92integraVTECgsr

My LS/VTEC with 19,000 miles smokes in VTEC. I thought it was the valve stem seals so I replaced them, but still no luck. Compression is 240 across the board.

The block has OS OEM Honda P30 pistons with OEM Honda rings. Stock ITR head. Endyn catch can setup with the outlet plugs at the back of the block for the catch can.

What else could it be? It doesn't burn oil unless I'm low on gas and using VTEC a lot.

Other than that, it just smokes big time whenever I get into VTEC at 5200rpm.

It is gray smoke. The car was dyno tuned by Jim @ Motorvations in AL.

Any other ideas?

delsolproblems

You losing oil? If so, check the IAT sensor and the inside of that runner to see if there's oil.

AMLS4dr200whp

do u have a wideband? whats ur a/f ratio?

SIred91

What would that have to do with burning oil?

H2BInspiredDC2

Running lean my friend, is exactly what is has to do with burning oil. If at any given moment the motor ran lean during the break-in process, then the cylinder walls may have been accidentally scuffed by the pistons. Conversely, the same is true for a motor that was untuned prior to initial break-in and ran extremely rich. Either way, I'm almost certain that the OP will need to tear-down the motor and inspect. Replace the rings as necessary, as this is more than likely the culprit. Good luck.

92integraVTECgsr

Not really loosing oil.

I'm thinking it has something to do with the tune as well. I've been wanting to take it back for a retune then I will go put new rings in it.

delsolproblems

With 240 in all cylinders I doubt you need rings. A greyish smoke can also come from a bad A/F ratio or other source of incomplete combustion so maybe you're right about the tune. Did it have this problem since it was tuned or did it start later? I would rule out ignition problems, air filter and fuel system before dyno tuning new fuel maps. Post what the plugs look like please.

killerpenguin21

a compression test will not show an issue with the oil control rings.

im 90% sure this is also my current issue.

delsolproblems

A problem with the oil control rings wouldn't increase the amount of oil getting past the compression rings. If anything, it would decrease the oil captured by the rings and thus the amount of oil burned. Once the oiling problem wears down the cylinder and rings, more oil would be burned but compression would also be affected.

killerpenguin21

depends on if the rings were installed aligned correctly.

my car has a perfect compression and leakdown, but im burning oil in high rpm's. valve seals and everything have less than 500 miles on a professional install, so im personally only left with one other option, which would be oil leaking down onto the outside of the exhaust...but its coming out the tailpipe so that rules that out.

i dont think there is a simple way to test the oil control rings without pulling it apart.

1.5Slowmatic

have you done a leakdown test? If its not blue smoke than check the tune. whats your AF ratio

delsolproblems

That wouldn't be a problem with the oil control, that's a problem with poor installation.

92integraVTECgsr

leakdown test was 100% perfect. I've heard the oil control rings too, but I would think it would be smoking more and/or burning oil.

The smoke is gray, maybe dark gray to black (hard to tell sometimes with tinted windows).

I installed the rings to Honda specifications and was told by my friend who is a Honda mechanic and builds these all day long (unless he lied to me). Anyone got a diagram or can explain to me how the rings need to be aligned?

Here is a diagram on how I positioned my rings. I may have the bottom and middle mixed up, I can't remember, it was a year and a half ago.

delsolproblems

I'm quite certain your rings are fine. Your diagram shows roughly the proper alignment. Basicly, all you have to do is make sure no ring gap is near another, which you did. You are getting dark grey smoke and there is probably black soot being left behind on the plugs and exhaust? You are almost definately running rich. Check the air filter, fuel pressure and post when this started happening please.

mikesrex

My current cheap build setup for my rex (threw together a GSR crank/JDM ITR rod-piston combon/GSR gead) also smokes similar to this. I didn't use new rings, and the LS block was simply honed before installation, so I didn't count on the motor being absolutely perfect. Ring gap and piston-to-wall clearance was within a reasonable range, though. It was more a temporary motor to ensure my car is set up well before the big motor goes in. My A/F ratio is definitely not rich, being low 13's at WOT. I really haven't thought much about it, as I don't consume oil at all, but this motor isn't staying in the car for long, either. I get about 275 compression across the board, and the car runs very well. Maybe I'll find out when I take it apart what is wrong lol.

d112crzy

Low 13's is a little on the lean side for most NA applications.

mikesrex

the car seems to like less timing, less fuel, and runs well. It just blows an annoying lil bit of smoke at WOT. I'm on ITB's right now and the idle is rich enough to foul out spark plugs after a while, so maybe that is causing something? I guess I really haven't given it much thought since the car runs well and the motor is only temporary. When it comes out I will probably go through it before putting it in my integra (it's in my CRX right now) to drive around as a daily.

92integraVTECgsr

The plugs are black most of the time. Not crazy black, but ya probably too much fuel.

The only things I changed from after the tune were: Hytech Replica Header (small tube) and 2.5" BPi Velocity stack with K&N Filter.

As far as tuning and placement of the a/f sensor, is it better to have an O2 Sensor in the exhaust after the header or is the tail pipe meter give the same results?

Stock FPR, Fuel Rail.

I may have changed the fuel filter after the tune, but cannot remember.

d112crzy

A sensor at the tail vs a sensor right after the collector will have different readings in a normal exhaust setup. More so if you have exhaust leaks.

Scott_Tucker

AMLS4dr200whp

thank you

DDTECH

Depending on motor setup and drivablity.

13.5 is found to produce the best torque

12.9 ~13.3 i find the best for daily driven / beat on cars

all motor cars like to see anything between 12.8 ~13.7 depending on the setup.

i usually shoot for 13.2 is a good mix.

On another note, like killerpeng had shared, there are 3 sets of rings, not just 1.. Running lean will cause the car to smoke - Running rich rich will cause the car to smoke.. if it is infact blue smoke then you have "oil control" ring problems.. if what you say is true.. running a thicker oil should solve some of the problem but it will not get rid of it.

92integraVTECgsr

damn, I didn't even think of changing the rings while the head was off. Oh well.. I guess I'll just live with a little smoke under VTEC.

amboyeg

I have the same problem with a gsr engine the setup is a stock b16 head block internals ls crank ls rods with nippon type r pistons with new bearings and rings not ctrs it has good fuel.It has full stock exhust system with a cat.After car is warmed up I see white or maybe light blue smoke.Also what kind of compression should I have with this setup.

4doortypeR

first change the pcv valve
if that dont solve the problem, the sleeves are egg shaped;not round
thus resleeve the block or get a new block
thats my 2 cents.