MotorSpecies ver1.6

hello,my brand new type-r w. pump(19200-p72-013) didnt have any dowel pins when i opened the packaging. im basically thinking on installing the unit without the dowel pins(centering bolt holes by eye and torquing properly). what do you think???It shouldnt move anywhere while engine operation or over time,right???

thank you

MotorSpecies ver1.6

any advice/experience

mmuller

dont do it.

98vtec

one shift of the water pump and the heat is on.

MotorSpecies ver1.6

thats is the thing......individuals put type-r(19200-p72-013) water pumps on there jdm b16a's ,right??

I just got back from honda and found that the part# is the same for a 99 civic Si (that one didnt come with the dowels either).
I ask the parts man to look up a 94 del sol vtec and the screen came up listing a b17a for a 94 del sol vtec(WTF?!?!?!).At that point, i figured Id leave because of retarded info.

I noticed 2 different manufacturersYamada)on the type-r unit and (KEI HIN)on the old unit.

The bolt holes on the old unit have tapered(expanded hole) for the dowels but the new unit simply has (flush)straight through holes.

I think individuals are using 19200-p72-013's on jdm b16a's, am I right?

bluedlude

My H22 water pump doesnt have and dowels to hold it in place. just 5 small bolts.

but the more i look at it, it looks like you need dowels for all of the holes other than the one your thumb is on right?

Brick Top

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 98vtec &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">one shift of the water pump and the heat is on.</TD></TR></TABLE>

haha! well put.

crxowner

I just looked at mine and it doesn't have any either, so I wouldn't worry about it.

Brick Top

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by crxowner &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I just looked at mine and it doesn't have any either, so I wouldn't worry about it.</TD></TR></TABLE>

LOL!!

bluedlude

If those holes on the pump are only for dowels like it looks like, then the block isnt going to have any threads for you to bolt into. where you at species?

crxowner

Mine is brand spanking new from the dealership

bluedlude

so can someone answer my question. does the block have threads for you to bolt the pump on with, or did it only use the dowels?

crxowner

Yes there are threads in the block

freakyty2.3

JEEZ INSTALL THE PUMP AS IS! ! ! ! ! It's not going to hurt anything nless your the most unlucky SOB on the planet and the pulley locks up and tries to turn the whole pump. That wouldnt matter though because regardless your motor will be toast at that point. The holes have just enough room to fit the bolts and the pumps not going anywhere. NEXT DUMB QUESTION PLEASE.

mmuller

main concern is not the water pump twisting.. is shifting a little and changing timing/skipping .
i always use some if not on the bolt holes on the dowel holes outside the pump.
but i guess brand new ones dont have them..? i guess honda does not believe you need them

Natural Aspirations

I am missing mine as well but really don't recommend not running them I will order a set before my motor goes together

Natural Aspirations

94301-08140 PIN A, DOWEL (8X14)

flyrod

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by mmuller &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">main concern is not the water pump twisting.. is shifting a little and changing timing/skipping.</TD></TR></TABLE>

That is the slack side of the belt. You could shift it around all you want and if you adjust the tensioner the timing will not be affected. As for skipping, set the tensioner. Bottom line, just put it on. Spin it by hand and if nothing is binding then you're set.

mmuller

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by flyrod &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

That is the slack side of the belt. You could shift it around all you want and if you adjust the tensioner the timing will not be affected. As for skipping, set the tensioner. Bottom line, just put it on. Spin it by hand and if nothing is binding then you're set.

</TD></TR></TABLE>

i meant shifting AFTER timing was set.

TurBoTeG

once that water pump shifts and the pump fins lodge themselves into the block and it freezes up causing it to eat a few teeth off the timing belt throwing the cam timing off resulting in a piston eating the valve...BOOM ..its just not worth it...risk it if you want

freakyty2.3

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by TurBoTeG &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">once that water pump shifts and the pump fins lodge themselves into the block and it freezes up causing it to eat a few teeth off the timing belt throwing the cam timing off resulting in a piston eating the valve...BOOM ..its just not worth it...risk it if you want </TD></TR></TABLE>

None of us Honda guys are making enough power to spin the water pump like that. If you care to waste the money someone put the part number up already. Waste of time!!!!!!

TurBoTeG

waste of money? its a freakin dowl pin!! they cost next to nothing. Making power has nothing to do with it. The Timing belt does have some pull on the pump..might not be enought to move it..but did you think that maybe when the enigne is running it creats vibrations..enough vibration in conjuntion with the timing belt to SHIFT THE PUMP.....not sure if it will actually hit the block with the bolts in place but at the very least it could cause premature gasket failure..but hey...i dont know anything..

flyrod

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by mmuller &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">i meant shifting AFTER timing was set. </TD></TR></TABLE>


I guess I still don't see what the problem is. Install the water pump, THEN set the timing and belt tensioner.

mmuller

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by flyrod &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">


I guess I still don't see what the problem is. Install the water pump, THEN set the timing and belt tensioner.</TD></TR></TABLE>

really ? i always install the belt first and THEN the pump....mmm lol

one of my paranoias is the pump shifting when the engine is running. without dowels that is. belt puts pressure on the pump at all times

freakyty2.3

The newer pumps don't have dewels I don't think. Can't remember been awhile since i installed one but im sure its not that big of an issue. Just buy dewels if you that scared so this thread will not keep going to the top.