twkdCD595

I notice that the coolant will push into the overflow bottle but it will not pull it back into the radiator?

No leaks, brand new oem honda hoses, brand new oem toyo radiator cap for my car, etc.

The system is definately holding pressure, when i pull off the cap like a full day later... you can hear it like break the seal and suck in a bunch of air... so there is plenty of vaccum as it cools to pull back the collant from the bottle.

The nipple on the radiator neck is clear, so is the overflow bottle hoses, etc... I DONT GET IT. its driving me nuts... exactly what i am low on coolant is whats in the overflow bottle.

could it matter that the overflow bottle is not at the height of the radiator... it is mounted down about 6-8 inches below the neck height?

HELP PLEASE, this is driving me crazy... I am about to lose my mind.

twkdCD595

checked over everything agian, drained the entire system, refilled with coolant/ bleeder open till it flowed without air bubbles... continued for a few minutes more just to be sure.

remounted the overflow tank a little higher just in case as well.

everything seems good but we shall see what happens, will update.

feel free to comment on anything though still please.

onefastek9

bad cap maybe?? you can mount that bottle anywhere and it will still work, also i've seen where the cap is just wayyyyyyyy tooo tight. and then if that don't work out you've got too much pressure in your coolint system, all it wants to do is spit, but not suck. so you've got something wrong there, If you have too much pressure then there's no way it will suck coolint back into the rad.

twkdCD595

2nd brand new cap... oem honda, double checked the part numbers to be sure they got me the right one for my oem toyo manufactured radiator.

once it cools off, it has tons of suction pressure, draws in alot of air when i pop off the cap. so it should be plenty to draw back coolant. thats why i dont get it, and i doubt i have had multiple bad caps.

onefastek9

just because it's sucking pressure back WHEN you open the cap does not mean anything. tell you what, go buy a aftermarket gauge showing numbers in reading instead of arrows like a factory cluster and see if your over heating. if your spitting out, you have to be over 200 degrees easy, the car don't spit out coolint for nothing. gl

fourthgenhatchB17

Is it a stock overflow/reservoir tank? Either way, make sure the hose on the INSIDE of the tank goes all the way to bottom. i have seen a few cases where that hose is missing, thus causing coolant to enter the tank but not exit it.

OH_1fstgsr

iTrader: (2)

twkdCD595
What you are describing happened to me exactly. The out come, blown head gasket.
Once your cooling system cools down, lets say a day later, you shouldn't have any pressure in the system. Unless you are adding pressure from an outside source, lets say your cylinders during the combustion process.
You have a problem.
What has your temp gauge been doing? Normal or moving around a lot?

onefastek9

like I said, get a aftermaret temp gauge and sensor. you'll know very fast if your over heating or not, the stock cluster will not always tell you when it's overheating

fourthgenhatchB17

Its absolutely normal for the level in the coolant tank to rise and fall. Its not normal if the reservoir is overflowing. Which is happening?

onefastek9

y don't you just go buy a coolint pressure test kit from autozone or something, better yet you can rent the dang thing and find out very quick if you have a bhg or lhg.

that way at least your narrowing it down.

twkdCD595

I dont think it is a blown head gasket I would have other symptoms. None of which I have.

It does not overflow or overheat... sits well below midway point on stock gauges. stock gauge sucks I know, I charged up my laptop and I am going to plug it to the s300 to pull a datalog after a little driving. although if i was overheating, at 220 or more it should kick a check engine, which it does not.

it just is pushing coolant into the resivour (sp) and not drawing it back... so the resivour is holding just at over the max coolant level all the time. it seems to push just enough into there to annoy me honestly.

the hose is all the way down, no leaks in the hose or blockage... it just does not want to draw back coolant after it cools off. system holds pressure till you pull of cap, when cooled down it will draw IN air as soon as you crack the cap open. which is a problem i know, IE when cool the cap should be drawing back fluid from the overflow to equalize the pressure... and its not.

If it were lifting the head under boost it would agian like a blown headgasket, be showing other symptoms... hell pushing the boost level I am pushing through this setup it would blow the hose off the thing or they would balloon and be like rocks... they dont do any of that. on a side note I have a stock mls head gasket, big arp studs, etc... and this is an f22 btw.

also after refilling system and rebleeding it will new oem hoses upper and lower, new oem clamps, new oem cap, etc.. it still did is pushing coolant into the overflow bottle and not drawing it back. so the level is at the "max" line like all the time. when i pop the cap, the radiator will be low on fluid by the exact amount in the overflow.

edit: to add though i am going to compression test it and leak down test it just to be safe... i dont think i need to but it should tell me real quick if its something more serious. also the plugs look great after i do a pull, then take em out for a look nice color, no deposits, no clean spots (coolant leaking into cyl from a blown hg would steam them), no steam from breather or exhaust, no oil in water, no water in oil, no leaks around the head externally, no sweet smells like burning coolant, etc... hence why I am at a loss.

maybe i need to try a 3rd new cap, it all basically comes down to the cap unless its something like i have a air pocket the system just will not burp or bleed... only thing I can think of honestly.


Modified by twkdCD595 at 2:39 AM 8/31/2008

OH_1fstgsr

iTrader: (2)

If it was blown right now, you would have more symptoms. The problem is it hasn't completely blown, you have the early signs. Many people wait until it is to late to save the engine.
If you have replaced every possible part of the coolant system and you still have the problem, look some place else. Outside the engine and inside the engine.
How many psi of boost do you run? How many boosted miles on this engine?
Do a leak down test. One of my cylinders only showed a 2% difference over the others, funny enough that was the one once I pulled the head off.
I tried three different OEM caps, no change. Now I have two spares.
Let use know what your data logging test shows. 15-20minutes of random driving should do the trick.

PrettyLude

check the compression of all cylinders

p10hlm

i would point towards a bad h/g

twkdCD595

if it was blown wouldnt it continue to fill my overflow every time i was in boost? it does not, once the overflow gets some fluid in it, it just stays at the same level all the time. the not drawing it back part just caught my attention cause I am paranoid of everything and overthink everything.

datalogs look good, nothing out of the ordinary... coolant temps are normal, they go up a little when in boost for a couple gear pul but thats going to happen when i have my turbo within 2 inches of the radiator and egts are over 1000 on a good pull. still within temps a unboosted setup would see that had a stock thermostat (mine is a 180).

compression test will not tell me anything really, a leak down is going to be done when i can get it up to the shop today if i have time... no compressed air at my house ftl. also going to pressurize the cooling system as well for leakdown.

i am pushing anywhere from 16psi to over 20 psi dpending on gear and whatnot... which i would think if it was going to the coolant system would make the hoses rock hard or blow them off, blow the cap off, etc. I seen 12 psi blow a cap or hoses off on a slightly leaking HG.

even if it was only slightly leaking hg... i should see some other symptoms. i just dont want to tear into as a hg and that not be the issue... not fun and i hate redoing the timing belt.

twkdCD595

no leaks in the coolant system checked it twice... it holds pressure.

i am noticing little black specs of like rubber or something in the coolant but this is the same radiator as before when i blew a head gasket so i dont know if it is residue from that black coating on HG peeling or maybe deterorating hoses. hoses are new now though just replaced them and they appears to be scaling a little on the inside of them. definately not oil but rubber like material.

no chance to do a leakdown yet.

when i let the engine fully warm up with cap off... it pushed out a air bubble but after that no bubbles which i am told i would see with a blown HG, unless its only lifting the head in boost. although with arps i dont see how they should be holding the head down.

twkdCD595

maybe the intake manifold gasket leaking since i show no other HG signs? the black specs are just maybe residue from HG block on old setup.

note old setup was stock head bolts, stock HG with 80k miles, boost spiked to 20+ psi when wg line came off... since motor has been decked flat, head decked flat, all new everything except same old radiator.

btw i pull -20 to -21 in hg of vac at idle also which seems pretty good i think... going to try to get the leakdown on the motor done asap hopefully that will shed some light on the situation. if the head is lifting under boost though i dont know if charging each cyl with pressure will show anything.

ForceFed Motorsports

Even if you were pushing your hg a bit the level in the resevoir should reside back down to normal after idling for a bit. Mine pushed a bit on 18lbs stock block so the resevoir would fill a bit but always back down after awhile. Let us know what you find after the leakdown. If you wanna verify your HG is not blown take it to a shop with a 5 gas analyzer and check the cooling system for hydro carbons

twkdCD595

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by ForceFed Motorsports &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Even if you were pushing your hg a bit the level in the resevoir should reside back down to normal after idling for a bit. Mine pushed a bit on 18lbs stock block so the resevoir would fill a bit but always back down after awhile. Let us know what you find after the leakdown. If you wanna verify your HG is not blown take it to a shop with a 5 gas analyzer and check the cooling system for hydro carbons </TD></TR></TABLE>

yea kinda what i was thinking... problem is it still does not pull back coolant.

Garage 808 Hatch

MY EG did the same thing, no other issues, but it was a blown headgasket.

postman

replace the hose going to your overflow and the hose in your overflow bottle.

since everybody else is saying h/g and i dont agree hear is my theory.{mind you im intoxicated}

teh system is pressurising correctly upon cooldown and vacume stage the the hoses are collapsing from vac. and not allowing drawback into the radidiator.

peace.

Garage 808 Hatch

or, the combustion chamber is pressurizing the coolant system pushing it into the overflow. caused by a blown headgasket. to check this, do a leakdown test on the motor, with the cooling system full take off the rad cap, and test each cyl, look for bubbles to appear in the rad. thats how i found mine

postman

the cooling system pressurizes itself. you dont need combustion pressure to pressurize the coolant its supposed to push into overflow once max rad. cap pressure is exceeded. upon cooldown the sytem creates its own vac. and supp. to draw the same amt of coolant back in

Garage 808 Hatch

what i am saying is that a blown headgasket will over pressurize it. yes i know it pressurizes itself. im not a noob.

twkdCD595

yea leakdown has been delayed by the shitty weather here... car has basically not been out of the garage in over a week, so i have not had a chance to get it leakdown tested since i have no air. i know i need to do it asap, if we get a break from all this rain lately i am going to do it this week for sure.

overflow is new, lines to overflow are new, upper/ lower hoses are new, cap is new, and soon the radiator/ thermostat will be new as well just out of good measure. i run 2 electric pusher fans that are on pretty much constantly once the car reaches temp.


this may sound odd but would maybe turbo placement putting my turbo literally within an maybe an inch of my stock 10+ year old dinky 1 row radiator be something? a good friend of mine thinks i am superheating the coolant under boost, which pushes it to the overflow cause it boils.