world if your power peaked somewhere other than redline. I think a GT28R would work especially well on a B16A since it'd need more help spooling a turbo and it'd be efficient all the way to redline.
07-22-2005, 05:30 AM
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Re: Full Race B-series GT Stage I (Full-Race Javier)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Full-Race Javier »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">ya...those tomato potatoes are fun. my first turbo'd beater had a GT28R on it...instant trq = </TD></TR></TABLE>
my first turbo beater had a gt28r too! wait a minute....
nice to see the little guys can still push some power on 1.8's.
</TD></TR></TABLE>my first turbo beater had a gt28r too! wait a minute....
nice to see the little guys can still push some power on 1.8's.
07-22-2005, 08:42 AM
#17
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Re: (1slowb16)
i havent been impressed with the even gt28rs's top end. turbine chokes it up pretty good on the top end, i couldnt immagine at normal gt28r. all that said, we did make 375hp wiht this turbo on a 84mm b16
07-25-2005, 06:23 PM
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Re: Full Race B-series GT Stage I (B18CXr)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by B18CXr »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Previous setup was a completely stock OBDI USDM B18C1 with a 8psi JRSC, 440's, Kamikaze 3inch header and the AEM EMS. Put out 181 on the Mustang Dyno.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
Wow, what a ghey setup. He should sell all that crap.
Modified by mrlegoman at 3:09 PM 7/26/2005
</TD></TR></TABLE>
Wow, what a ghey setup.
He should sell all that crap.Modified by mrlegoman at 3:09 PM 7/26/2005
07-25-2005, 06:30 PM
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Re: Full Race B-series GT Stage I (Full-Race Geoff)
thats a really nice powerband..
btw, my dyno i had a quarter size whole in my charge pipe, so that isnt a true comparision.
what is the difference in gt28r, gt28rs, gt2871r
btw, my dyno i had a quarter size whole in my charge pipe, so that isnt a true comparision.
what is the difference in gt28r, gt28rs, gt2871r
07-27-2005, 04:13 AM
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Re: Full Race B-series GT Stage I (mrlegoman)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by mrlegoman »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
Wow, what a ghey setup. He should sell all that crap.
Modified by mrlegoman at 3:09 PM 7/26/2005</TD></TR></TABLE>
ghey setup for a ghey guy . I'll give $1 for the whole thing!
Wow, what a ghey setup.
He should sell all that crap.Modified by mrlegoman at 3:09 PM 7/26/2005</TD></TR></TABLE>
ghey setup for a ghey guy
. I'll give $1 for the whole thing!
07-27-2005, 07:14 PM
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Re: Full Race B-series GT Stage I (o-man)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by o-man »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">ghey setup for a ghey guy . I'll give $1 for the whole thing!</TD></TR></TABLE>
Your almost funny. Sure I'll sell it to you for a 1$, shipping will be about 40$ and handling will run around 1000$.
. I'll give $1 for the whole thing!</TD></TR></TABLE>Your almost funny. Sure I'll sell it to you for a 1$, shipping will be about 40$ and handling will run around 1000$.
08-04-2008, 06:59 PM
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