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 Gears Grinding?
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Bense
Neither enemy Nor friend.



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8703 posts [101%]
1.565 to 1.259 Columbia, SC
3-17-2003


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  Gears Grinding?« » Reply  Edit


I've explained this several times over an IM conversation and I'm just getting sick of doing it. So I'll continue to clean this up to try to make it easiesr on myself to explain to you guys

I'll do my best to explain using a D16Y8 2nd gear as example.

Here is a picture of an assembled d16y8 countershaft (thanks Jason!)

I'm going to try to keep from getting too technical here, so someone might read this and be like (you left a bunch of stuff out. Yes, Mista Bone I mean you )

okay, here we go:

The following items are locked onto the countershaft and they don't spin:
synchro hub
synchro sleeve
the synchro sleeve can freely move a slight amount (see the brass tab that is between the synchro hub teeth)

2nd gear spins at high rpms on the countershaft.

When you are engaging 2nd gear the synchro sleeve slides down towards 2nd gear. When this occurs the brass synchro bites down onto the gear cone (pictures below) and it acts like a brake that stops 2nd gear from spinning. That's it. All it is is a brake pad for your gears!

After many many gear shifts, the synchro teeth begin to wear out. Just like a brake pad would. Eventually they will wear out so much that it will be the dog teeth hitting the teeth on the synchro sleeve. This is what happens when gears "GRIND"

So what happens when the gears grind long enough? The dog teeth start to wear out and the sleeve is no longer able to fully engage the gear. When this happens, your gears begin popping out of gear.

synchro sleeve (note the dog teeth on the inside)

New synchro, notice the ribbed teeth that bite down onto the gear cone.

you can see the gear cone here, also notice how worn out the dog teeth are.


A way of measuring the life of the synchros (92-95 D trans)

Ignore these pics for now, I'll elaborate on gear cone scuffing later
http://i107.photobucket.com/al...5.jpg

http://i107.photobucket.com/al...7.jpg



mustang5.slow
* B A N N E D *



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1371 posts [96%]
Los Angeles map quest 90022 CA
12-26-2006
 « Re: Gears Grinding? (Bense)« » Reply  Edit


will do.



B A N N E D

b16a4




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1175 posts [100%]
Miami FL
11-11-2006
 « Re: Gears Grinding? (mustang5.slow)« » Reply  Edit


Thank you so much tranny guru.

i want a step by step picture tutorial on rebuilding/changing syncros on a tranny


b16a4




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1175 posts [100%]
Miami FL
11-11-2006
 « Re: Gears Grinding? (b16a4)« » Reply  Edit


http://www.xm-parts.com/articles/hgear/gear.htm

rebuild tranny


twinj




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68 posts [100%]
College Park Ga
2-19-2007
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good write up

99TegLSt




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36 posts [100%]
Pittsburgh PA
3-21-2007
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thank you! at least now i understand why my car grinds going into second when i try to shift fast. Would having a short throw shifter have any effect on wear and grinding? I as many have heard alot of different things.

Bense
Neither enemy Nor friend.



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8703 posts [101%]
1.565 to 1.259 Columbia, SC
3-17-2003


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 « Re: (99TegLSt)« » Reply  Edit


only if you are shifting too fast for the synchro to slow down or speed up (match gear speed) of the gear.

candy eg




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2680 posts [96%]
Its raining game in Northern California
10-21-2004
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pm'd you a question, sorry for the newbieness.



-daily driven kandy painted '92 honda civic hatchback dx
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MAFDARK




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1712 posts [100%]
Albany/RIT
2-24-2004
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any reason why my sleeve would be bad and not so much the syncro?



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clayne




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398 posts [100%]
California/New Zealand
12-9-2004
 « Re: (Bense)« » Reply  Edit


Bense, unrelated question: is the indentation pattern on that helical gear normal or a sign of wear on just that set?



Modding Hondas since '96

Bense
Neither enemy Nor friend.



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8703 posts [101%]
1.565 to 1.259 Columbia, SC
3-17-2003


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 « Re: (clayne)« » Reply  Edit


Quote, originally posted by clayne »
Bense, unrelated question: is the indentation pattern on that helical gear normal or a sign of wear on just that set?

New gear from the dealership in the bag has those indentations.

I love waiting 4 months to respond to questions


IN VTEC




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9500 posts [101%]
Bloomington IN
1-27-2000
 « Re: (Bense)« » Reply  Edit


I've got a K20A2 (X2M5) second gear that has been pounded into failure and maybe a synchro hub that has signs of chatter on it if you want pictures to show people what to look for in terms of failure modes.



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Mista Bone
Trans Master



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7130 posts [101%]
Cincity OH
10-21-2001
 « Re: (clayne)« » Reply  Edit


Quote, originally posted by clayne »
Bense, unrelated question: is the indentation pattern on that helical gear normal or a sign of wear on just that set?

those notches are for oiling purposes.





"D" Tranny Guru

The 92-95 S20 tranny page....
http://home.cinci.rr.com/mistab0ne/tranny.html

http://www.d-series.org




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4323 posts [100%]
Formerly GearspeedEF7 SoCal
2-20-2004
 « Re: (Mista Bone)« » Reply  Edit


Quote, originally posted by Mista Bone »

those notches are for oiling purposes.

We use them for Identification purposes



Hit me up for Gear-X Final Drives, Transmission Building and Race Spec parts!!! 4.6 4.7 4.9 Final Drives available! SOHC 4.9/GSR and B16 4.9 FD Blowouts!! PM for details!

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2029 posts [100%]
Speeding through California
2-27-2006
 « Re: Gears Grinding? (mustang5.slow)« » Reply  Edit


good write up!



#0552

Quote, originally posted by JDMF22B »
I hardly doubt the convo went like this...

Cop:Yo, kid. You hit my friend, pay up 1300 or ur getting raped. LATE

Got some sick new wheels! No more Rotas.


cachehx




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21 posts [100%]
Rexburg Idaho
11-3-2006
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all of my dog teeth seem to have some wear on them (a little bit rounded).
I will be replacing the synchros... but how big of a deal are the dog teeth??
should i replace them, or are they not that big of a deal?

they arent quite as bad as the last pic that Bense posted earlier...

thanks



Modified by cachehx at 8:38 PM 12/25/2007


bigb16




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70 posts [100%]
Waterford MI
3-8-2007
 « Re: Gears Grinding? (Bense)« » Reply  Edit


Great writeup. Now I know why my car is popping out of 5th.



93 Civic DX Hatch full interior
-Peakboost turbo kit (dented DP into a 2.5" catback )
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