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Old 10-15-2003, 02:21 AM   #1
Doc_Honda
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Default Harmonic Balancer, can I remove?

I recently changed a few things on my H22 after my timing belt snapped from the ever-failing auto tensioner. When I was reinstalling the harmonic balancer belt, I got to thinking (UH OH!)

This balancer is basicly a "comfort Item" added by Honda to make the engine run smoother. So, If I removed the balancer belt, or maybe even the whole harmonic system, could I thereticly decrease rotational mass thus yeilding more torque to the wheels?

I dont care about the engine being "smooth", as long as it runs properly.

Does anyone see any possible LONG TERM effects from this modification?
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Old 10-15-2003, 04:13 AM   #2
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Default Re: Harmonic Balancer, can I remove? (Doc_Honda)

If you're worried about long term effects, don't do it.

Also your caonfusing the Harmonic Dampener Pulley with the Balancer Shafts. Hamronic Dampener Pulley is very important. Balancer Shafts are up to you I guess, regardless of what people say it's still extra vibration. Only time will tell if it makes a difference
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Old 10-15-2003, 06:27 AM   #3
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Default Re: Harmonic Balancer, can I remove? (satan_srv)

i always said dont do it. but im a hippocrit, cause it is a bitch to put it on in the car. but you have got me thinking, since im not running them, can i take that pully off, i always left it, just no belt.
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Old 10-15-2003, 08:52 AM   #4
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Default Re: Harmonic Balancer, can I remove? (fastludeh22)

ALL inline 4 cylinder engines produce produce a secondary vibration ( up and down shaking) caused by the weight of the piston/ pin/ upper end of the connecting rod moving up and down in thier bores. it doesnt have anything to do with piston "slap" or cyl. wall side loads. you would have to make a huge change the rod lenght/stroke ratio to create a signficant change in the vibration. that is not at all practical. however, shorter strokes and lighter RECIPROCATING ( not rotaing ) weights will considerably reduce it. smaller engines ( generally under 2 liters ) typically dont prduce enough of this vibration to warrant the use of balance shafts. the balance of the crank/ rods/ pistons is not altered when balance shafts are used in inline 4cylinder engines. so you can remove them without any harm to the engine, as long as you plug the oil feeds off in one way or another. the secondary vibration is generally most noticable at idle or low rpms, and starts to fade into frequencies not perceptible to humans at higher rpms. the most common engine designs that prduce secondary vibrations are -
single cylinder, v-twins, inline 2,3, or 4 cylinders, and 90 degree v6`s. most other common engine layouts do not produce the secondary vibes, but like Satan_srv stated....it's still added vibration.
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Old 10-15-2003, 08:57 AM   #5
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Default Re: Harmonic Balancer, can I remove? (H22Si)

Actually that got me thinking a little. I wonder if the frequencies that are produced from the H23 crank, due to the longer stroke and shorter rods in comparison to the H22 cranks, has anything to do with the problems some people have experienced with the H23 cranks? Hmmm.....
Referring to the recent post about the H22 vs. H23 crank "problems".
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Old 10-15-2003, 02:49 PM   #6
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Default

how would I plug off the oil feed? (More specifically) Where are the oil feeds?
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Old 10-15-2003, 10:54 PM   #7
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Default Re: (nsxlr8)

just remove the belt and call it a day.as long as the shafts are in,it will be ok.
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Old 10-16-2003, 03:52 AM   #8
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Default Re: Harmonic Balancer, can I remove? (fastludeh22)

Quote:
Originally Posted by fastludeh22
i always said dont do it. but im a hippocrit, cause it is a bitch to put it on in the car. but you have got me thinking, since im not running them, can i take that pully off, i always left it, just no belt.
Cool... all I really wanted to know was if I could take the belt off and run the car like that without any harmful effects.

Right now, I think the balancer shaft is 180 out from what it should be set at.

With the belt removed, will I have an issues with oil circulation?
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Old 10-16-2003, 05:41 AM   #9
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Default Re: Harmonic Balancer, can I remove? (Doc_Honda)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Doc_Honda
With the belt removed, will I have an issues with oil circulation?
shouldn't
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Old 10-16-2003, 05:45 AM   #10
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Default

How noticeable are the extra vibrations when the belt is pulled?

Wanna hear from those that have done it; i.e.-does it sound like almost normal, does it sound like something's seriously screwed, etc...
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Old 10-16-2003, 01:53 PM   #11
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Default Re: (LudeyKrus)

I haven't removed the belt on mine yet, though we have on a friends Mitsu Galant. It's a 2.4liter so the second-order vibrations should be slightly greater than that of an H22. The added vibration at idle was noticable but tolerable. I would advise against removing it if you have very stiff engine/transmission mounts and if driving comfort is still a concern. The sound is pretty close to stock, mostly felt.
The only way I could word it would be, if you were working with an H22 with the belt removed and you didn't know that the engines were equipped with balance shafts, you would be searching for something to fix. Slightly rougher idle but it fades as RPM increases.
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Old 10-16-2003, 05:58 PM   #12
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Default Re: (H22Si)

yeah,i have solid mounts on my h22 in my del sol and no balance shafts.....everything vibrates,but its tolerable.
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