Neptronix

So i did it. The unholy ricer sin: AC Removal.
Results were actually pretty impressive. People say it won't net you any power gain because the AC Pulley is free-spinning, but i dispute that.

Removing the AC 'radiator' ( sorry, don't know what to call it ) took a good 15-30lbs off the front and i noticed it a little. Mostly it helped with handling.. the car seems a little more balanced around turns since it's taken weight off the driver's side.

Removing the AC Belt made all the difference. Consider that you're removing a belt.. a big pulley.. and an idler pulley all at once. I had a cavalier and replaced the stock crank pulley with a lightened one.. the result was similar: butt dyno registers 1-3hp/tq being freed up. All i know is, i upshift more often. The troubled low-torque section of a D series motor ( below ~3500rpm ) is a little less bothersome.

The good:
+ Little power increase across the power band.. unlike most air/exhaust mods
+ Losing weight is always a good idea. I've heard that the entire AC system is about 45lbs.
+ Car seems to drop rpm's a little bit faster inbetween shifts so you can shift a little quicker.

The bad:
+ Remorse factor if you live in a hot area during the summer ( consider it!! )
+ Accelleration will feel a little more raw.. car gets a little more jumpy. A bit less smooth.
+ If you actually care about the environment, you have to get the freon removed by a shop unless you have special tools.. i paid $38 at my local honda shop. Not bad for peace of mind.

And a question:
I've still got the AC Compressor attatched to my block. I was thinking of removing that too.. but i was wondering.. if i ever decide to sell this car, is the compressor a pain in the *** to get back on? I know that taking the belt/ac 'radiator' put me in the doghouse enough already, but does the AC Compressor weigh anything significant?

Jonathan_ED3

But.....

really, what did you gain aside from the inability to ever feel a cool breeze from your dashboard?

Seriously....was it worth 1hp?

Maybe it's because I live in TX, but I've just never understood the logic behind this ricer mod.

Dasfinc

AC Pully is free spinning, your but-dyno lies.
The weight is very minimal as well, I'm pulling mine because my hatch is getting gutted to be a track car, but otherwise there is no point "Go big or Go home"

94c1v1cex

power steering removal is the only thing that gives hp... the a/c compressor is free spinning until it engages when you press that little a/c button on the dash... your butt dyno is ****... i removed my a/c because i boosted.... my butt dyno and the actual dyno at the shop says +120whp haha

Neptronix

I'm sure it doesn't 'give hp'.. but it does free up some torque.
AC Pulley does free spin but at the same time, the pulley, and even the belt have weight.
Less weight on your drivetrain is a good thing, I bet the AC pulley is like.. 3-5lbs.

All i know is.. 4lbs off my cavalier's crank pulley was noticeable. Not huge. But any power gain at low rpm is worth it to me.

Taking off my AC was more noticeable. I don't stay in low gear as often.
I'm not gonna quote power numbers, but i notice a power gain.

I live in the central coast of california where the temperature only exceeds 90 degrees a week or two in the peak of summer. AC is pretty useless here.
If you live in texas or arizona or so. cal etc this is not worth the power gain... agreed!

suicide_shift

man i did it tooo . but where else was i going to put the radiator?

B serious

iTrader: (1)

well, I would never have taken the AC off any of my cars. I love AC. BUT..I am very vey glad to see that you did the right thing and got the AC evacuated at a shop. Thank you.

I'm happy that there are still tuners with a social consceince.

NakMuaySpirit

your tail lights probably add 75whp too.

if its DD there is no reason to remove the AC.
ricer.

MADMAX_zero

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Neptronix &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I'm sure it doesn't 'give hp'.. but it does free up some torque.
AC Pulley does free spin but at the same time, the pulley, and even the belt have weight.
Less weight on your drivetrain is a good thing, I bet the AC pulley is like.. 3-5lbs.

All i know is.. 4lbs off my cavalier's crank pulley was noticeable. Not huge. But any power gain at low rpm is worth it to me.

Taking off my AC was more noticeable. I don't stay in low gear as often.
I'm not gonna quote power numbers, but i notice a power gain.
</TD></TR></TABLE>

Oh man you are an idiot.

"Give up HP, but free up torque"

That is by far the stupidest thing I have ever heard.

HP IS SIMPLY A CALCULATION THAT IS BASED OFF OF TORQUE AND RPM.

If one goes down, so does the other.

ddd4114

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by MADMAX_zero &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Oh man you are an idiot.

"Give up HP, but free up torque"

That is by far the stupidest thing I have ever heard.

HP IS SIMPLY A CALCULATION THAT IS BASED OFF OF TORQUE AND RPM.

If one goes down, so does the other.</TD></TR></TABLE>
You stole the words right out of my mouth.

Neptronix

Yeah god forbid that anyone gain any performance.
Freakin' ricers.. all of them.

Thanks B serious. What shocked me is that a lot of people told me to just release the **** into the atmosphere. It seems like a lot of people are misinformed.. sure, R-134 depletes the ozone less.. but still contributes to acid rain and has just as negative effect on global warming.

Whatevs. AC removal FTW if you don't have hell-weather.
D series remains bearable yet another day until B-series swap money is saved.. lol

NakMuaySpirit

we go from your misinformation about ac removal, to things causing global warming wtf.
people bitching about global warming and the ozone layer need to drive hybrids.

sorry for going off topic.

projekt-sol

ok since everyone else seems to like flaming you for removing your A/C ill answer your question.
no the comperssor wouldn't be hard to put back on.. it weighs like 10 pounds if that and its only 4 bolts.. just 4 very long bolts..
i removed my A/C and P/S. why? bc one its my car and 2 bc i feel i don't need either of them and plus its a Del sol.. so ill just take off the top

The Lobster

When i took my A/C out of my CRX Si i felt no gains.

i have AC in my ek im never takign it out i learned my lesson

Ex-Eg-Driver

iTrader: (1)

shoulda gained atleast 20hp to the wheel with that old skool trick.

Neptronix

There are plenty of things you can do other than drive a hybrid that will cut down your global warming impact. But i won't go there. I think that's for another forum.

Take 30-50lbs out of your car and 4-7lbs of rotational mass off your drivetrain and tell me you don't feel anything afterwards. Yeah.. and people who buy underdrive kits ( on other cars of course because our engines don't like light pulleys ) are idiots who just like seeing aluminum in their engine bay.

Right.

And to madmax: don't bash me when you aren't reading my post right.
When you quoted my post it was right.
When you typed my quote it was wrong.
Read what i posted.

Weight loss doesn't add hp. Power per rpm doesn't change. I never said my hp changed. I said the butt dyno noticed something, and that now instinctively i shift upwards a little more often and seem to keep my car in higher gear now for daily driving. I don't think that is an outrageous claim.

Why does posting about AC removal bring out all the haters?
I just posted because i wanted to share my experience with anyone who was thinking of doing this.

Ex-Eg-Driver

iTrader: (1)

its okay...no AC FTL!

projekt-sol

honestly.. its a quick and easy way to satisfy your "Butt Dyno" and lighten the car by few pounds.. if you live in a hot area.. think about it.. to the OP if for some reason you want to get rid of your car and decide to put the A/C back in.. i dont see a problem.. the compersor is light.. and its just 4 bolts..

Frozen E

Did you have a cast iron condenser? 15-30 lbs by removing that thing? You're out of your mind. The condenser is solid aluminum and weighs AT THE MOST 3 lbs.

If you're worried about weight savings you're better off taking out that big *** compressor.

cbustuner

I took mine out because I didn't feel like building my turbo setup around it and having restictions on downpipe size,fliter size piping size etc etc,and I have another car with ac so who cares if my 93 civic doesn't have it.It wasn't charged when I bought it anyways so I thought what the hell.

If this was my only car or just the stock d16 with light mods (I/h/e) then I would have had it charged and kept it.

I sold it and on the fedex scale it weighed 48 pounds and some change for those that want to know.(Thats everything,the lines, condenser, fan wiring, lines,belt ,tensioner) I got 120 (minus 60 something for shipping ) bucks out of it too.

ddd4114

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Neptronix &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I said the butt dyno noticed something</TD></TR></TABLE>

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Experimenter's_bias

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/P...works

Neptronix

I could be wrong about the weight. People claim the AC system is about 45lbs in the car.
I'm going off what people are saying though. I don't have a scale. The condenser is definetely over 10lbs though. It's heavier than a 10lb hand-weight i have. Then you add on bolts, lines, etc.. 40lbs for the entire ac system doesn't seem unrealistic.

I've taken more than 40lbs out of the car before though ( back seats + back seatbelts + some other stuff all at once ) and noticed a smidge of gain. But the backseats went back in because the noise-to-performance ratio was pretty crappy ;p. Whatever.

It's the lack of pulleys that make the noticeable difference.

FYI, my freon was also shot so AC didn't do crap for me but suck my power when i turned it on. Guy who owned it before used it 24/7 and would regularly drive in 90-100deg. weather up a grade that lasts a mile. It went through hell.

cbustuner

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Neptronix &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I could be wrong about the weight. People claim the AC system is about 45lbs in the car.
I'm going off what people are saying though. I don't have a scale. The condenser is definetely over 10lbs though..</TD></TR></TABLE>

check my above post for the weight.That was on a digital fedex scale.The only thing that would have made it slighty less was the box and the maybe 5-8 pound bracket/lower motor mount,that I included with it because the guy wanted everything and I had another that I put on.Your still looking at LEAST 40 pounds give or take taking off for the bracket and box.Some ppl dont even run that lower torque mount if they have inserts or aftermarket mounts.

I also sold a power steering system and it only weighed 19 pounds in a box on the same scale.

Frozen E

It's all in your head.
You WANT to believe that you're feeling something, so your brain won't let you feel otherwise.

If you were to drive a car with AC in it and it was off and then one without I almost guarantee you that you wouldn't feel a damn thing.

I took the AC out of my EM1 before going to get the downpipe for my turbo welded up. Not a damn bit of difference between before and after.

Neptronix

::
you have a different motor and setup than i have.
On a turbo B series i doubt 1-3ft extra torque are noticeable.