J.C. Denton

Hello,

My name is Oli and I live in Germany. So please don't mind if my english is not the best, a few years have passed since I was forced to speak and write English (in my abitur exam :D )
I drive a '01 Accord Coupé with the F20B7 engine, automatic transmission, 4 Cylinder model. It is my daily driver.
The problem is: I have enormous Misfire problems. My OBDII Scanner tells me "Misfire Cylinder 1,2,3,4" and sometimes "Multiple Misfire".
The Malfunction Indication Lamp is always on when I am driving, in idle its blinking.
I begin to hate my car...
The car alway boggs heavy in idle, you can really feel the misfires in the whole car. The idle RPM is absolutely perfect at 800, but the whole engine and carbody is rattling and bogging. It feels like the someone is "doing it" in the car! :D Don't know how to describe better... My english has rusted a bit I think... :D
I have changed the following parts: Spark plugs (2 times, they were always slightly brown, NGK Plugs), Spark plug wires, distributor cap, rotor, ignition coil, and today the ignition module. I have set the valve timing, pulled off the whole intake to clean everything, checked the fuel pressure, checked, the MAT, the IAC, the EGR... Nothing helped. The injectors are pretty fine, 14 ohms resistance. I also have pulled the wires one by one... Nothing. No alteration.

What can I do? I am a mechanic at BMW here in Germany. Honda is absolutely new for me (bought the car 4 months ago). I can repair every BMW and every Pontiac Trans Am 3rd Gen and 2nd Gen (my hobby, own some of these cars), but Honda is... Japan style... or so... :D I have come to an end with my ideas.
And you cannot imagine how expensive original Honda Spare Parts can be... 226,- € (ca. 320 US $) for example for the damn ignition module... My wallet consists of onion-leather... Tears are coming everytime I look in... I cannot afford buying new spare parts every day!

If you have questions, please ask. Maybe I have forgotten something to write, it is short after midnight here and I am very tired, have to get up in 6 hours again!

I hope someone can help me, I hate driving to work with the car. And weather is too bad for driving with my Yamaha Virago at the moment... raining all day...

Greetings,
Oli

phootbag

There are no pattern failures on those cars for bad misfires. Go through the basics, Spark, Fuel, Air ( probably not a lack of air ), Compression and Timing ( both valve and spark ). Headgasket leak is possible but not very common.

Did this start suddenly? Or was it always like this? When you say pulled wires.... Nothing... What do you mean?

HONDAPARTSMANMIKE

i would rec doing a compression test and then move on to checking the valve adjustment a tight valve will cause misfire codes.

jweller

First off, your English is better than some who live here, don't sweat it.

stupid question, do you have the firing order correct with the plug wires? I would also check that the EGR valve is not leaking/stuck open. I would try reading it's state with the code reader while the car is running.

J.C. Denton

Hi,

thanks for answering!

@ phootbag: The problem exists since I own the car (March 2009).
Today I had a little time to check the engine again. Firing order is definitely ok.
I've checked the injectors again. All four of them have 12,4 ohms, 12 volts at the connectors... Everything seems to be in order.
After that I wanted to check the spark plugs again and that was a big surprise!

See yourself!



I have installed the new ignition module yesterday... And since today I only have misfire trouble codes at cylinder 1! And the spark plug that ist brown comes from cylinder 1! Very interesting... the 3 others seem to be burnt by a lean fuel mixture.
After that, I checked the ignition spark. On all 4 cylinders the spark seems to be a bit weak, but they all look the same so I don't mention it. I re-installed the spark plugs and then let the engine idle. I disconnected the spark plug wires one by one... At cylinder 4,3 and 2 the engine RPM began to "go down" when I disconnected the cable, and at cylinder 1 NOTHING happened! Engine idles like before... That tells me that cylinder 1 isn't working. But I definitely have an ignition spark. Can anyone explain that to me?
I went to a local dealer and bought new NGK spark plugs. The creepy BRISK plugs (installed by previous owner I think) are in my trunk now. But nothing changed! Cylinder 1 isn't working.
Tomorrow I planned to start a compression test and fuel pressure test again... I am expecting a great day...
How can I check the EGR? In my opinion an EGR isn't working in WOT and idle... How can this thing manipulate the idle?

EDIT: Can I set the spark timing? On the modern BMW you cannot do this, but I have a "spark pistol" for this, I often have to use it on different Chevy small and big blocks. If so, how is the procedure?

Greetings,
Oli

phootbag

I do not suspect EGR problem. Perform a compression test. There is obviously fuel by the looks of the plug. I wonder if there is a misadjusted or bent valve.

J.C. Denton

Compression test done. All Cylinders show 12,5 bar. I am totally confused about my damn car...
I've also performed a CO-Test... Absolutely no CO in the coolant system. Tried it 6 or 7 times. Head gasket also seems to be undamaged.

Greetz,
Oli

cd5_801

to know if you have a bent valve compression should be down and also you can do a leak down test....i heard people said black smoke comes out alot too

CG6Accord8o1

main relay?

jdowen2

Try swapping spark plug leads.

J.C. Denton

The main relay? Where is that located and what is it's job?

I have already swapped the leads. Nothing changed.

phootbag

The main relay is responsible for powering the fuel pump and ECM. I doubt it is your problem. Main relay failures don't affect a single cylinder alone. I would perform a compression test or just remove the valve cover and inspect valve lash. If you have excessive lash there may be a bent valve. If you have NO lash, obviously, that will cause a misfire and COULD even be a burned valve. That is if, though...

J.C. Denton

Compression test already done, everything seems to be in best condition.
Today I have filmed a video of my OBDII Scanner reading my live data.
Maybe you can tell me why my ignition and my O2 Sensor jumping around and what my troublecode is.
Any ideas?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IqL1ZC2wdck

HONDAPARTSMANMIKE

have you tryed checking the valve adjustment?? do you have a specific cyl that throw a missfire code

phootbag

Check valve adjustment. Excessive ( A LOT ) lash probably a bent valve. Zero lash probably needs adjustment and MAY be burned.

phootbag

Your timing is jumping around because the ECM is trying to compensate for the misfire. The O2 sensors seem to be correct enough. Check valve adjustment.

phootbag

And the flashing MIL is because of a catalyst damaging misfire. Meaning it's really bad.

jdowen2

According to the manual the only thing left to do is swap injectors. If the problem follows the injector, it's bad. If not, you need a new ECM or possible bad connection from ecm to injector.

phootbag

Take some of Hondas troubleshooting with a grain of salt. Hell, it'll tell you to start checking wires at the ECM, then ohm the this that and the other THEN tell you to ohm the blower motor. ( for example ). The troubleshooting isn't always practical. I have replaced ONE stuck open injector. I'd check valve adjustment before exploring other options.

HONDAPARTSMANMIKE

x2 check the valve adjustment

J.C. Denton

Valve adjustment has been checked 2 months ago.
I will give the goddamn car to my service garage on monday. I'm giving up on this.
Everythin I've tried was worthless.

Greetings,
Oli

tru350z

I know this thead is from 09 but same problem here.
Cause of your misfire please?

Lost Again

I think the 01 have COP. Try switch the coils and see if the misfire moves.

Of course you checked everything else in this thread.

J.C. Denton

Blown up Engine.
The leak down test offered a problem in Cylinder 1. Piston had damaged the cylinder wall.
I bought a complete engine on german ebay and did complete service on it (all gaskets, belts and so on.
Worked absolutely fine for about 3 months. After that, the goddamn automatic transmission blew up. Crack in transmission housing.
I bought a remanufactured transmission and sold the car. I have invested roundabout 4000,- € in the car, i had enough. What a crap car, nearly everything broke down. From a broken shock absorber (!) to the blown up engine and transmission... Never ever Accord again. Maybe other Accord or other Hondas are perfect cars, mine was crap.
Now I am driving BMW again without any problems.