stevenk

Anyone ever tryed the drop spindles from ht motorsports?

stevenk

Guess not.

TunerN00b

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by stevenk &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Anyone ever tryed the drop spindles from ht motorsports?</TD></TR></TABLE>

What problem are you trying to solve?

I ask, because every single other person who has come in here and asked about these, was trying to solve a problem that these parts won't help solve.

Also, search the archives. This has come up before.

johnlear

Never tried them, but in theory they'll allow you to substantially lower the chassis without messing up the suspension geometry, i.e. 'virtual swing arm' length, roll centre location etc. Just lowering the stock suspension on lowering springs with no other changes can badly affect these geomtries (unless the lowering is relatively mild).

TunerN00b

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by johnlear &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Never tried them, but in theory they'll allow you to substantially lower the chassis without messing up the suspension geometry, i.e. 'virtual swing arm' length, roll centre location etc. Just lowering the stock suspension on lowering springs with no other changes can badly affect these geomtries (unless the lowering is relatively mild). </TD></TR></TABLE>

That theory is not applicable for the EG/DC chassis that is being discussed here (what the drop spindles are for).

Lowering by 1.5" on an EG/DC will do nothing but improve the suspension geometry (better CG and RC location, steeper point in the camber curve, etc.). The only thing negatively affected is the total amount of compression travel, which a drop spindle would affect the same way (due to the tire itself running out of travel space).

stevenk

OK so here they are in the car drop looks good, but they moved the axle up two inches and the axle is hitting / riding the damper fork so hard the car can't move.[URL]http://i140.photobucket.com/al...9.jpg[URL]http://i140.photobucket.com/albums/r13/stevek92/9-15-08014.jpghttp://i140.photobucket.com/al....jpg

TunerN00b

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by stevenk &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">OK so here they are in the car drop looks good, but they moved the axle up two inches and the axle is hitting / riding the damper fork so hard the car can't move.[URL]http://i140.photobucket.com/al...9.jpg[URL]http://i140.photobucket.com/albums/r13/stevek92/9-15-08014.jpghttp://i140.photobucket.com/al....jpg </TD></TR></TABLE>

And yet, that ride height through "traditional lowering" (adjustable spring perches) will have none of those axle issues...

stevenk

true enough, however after a couple hours of grinding and fitting I have them in the car. the ride is perfect, just like my other factory stock eg. they are not a direct bolt on. I wouldn't recomend anyone buy these if you are not really really good with a grinder. it is a Time consuming and expensive way to lower your car, I am pleased with the ride and the steering is tight, absolutely no wander on the freeway at any speed. The drop looks great can just get my fingers between the fender and the tire. got to go put some miles on them now, check back later.

blinx9900

glad you got it sorted, so your on stock springs and shocks? post pics of the car!

johnlear

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by TunerN00b &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">That theory is not applicable for the EG/DC chassis that is being discussed here (what the drop spindles are for).</TD></TR></TABLE>

It's applicable to just about any independant suspension, with the exception of pure trailing arms (e.g. front suspension on old VWs and many off-road buggys), true swing axles (e.g. front suspensions on Allards, some early Lotus, and some Ford trucks) and 'sliding pillar' (archaic system still used on Morgan sports cars).

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by TunerN00b &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Lowering by 1.5" on an EG/DC will do nothing but improve the suspension geometry (better CG and RC location, steeper point in the camber curve, etc.). The only thing negatively affected is the total amount of compression travel, which a drop spindle would affect the same way (due to the tire itself running out of travel space).</TD></TR></TABLE>

You may well be correct (up to a point), but 1.5" is only a moderate lowering, lower it a lot and the roll geometry will most probably be adversely affected.

It's not so much that changing the static geometric roll centre location is a problem in itself, but that if (because of changes to static wishbone angles) the static length of the 'virtual swing arms' are substantially shortened, then with suspension movements the dynamic lengths of the VSAs and their 'instant centre' locations will be much more likely to change substantially.

If this happens to a significant degree (very likely with a substantial drop), then it's much more likely that the GRC will move both vertically and laterally (with suspension movements) than would be the case at the stock (or near) ride height. One of the most important things a suspension designer can do is to ensure reasonably stable dynamic GRC location, though it's virtually impossible to prevent it from moving entirely, it will typically lower and move toward the inside of the chassis to some degree as the chassis rolls.

Significant erratic and / or abrupt GRC location change can cause a sudden change in the distribution of weight transfer in transient cornering states, and thus can result in abrupt changes to the handling balance during corners that the driver may find difficult to predict and control, especially at / near the limit of adhesion.

One of the more substantial benefits of fitting very stiff springs with lowered suspensions (other than to simply reduce bottoming out), is that the stiffer springs limit suspension motion, and thus tends to limit the adverse geometric side-affects of excessive lowering (i.e. dynamic GRC location change with roll motion is reduced because roll motion is reduced). At best this is only a partial substitute for maintaining correct roll geometry with a lowered suspension. To fully correct it you need drop spindles, that is their purpose.

Modified by johnlear at 1:25 AM 9/24/2008


Modified by johnlear at 9:31 AM 9/24/2008

stevenk

the car is on stock eg si springs now, it is a little low for me the spindles set it about 2" in drop. I like about a inch of clearance. it drives like new I have had it lowered for years and have done the typical upper ball joint camber fix even tryed to flip the tie rods. it has always suffered from camber steering, when you hit a bump it would pull one way or the other. all the problems I had seem to be gone, the spindles seem like they are built very well it was kind of a suprise that I had to do so much fitting. I tryed to contact the ht motorsports guy but have had no answer. the next thing I have to figure out is spring rates, all the companies make drop springs. looks like I can get 1.3" springs the add some sleeves to set it up a little closer where I like.

blinx9900

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by stevenk &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">the car is on stock eg si springs now, it is a little low for me the spindles set it about 2" in drop. I like about a inch of clearance. it drives like new I have had it lowered for years and have done the typical upper ball joint camber fix even tryed to flip the tie rods. it has always suffered from camber steering, when you hit a bump it would pull one way or the other. all the problems I had seem to be gone, the spindles seem like they are built very well it was kind of a suprise that I had to do so much fitting. I tryed to contact the ht motorsports guy but have had no answer. the next thing I have to figure out is spring rates, all the companies make drop springs. looks like I can get 1.3" springs the add some sleeves to set it up a little closer where I like. </TD></TR></TABLE>

consider integra springs, there a tad stiffer and a tad taller iirc, if you can find some at a junkyard for $20 and have the free time its worth trying, but i am not 100% sure...

stevenk

that's what I had run before, second choice was prelude, I think it is a little heavier. I did go down to the junk yard and pulled a aftermarket set from a integra they are purple in color not realy sure what brand, look like new and had new struts with them. so now I have Fabricated new top hats to make up the difference for the new springs. They seem to be a 1.5 inch drop. Everything is back together and the ride is nice and tight no rub on the fender to tire.