Misfiring problem. Always at 3800-4000 rpm under load ? ( gt28rs SOHC )

yellowturbo · 04-12-2006, 10:52 AM

Well like the title said.... Ive been at my tuner shop last friday to get the new setup tuned and there is always this stupid misfiring issue right when we cross 4000rpm !!

We have to pass this point without loading the engine too much but if we start in 3rd gear at 2000 rpm and go WOT the engine will just start misfiring when when cross this point. My tuner played with the timing, fuel, VTEC point etc... nothing work. Past that point the engine will pul STRONG until the redline without any issue. Its strange since its where the turbo really kicks in....

I run a MSD SCI box with a blaster SS coil... we changed the coil but it didnt help. I suspect the box now...

Do you know if I could run the SS coil without the box to do the test ? If yes how I could do the wiring ?

Or you may have another idea....

Thanks for the help !

yellowturbo · 04-12-2006, 12:12 PM

someone ??

TypeSLO · 04-12-2006, 12:17 PM

did you check the spark plugs????

warrick · 04-12-2006, 12:17 PM

I am having the same issue with a friend's car, but it won't go past 4000rpm.

adjusting fuel, timing, boost levels etc does nothing. tried multiple crome maps (p30 and p72), premade and from scratch.

tried a brand new dizzy, new wires, new plugs, smaller gap, nothing.

try a smaller gap though, it may be a good step towards resolution.

yellowturbo · 04-12-2006, 12:23 PM

well they are gapped at 0.28'' so its supposed to be good...

well its only when crossing 4000rpm under load... if im in 3rd at 4500rpm and I floor it there is no problem at all !??

2k.civic.si · 04-12-2006, 12:32 PM

all we can really say is check over the ignition system if your sure its not a tuning problem...since i see you have a msd sci system (same one i run) you may want to make sure the msd box itself is grounded...i know if you install the msd system with the rubber spacers according to the directions the box itself is not grounded to the chassis...although internally it may be grounded to the connection it has to the battery...but its still good to ground the box to seperately

yellowturbo · 04-12-2006, 12:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2k.civic.si

all we can really say is check over the ignition system if your sure its not a tuning problem...since i see you have a msd sci system (same one i run) you may want to make sure the msd box itself is grounded...i know if you install the msd system with the rubber spacers according to the directions the box itself is not grounded to the chassis...although internally it may be grounded to the connection it has to the battery...but its still good to ground the box to seperately

yeah I will look at the ground thats a good idea cuz I just moved it last winter !

tegasaurus · 04-12-2006, 01:30 PM

my teg would do that (all motor tho) when the ground that was on the back of my thermostat housing would kinda "hang-loose." Check all of your grounds even the ones for that ridiculous msd box you have in your engine bay

tcontesh · 04-12-2006, 03:44 PM

this is the same exact issue that I may possibly be having. we changed the plugs, and it went away for about a week and then just started happening to me again. but my problem is that we cant get vtec to engage on this p72 with crome, and the plugs get loaded up with fuel because the injectors I have supply the higher cam up to 8000 rpms. anyways, maybe some of the plugs are fouled.

Weq · 04-12-2006, 04:37 PM

Since ur ignition is upto scratch, how is ur fuel pressure? tegasaurus referred the to the ground which controls the fuel pump!

SOHC_MShue · 04-12-2006, 04:51 PM

I would start with getting rid of the msd and seeing if an oem ignition setup will work. Honestly that has alway worked best for me. MSD has given problems in the past on cars I tuned. A recent one would start breaking up as soon as vtec hit no matter where it was set and even at light load. Took out the MSD and added a bunch of grounds to the engine bay and it completely got rid of it.

TurboTegB18c · 04-12-2006, 04:51 PM

If your positive it's not tuning related, bypass the ignition box. The 2 wires coming from the distributor, that hooks up to the msd box, run those straight to the coil. 1 positive and 1 negative. That should bypass the box altogether. Hope that helps, Paul

yellowturbo · 04-13-2006, 04:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TurboTegB18c

If your positive it's not tuning related, bypass the ignition box. The 2 wires coming from the distributor, that hooks up to the msd box, run those straight to the coil. 1 positive and 1 negative. That should bypass the box altogether. Hope that helps, Paul

Thats what I will do after looking at my grounds...

UPDATE : when im full throttle starting from 2500-3000 rpm I hit full boost at 3500rpm and I pass this misfiring region without any problem ???? When im in mid boost and mid throttle now the misfire happens

That really bad since the car is perfect past this region.....

turboeg77 · 04-13-2006, 07:41 AM

change the distributor and all your problems will be gone. its exactly what happened to my car before when i uploaded the wrong aems basemap. change the wires too cuz their next.

yellowturbo · 04-13-2006, 08:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by turboeg77

change the distributor and all your problems will be gone. its exactly what happened to my car before when i uploaded the wrong aems basemap. change the wires too cuz their next.

damn I also runned with a wrong base map that the stupid tech at AEM instaleld in my computer for I dont know why ( I returned them my EMS for a small problem... HOPEFULLY I was doing my broke in period on my new clutch... My tuner is the one who find that it wasnt his map... )

I will change the dizzy for sure now that I read this !

blundar · 04-13-2006, 08:35 AM

I'm not convinced it's not a tuning issue.

turboeg77 · 04-14-2006, 06:48 AM

its not really the tuning that kills the dizzy. its when you havent zeroed in the timing of the EMS to the dizzy that kills it. it has something to do with the stat sync. of the EMS.

KevronsEG · 04-14-2006, 01:58 PM

If your car was sitting all winter maybe you have some water in your tank from temp. change. Thats what happend to me. Just an idea.

Kevron

yellowturbo · 04-19-2006, 06:11 AM

update... its not the MSD SCI box... I removed the box last weekend and it still do the same stupid thing.

Damn I cant understand what could cause the car to misfire always at the same spot.

I did another test... if I floor the throttle at 2500 RPM and let the boost built it wont do anything ?????? Its just when im partial throttle.... I begin to suspect a tuning issue.....

2k.civic.si · 04-19-2006, 09:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by yellowturbo

update... its not the MSD SCI box... I removed the box last weekend and it still do the same stupid thing.

Damn I cant understand what could cause the car to misfire always at the same spot.

I did another test... if I floor the throttle at 2500 RPM and let the boost built it wont do anything ?????? Its just when im partial throttle.... I begin to suspect a tuning issue.....

partial throttle it does it but not under load...its the tuning

Weq · 04-19-2006, 10:52 PM

my friend had a similiar problem with his microtech, the ignition driver had issues with higher revs. He did the same, MSd box and all, nothing helped until he switched EMS's.

Drew Peacock · 04-19-2006, 11:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blundar

I'm not convinced it's not a tuning issue.

Sounds like a tuning issue, I would say it IS a tuning issue. I have been there.

Synapse · 04-19-2006, 11:30 PM

sounds dumb, but I had a similar issue at part throttle.

If you're running an HKS sequential BOV, try cranking on the spring or just run without vacuum line to the BOV and see if it fixes anything.

Importordomestic · 04-20-2006, 08:57 AM

I had the same problem with my MSD SCI box. BUt my engine is N/A, but i replaced all my grounds and the problem went away.

yellowturbo · 04-20-2006, 09:08 AM

thanks for all you reply. Im pretty sure that its my igniter... I will try a new one soon.

04-12-2006, 10:52 AM	#1
yellowturbo Member Garage is empty, add now Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Montreal, QC, Canada Posts: 1,850 iTrader Rating: (0)	Misfiring problem. Always at 3800-4000 rpm under load ? ( gt28rs SOHC ) Well like the title said.... Ive been at my tuner shop last friday to get the new setup tuned and there is always this stupid misfiring issue right when we cross 4000rpm !! We have to pass this point without loading the engine too much but if we start in 3rd gear at 2000 rpm and go WOT the engine will just start misfiring when when cross this point. My tuner played with the timing, fuel, VTEC point etc... nothing work. Past that point the engine will pul STRONG until the redline without any issue. Its strange since its where the turbo really kicks in.... I run a MSD SCI box with a blaster SS coil... we changed the coil but it didnt help. I suspect the box now... Do you know if I could run the SS coil without the box to do the test ? If yes how I could do the wiring ? Or you may have another idea.... Thanks for the help ! __________________ SOHC GT28RS .82ar http://images.honda-tech.com/set1/smile/emthup.gif 17 psi of fun on the street.

04-12-2006, 12:12 PM	#2
yellowturbo Member Garage is empty, add now Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Montreal, QC, Canada Posts: 1,850 iTrader Rating: (0)	someone ?? __________________ SOHC GT28RS .82ar http://images.honda-tech.com/set1/smile/emthup.gif 17 psi of fun on the street.

04-12-2006, 12:17 PM	#3
TypeSLO Garage is empty, add now Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: FL Posts: 399 iTrader Rating: (0)	Re: (yellowturbo) did you check the spark plugs???? __________________ will always be too slow...

04-12-2006, 12:17 PM	#4
warrick Garage is empty, add now Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: vancouver, BC, Canada Posts: 508 iTrader Rating: (0)	Re: (yellowturbo) I am having the same issue with a friend's car, but it won't go past 4000rpm. adjusting fuel, timing, boost levels etc does nothing. tried multiple crome maps (p30 and p72), premade and from scratch. tried a brand new dizzy, new wires, new plugs, smaller gap, nothing. try a smaller gap though, it may be a good step towards resolution.

04-12-2006, 12:23 PM	#5
yellowturbo Member Garage is empty, add now Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Montreal, QC, Canada Posts: 1,850 iTrader Rating: (0)	well they are gapped at 0.28'' so its supposed to be good... well its only when crossing 4000rpm under load... if im in 3rd at 4500rpm and I floor it there is no problem at all !?? __________________ SOHC GT28RS .82ar http://images.honda-tech.com/set1/smile/emthup.gif 17 psi of fun on the street.

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04-12-2006, 12:32 PM	#6
2k.civic.si Honda-Tech Member Garage is empty, add now Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: los banos, ca Posts: 3,892 iTrader Rating: (0)	Re: (yellowturbo) all we can really say is check over the ignition system if your sure its not a tuning problem...since i see you have a msd sci system (same one i run) you may want to make sure the msd box itself is grounded...i know if you install the msd system with the rubber spacers according to the directions the box itself is not grounded to the chassis...although internally it may be grounded to the connection it has to the battery...but its still good to ground the box to seperately __________________ EFI University Certified Advanced Tuner http://www.artietuned.com Ecu chipping,Street/Dyno tuning,Crome Pro/Gold,AEM,FAST,Motec, and more. www.westcoastnationals.org

04-12-2006, 01:30 PM	#8
tegasaurus Honda-Tech Member Garage is empty, add now Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Scottsdale, AZ, usa Posts: 3,105 iTrader Rating: (0)	Re: (yellowturbo) my teg would do that (all motor tho) when the ground that was on the back of my thermostat housing would kinda "hang-loose." Check all of your grounds even the ones for that ridiculous msd box you have in your engine bay __________________ 94 integra LS - wrecked, care of bmw745il 7/31/02 - 4/24/03 94 integra LS/vtec - stolen at ASU 5/2/03 - 9/11/04 90 nissan 240sx - SR20DET - SOLD 1/6/05 - 8/15/05 01 chevrolet s-10 v6 - SOLD 9/8/05 - 6/7/06 98 integra ls - turbo - fast - SOLD 2-2-07 03 infiniti g35 6mt sedan current project black on black on black fo sho

04-12-2006, 03:44 PM	#9
tcontesh Garage is empty, add now Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Concord, NH Posts: 195 iTrader Rating: (0)	Re: Misfiring problem. Always at 3800-4000 rpm under load ? (yellowturbo) this is the same exact issue that I may possibly be having. we changed the plugs, and it went away for about a week and then just started happening to me again. but my problem is that we cant get vtec to engage on this p72 with crome, and the plugs get loaded up with fuel because the injectors I have supply the higher cam up to 8000 rpms. anyways, maybe some of the plugs are fouled. __________________ [B]97 Prelude SH [/B] t3/t4 custom Turbo kit @ 10-psi obd1 p72 piggybacked on cromepro Precision 550cc's HKS SSQ BOV Blitz TT/boost controller Clutch masters stage 3 [url="http://www.trickengineering.com/customers.htm"]www.trickengineering.com[/url]

04-12-2006, 04:37 PM	#10
Weq Garage is empty, add now Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 216 iTrader Rating: (0)	Since ur ignition is upto scratch, how is ur fuel pressure? tegasaurus referred the to the ground which controls the fuel pump!

04-12-2006, 04:51 PM	#11
SOHC_MShue Honda-Tech Member Garage is empty, add now Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Richmond, Va, usa Posts: 11,429 iTrader Rating: (0)	Re: Misfiring problem. Always at 3800-4000 rpm under load ? (yellowturbo) I would start with getting rid of the msd and seeing if an oem ignition setup will work. Honestly that has alway worked best for me. MSD has given problems in the past on cars I tuned. A recent one would start breaking up as soon as vtec hit no matter where it was set and even at light load. Took out the MSD and added a bunch of grounds to the engine bay and it completely got rid of it. __________________ Neptune Dealer www.shuetuning.net www.powertraincontrolsolutions.com

04-12-2006, 04:51 PM	#12
TurboTegB18c Honda-Tech Member Garage is empty, add now Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Pensacola, FL Posts: 1,369 iTrader Rating: (0)	Re: (Weq) If your positive it's not tuning related, bypass the ignition box. The 2 wires coming from the distributor, that hooks up to the msd box, run those straight to the coil. 1 positive and 1 negative. That should bypass the box altogether. Hope that helps, Paul __________________ Trackmasters Dynojet tuning http://www.etrackmasters.com Dealer for Rocket Motorsports http://m24x.zeroforum.com Need References?? My vouch thread http://www.honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=382495 Best ET: 10.307@146.73mph Best MPH: 10.398@148.56mph

04-13-2006, 07:41 AM	#14
turboeg77 Garage is empty, add now Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 167 iTrader Rating: (0)	Re: (yellowturbo) change the distributor and all your problems will be gone. its exactly what happened to my car before when i uploaded the wrong aems basemap. change the wires too cuz their next.

04-13-2006, 08:35 AM	#16
blundar Honda-Tech Member Garage is empty, add now Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Cincinnati, OH, USA Posts: 1,247 iTrader Rating: (0)	I'm not convinced it's not a tuning issue. __________________ Formerly PGMFI's cheerleader... RD Tuning - Blundar.com under construction. Tuning in Cincinnati, OH - PM me for rates. eCtune-Neptune-PowerFC-Crome-Uberdata-Hondata-AEM-Autronic-more

04-14-2006, 06:48 AM	#17
turboeg77 Garage is empty, add now Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 167 iTrader Rating: (0)	Re: (blundar) its not really the tuning that kills the dizzy. its when you havent zeroed in the timing of the EMS to the dizzy that kills it. it has something to do with the stat sync. of the EMS.

04-14-2006, 01:58 PM	#18
KevronsEG Honda-Tech Member Garage is empty, add now Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: USA Posts: 2,816 iTrader Rating: (0)	Re: (turboeg77) If your car was sitting all winter maybe you have some water in your tank from temp. change. Thats what happend to me. Just an idea. Kevron __________________ 94civiccx -The things which we fear the most in life have already happend to us. FEAR: F--FALSE E--EVIDENCE A--APPEARING R--REAL My vouches: http://www.ef-honda.com/main/viewtopic.php?t=5336 http://feedback.ebay.com/ws/eB...=1883

04-19-2006, 06:11 AM	#19
yellowturbo Member Garage is empty, add now Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Montreal, QC, Canada Posts: 1,850 iTrader Rating: (0)	update... its not the MSD SCI box... I removed the box last weekend and it still do the same stupid thing. Damn I cant understand what could cause the car to misfire always at the same spot. I did another test... if I floor the throttle at 2500 RPM and let the boost built it wont do anything ?????? Its just when im partial throttle.... I begin to suspect a tuning issue..... __________________ SOHC GT28RS .82ar http://images.honda-tech.com/set1/smile/emthup.gif 17 psi of fun on the street.

04-19-2006, 10:52 PM	#21
Weq Garage is empty, add now Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 216 iTrader Rating: (0)	my friend had a similiar problem with his microtech, the ignition driver had issues with higher revs. He did the same, MSd box and all, nothing helped until he switched EMS's.

04-19-2006, 11:30 PM	#23
Synapse Garage is empty, add now Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Coastal, CA, USA Posts: 446 iTrader Rating: (0)	Re: (turbozxi) sounds dumb, but I had a similar issue at part throttle. If you're running an HKS sequential BOV, try cranking on the spring or just run without vacuum line to the BOV and see if it fixes anything.

04-20-2006, 08:57 AM	#24
Importordomestic Honda-Tech Member Garage is empty, add now Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Hueytown, Al, United states Posts: 414 iTrader Rating: (0)	Re: (Synapse) I had the same problem with my MSD SCI box. BUt my engine is N/A, but i replaced all my grounds and the problem went away. __________________ 1990 - S13 - daily driver 1988 - Honda Accord Hatch - project car Currently: Bulding LS/Vtec Turbo. WTB: GE Ls/Vtec kit WTB: ITR Cams WTB: SC61 Precision Turbo Luck is a last resort, skill is everything up to the point that you get lucky and **** goes your way - Onemanlan

04-20-2006, 09:08 AM	#25
yellowturbo Member Garage is empty, add now Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Montreal, QC, Canada Posts: 1,850 iTrader Rating: (0)	thanks for all you reply. Im pretty sure that its my igniter... I will try a new one soon. __________________ SOHC GT28RS .82ar http://images.honda-tech.com/set1/smile/emthup.gif 17 psi of fun on the street.

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Misfiring problem. Always at 3800-4000 rpm under load ? ( gt28rs SOHC )