kc-runner

2001 Accord SE, 4dr, It has the chip in the key so you can't lock the doors with the remote to warm it up in the morning. At least that is what I read in the owners manual. Any ideas how to defeat this function, yet not disable the security system entirely??

19Accord97

On my 97 (didnt have a remote lock) you have to manually hold open the outside drivers door handle and then push down the lock on the inside of the door.

I don't think you'll be able to warm the car up without having to go outside anyways. Not bad since warming up a car is a waste of gas, causes more wear and tear, and takes longer to warm up.

cstone

idk about you but it hits below 0F where i live sometimes. warming it up is worth it for me. 5 minutes of idleing cant cause that much harm. i see what you are saying though

to the op. i carry a spare key in my wallet. you can get ones that dont have the plastic on them so they arent thick. then you can use the other guys suggestion to lock the doors (or just use your other key for that matter.) i am pretty sure that there is no way to arm your alarm while the car is started (anyone else have some insite into this?) it seems like you couldnt do that because the kill switch would shut the car down. i would imagine that there is a way to wire the alarm to be able to do it, but i dont have a clue how to do it.

JonJuan

Don't Know about the 6th gen but I do what 19Accord97 does in my '94 hold the handle up and use my spare because if you use the remote it actuates the locks which trips the lockout protection and the door unlocks.....frustrated the hell outta me until I figured that out.....but if its an auto i would just go to an alarm/stereo and have them install an add-on remote start to the factory alarm....problem solved!

kongzilla

Easy solution. Just get a remote start.

19Accord97

Its about -11 to -15 with the windchill.

You can warm up the car a heck of alot faster if you put a small piece of cardboard over the radiator and drive it. You just cant put a massive piece.

philadd

Use an extra key to lock the doors manually. For less chance of someone breaking into your car and driving away with it, get a remote start.

YeuEmMaiMai

use the other key? yeah that works..and letting the car idle like that is bad for your car. get in, start it up, wait a min or scrape your windows, drive away. ur car will warm up quicker and you will use less fuel

YeuEmMaiMai

*****..... it was -25 here without the windchill and we are not even the coldest place lol

cstone

to every one saying that it is harmful to your car to warm it up. how harmful can it really be? cars are designed with sitting at stop lights in mind right? how is that any different than letting the car idle for a few minutes? i know it is a bit of a waste of gas but besides that how does it harm the car. just trying to further my knowledge.

19Accord97

I forgot to mention I don't wear clothing...so I bet I was colder than you! :p

Cold and heat cause metal to expand and contract. When your car is cold the piston and cylinder both shrink. However, they do not shrink in relation to each other. Because of this the minute space between the cylinder wall and piston can come into contact with each other. You may ask how. Well, in cold temperatures, oil is much more thick, because it is cold it is harder on the oil pump and takes MUCH longer for the oil to lubricate the top of the cylinders. Therefore, when you let your car warm up by sitting there and idling for 10 minutes it is not getting lubricated for a heck of a lot longer had you been driving. This causes much more wear and tear.

But yes, like suggested. You should not start and instantly drive for the reasons I stated above. Letting it sit for about 30 seconds to a minute is perfect. Also, if you have an auto you should put it in gear after 10 seconds of starting. When you start the car and leave it in park, it does not activate the transmission pump, much to the same effect as the oil.

cstone

makes sence. thanks for sharing.

kc-runner

You guys are smoking something weird!!! Engines and transmissions are designed to run at operating temperatures. A lot of engine and transmission wear occurs when they are cold. The tolerances are designed to be correct when the car is at correct operating temp. When the oil is cold oil pressures skyrocket, putting added strain on oil pumps. Fuel doesn't vaporize when engines are cold. It takes temperature[heat] in the engines mass to help vaporize fuel even with dircet injection to burn efficently. You guys must be young enoug to have never driven a car with a carb or TBI. They were horrible to get started on bitter cold days. If you think I am full of %^& talk to someone you know about diesel engines and ask them what happens when you can't get enough heat built up in the engine for combustion to occur. Yes I know diesels rely soley on compression and heat for combustion. You might also ask the diesel guy what his oil pressure is when he starts a cold engine as I am sure he will have an accurate oil press gauge.

19Accord97

That is what I just posted.

Obviously the differences change back to the original specs when the engine is heated. This is why it doesn't apply to summer.

But I don't see what your oil pressure statement has to do with anything. Yes, the oil pressure is higher b/c the oil is thicker and harder to pump creating more pressure. But in no way does that lubricate the top of the cylinders on cold start up.

02 accord

So driving with the pistons slapping the cylinder walls (under load) every time they move, and with no lubrication, causes less wear than idling (no load) with no lubrication?

The trans oil pump is working whenever the engine is running. If it wasn't, whenever you put the car into gear and the solenoids open up, you would have no pressure to engage the gear you selected.

02 accord

Exactly. Putting a cold engine under load (driving to warm it up) causes way more wear than idling it until it warms up.

kc-runner

If you want to do something dramatic, try this. Put a container of oil you use in your engine in the freezer. Also put a container of 100% synthetic oil in the freezer. Take them out after they have been in overnight and pour them. The synthetic will pour/flow much better[lower viscosity] than the conventional oil. This didn't have a lot to do with what we are discussing other than it shows you how thick oil can become in freezing temps.
Letting an engine warm up before driving in cold temps will dramatically warm/thin the oil. The cold oil causes the oil pump to work much harder, hence the high oil pressures. You get the high oil pressures because it is much harder[requires more work] for the pump to push it through the passages. Now consider this, you start your car in cold temps and immediately drive off. The oil pressure will run several pounds higher than if the oil were warm. I know this from my GM Duramax pickup. Warm idle oil press about 30 psi. warm oil @ 1700 rpm about 50 psi. I typically use the engine heater in cold weather. When I don't use the engine heater cold oil idle 45-50 psi and 1700 rpm about 70 psi sometimes higher.
Tha concern about top cylinder lubrication is difficult to address. When you start the car there will be greater wear due to low oil pressure. This is why most engine wear occurs on start up. There are pre-start oiler systems on industrial engines to address this issue. Not practical on street gasoline engines. Some diesel engines have post shut down oil systems to cool the turbocharger bearings. Fact of the matter is idling creates oil pressure of an adequate psi to protect the engine. If it were possible to have the engine "high" idle it would be better for two reasons. First, lower fuel consumption due to improved cylinder gas/air flow. Second there would be greater oil pressure providing a greater level of lubrication.
Idling in cold weather is not going cause damamge to an engine. In cold situations it will likely increase engine life by not working the engine with cold highly viscous oil. Believe what you want, if idling caused irreperable or accelerated engine wear trucking companies would not allow their drivers to let trucks idle at all.

19Accord97

There is no way. If you begin to drive slow and cautiously it will still be much less wear. So its either a few minutes driving to warm up the engine or 20 minutes of metal to metal contact. Besides, the coolant temperature has nothing to do with the oil temperature if you are basing it on that gauge. Oil takes longer to heat up than coolant.

At the very least it is going to take at least 4 to 5 times if not more, to heat up than driving the vehicle.

cstone

It takes your car 20 minutes to warm up when idleing?!?! Mine takes 5-6 when its about 10 degrees out.... Even if it did take 20 minutes for it to warm up I highly doubt that it is 20 minutes of metal to metal contact. The oil is flowing when the engine is cold. Just maybe not as well as when it is warmed.

After reading about and thinking about it for a while my belief is that if you use the correct oil for your climate then it isn't a big deal. Synthetics are even better as they tend to thicken less under cold temperatures.

Take it for what you will, but on really cold days I am still going to warm my car up at least for a few minutes. I have never done it all the time because I like to save my gas for a little "spirited driving" now and then, only if it is truly cold.

19Accord97

It has been ice cold here. Just got 7 inches of snow.

I can drive for roughly 4-5 minutes going 30 mph and my coolant temp will just then hit the normal stage. So how long would it take had the car just been sitting there? The longest I let it warm up is as long as it takes me to scrape off the windows and whatnot.

To each his own, but I suppose a medium is what is best.

Blamm!!

you can't tell me idling a car is bad for it. THATS WHAT A MOTOR IS DESIGNED FOR ... running !! It has oil pressure, coolant flow, fan runs if needed. How is this bad for an engine???

Dannyvho

Sure the engine is designed to run: so we might as well let it drive the car while it is warming up... At 3K rpm it only produces half of its max. power output so imho we are not pushing it too hard. Also the engine will reach its normal operating temperature faster while driving (simply because it gets more fuel fed into its cylinders).

b16racereg6

iTrader: (2)

i let my car warm up if im not to lazy for 10 or 15 min. then if im running late i just hop in and go i never had any issues with eather way. its really up to u if u ask me. **** it really comes down to if u want a warm car or not when u get in... lol man just buy a spare key or take a ride to the dealer and ask them about how to over ride the door lock issue... g/l

YeuEmMaiMai

you're incorrect and the OWNER'S manual backs what we are saying up.

Page 168 of my 2002 Acura CL Type S manual states"

A cold engine uses more fuel than a warm engine. It is not necessary to
‘‘warm-up’’ a cold engine by letting it idle for a long time. You can drive
away in about a minute, no matter how cold it is outside. The engine
will warm up faster, and you get better fuel economy.

idling the car causes it to

1. take longer to warm up
2. due to car running open loop cold, you are running significantly richer than you need to be for a longer time and this causes the oil to get loaded with fuel.

Diesel trucks are left running in the cold because if you shut them down, they will not easily start if left setting for any lenght of time. Also since diesel engines have more rings and thicker fuel, they do not have fuel run down issues like gas engines do so you CAN leave them idling as it is more ecomonical to idle and engine than to repeatidly stop and start it..

per your own own words you stated you use heater block........why do you think that is?


BTW diesel gensets actually use coolant heaters to keep the coolant warm to make the engine start easier........ typically around 90F. They typically go from dead stop to full load in about 13 seconds......and no oil heaters are used in a typical installation

Honda is smarter than you are and they know what they are doing when they tell you to get in the car and drive away gently after about a minute.

19Accord97

EXACTLY!!! Thank You