Greyout

Hi all,

So I have a stock S2000 that will be hopefully on track this weekend. I do not pass the broomstick test, so I am trying to lower my seating position.

I have a sparco evo II, along with side mounts and sparco base, meant for another S2000. I am plotting to install this in the stock S2000, with both ends of the factory harness routed through the hip harness holes.

I wouls THINK as long as the harness is stuck against my lap, and not lifted off me (like it could be if it went around over the sear), this would be safe.

My question is, is this a giant no-no that will get me banned for life immediately once I am in the same zip code of the track, or, assuming that it looks safe, wouls most experienced track people be ok with this?

If it matters, the sparco seat base has a place to bolt on the seat belt receiever. I'm just worried about it being at a funny angle...

dirty19

iTrader: (1)

Submarine belt or no go IMO.
Sure way to wind up under the dash if you don't have something to keep you in place.

Garage_Spec

But would that pass tech? Never tried a factory belt with a bucket. A stock seats passes with a factory belt. Also some of us don't like living by the "what if" mentality, makes life extremely miserable and boring. Thought I'd mention that since most of the world are safety freaks now sadly.

Greyout

I'm trying to invision how this threat is any greater in my proposed setup compared to an oem seat. Especially since the sparco does not recline. (Not that I lay my stock seat way back, but still...)

Again this is an open lapping DE, not a time trial or race.

I will see how I can sort it out and post some pics to see if you guys see anything glaringly wrong.

Matt_EH3

I am actually interested in how this turns out. I am currently looking to get a passenger seat next year because I will be running at track days where organizers do not necessarily know me and will need to come on board to clear me for a few sessions.

I was going to install a bucket with the same belt setup you are describing, but if it is a big no-no, I may reconsider and try to find a harness. I am trying to find a cheap way to do this, since the passenger seat will most likely never be in the car most of the time.

As an instructor myself, I have gotten into passenger seats that are way more dangerous than this setup, so I dunno... I would personally prefer this setup to, say a stock seat with stock belt and no door card. I could almost fall off the seat and become trapped between the door/cage door bar and the seat.

dirty19

iTrader: (1)

It doesn't matter if this is an open lapping DE or lead follow conga line. Safety is safety.
I'm no safety **** I only speak of what id do. just me. what chances you take with your life, well that's all up to you.
It doesn't take much for you to end up under your dash.... recline or no recline.
Without a sub belt you can easily end up there.
What was it two years ago at Chuckwalla where a driver and his passenger ended up under the dash with one dying?
I believe it was said the impact was at 70mph.. 3 point harnesses.

Sure everyone always says ohhhh that cant happen to me, or what are the odds of me hitting some part of the track that isn't driven near.
I think if you look at all the HBRL drivers who happen to find unprotected portions of a track and really hit hard .
Then reflect that back to your street car which is less prepared than a race car id say your odds of walking away are much slimmer.
But that's just my .02
Weigh your life vs a little more money for proper belts?

Matt_EH3

The thing about safety is that no one will ever tell you that anything short of a fully caged car with a full containment seat, HANS and 6pt harnesses is safe. Even then, they may question your belt mounting points, how the seat is mounted and probably the cage design.

Why? Because if they say it is safe, then they will be afraid that you go out, take it for granted that you are safe and then boom, something happens and you get hurt. Too much responsibility for internet talk IMO.

known

iTrader: (1)

oem seat is designed to use the 3 pnt belt, so please dont compare that.

No way in hell I would trust a 3 pnt and a race seat even in a minor accident. I cant see how that would be legal in anything.

If the 3 pnt belt is snug on your waist, you could still slide under it like dirty mentioned.


There is no way around it if you get a race seat, you need a harness.

It sounds like youre a tall guy, which sucks in this situation. There isnt a lot of room to lower an s2k seat without someone cutting and welding.

Maybe it is possible, I wish you luck.

KoRn_vIRuZ

OP, this might be something to try: Lowering Factory seat correctly - S2KI Honda S2000 Forums

joel n

I run a Recaro race bucket for Auto-cross/lapping/TA. Factory 3 point belt. Never had any problems with any tech (only run in Nova Scotia) I do not see any difference between it and a factory seat as far as finding my way under the dash. IMO it is safer as it will not recline, and is built for higher load/impact then a stock seat. Mind you they are built for use with a 5-6 point belt. Some people run there stock belt through the upper shoulder and lower side holes. Helping the belt to be closer. Unfortunately for me, I am big enough the belt is against me anyway. lol.

Caoboy

I asked the same sort of question a while back. Responses were:

If you are running the factory 3pt belt, run a reclinable seat designed to work with a 3pt belt (think JDM Type R Recaro seats aka Recaro SRD model)

Or run the stock seat.

If you run a non reclinable seat, you need the associated hardware to go with it...5-6pt belt, and a cage/rollbar designed for harnesses.

known

iTrader: (1)

Watch this, and read what is said.


A reclinable seat is made for the 3 point harness, whether that be a recaro or stock seat. This is just showing the submarine aspect.


If you want to be a cripple so you can run a track day, have at it.


there is a right way to do it, and well the only way to do it.

Garage_Spec

Most of you guys are completely ignoring the question. He didn't really ask about what YOU think is safe. He asked if it will pass tech. If we wanted safety **** crap then we wouldn't be doing any of this stuff. We know the risks, thanks.

Caoboy

Then he should be calling whoever is sanctioning the race and asking them.

Garage_Spec

So then what is the point in this forum? I was under the assumption it is for help and support from a community of like minded enthusiasts. Unfortunately that isn't always the case. It would be different if the OP was complaining about being injured after a known risk that he chose to avoid. He simply asked a simple question.

Caoboy

This is the question OP asked.

We gave our opinion on what would seem safe. I wouldn't be surprised if some of these people who answered his question also volunteered at tracks and maybe even have done a tech inspection or two.

Greyout

Well, as it turned out the EVO II seat, bolted to side-mount brackets and then attached to the sparco seat base adapter, is about an inch and a half TALLER than the stock seat.

So that don't work. Everyone can chill out. I'm a little worried about getting the seat lower in the race car, but that can wait. Priority is still to get the daily S2k tech-worthy for open lapping DE's.

Now I'll give you something else to argue about: The plan B is a Safety21/(Cusco) bolt in 4-point roll bar.

shown here, in non-ricer black


For those preparing their internets for the argue, TIL that they come in black when you order it in steel, and ricer-blue when you pick chromoly instead.

I have never given their cages a second thought, and lol'ed at any car I've ever seen with a cusco bolt in cage.

But this one is steel, satisfies the requirements of a higher roll bar for track days, and, after a tumble through the weeds held up enough in this example that I don't feel like I'm being too disingenuous in my efforts to comply:


Soooo.... stock seat, stock belt, and that thing.

Edit: Thanks to everyone for their input

known

iTrader: (1)

Tech inspection is about safety, to the guy that thinks we should know local tech inspection rules for every region and organization. I wouldnt sign off on it myself if I were inspecting. Which is why I showed info on why I thought it was a bad idea. We are talking about peoples lives here, and having people cry because we give the right answer when it comes to safety....well, sorry for being a safety **** and caring for others well being.

I would be interested to see more pics of that terrible accident?

Was it the bolt in cage that helped that situation, or was it the design of a convertible to be able to sustain that damage. The zones they strengthen are to save the drivers life, so it may have nothing to do with that cusco, or maybe it did help keep the cabin a little more stiff.

Does that make sense?

Sorry to hear about your seat issue still...Im lucky and Imshort so I never had to deal with it.

Greyout

I was really surprised how high the assembled EVO / side mount / base adapter was. Even with the velcro cushion removed, which basically means I'm sitting on the fiberglass shell, I was no lower than the stock seat.

It's hard to say if the accident car above actually landed on the roll bar. The windshield obviously took a hit, but every wreck is unique and that bar may have done nothing. The story is that the car rolled down an embankment several times but who knows.

That car is the only example I can find of that particular roll bar in an accident. There are a few other pictures floating around but they don't show any more detail.

known

iTrader: (1)

Anyway you can go to a custom fab guy to install a floor pan so you fit?

Greyout

That's a strong possibility on the race car. Trying to not hack up the street car.

First mistake was probably buying a daily driver that I would want to take on the track