Turbo Dan

option 1.
hoosier R6 or A6

option 2.

avon tech R-A

option 3.

kumho V710


others?

hancook?

im looking for a full out race tire in 15 inch, 205 50, that i can use as a track only tire, one that i would only use on the racetrack.
main purpose would be auto x racing.
and i would be getting them heat cycled by tirerack for the extra 15 a piece.

does anyone have a site with reviews?

vietnameeh

so which is it?
autox or track events?

for autox i would run the 710s... but im starting to hear the new hoosiers are real nice...

for track use id prolly use toyo ra1s

Reid

FWIW, those are all DOT R compounds, not "slicks".

If you have to ask questions like this, odds are you're not ready to use R compounds. A beginner should not be using R compounds, as it will hinder learning.

How much experience do you have?

Jaker

You should use the Hoosier A6 if it will be strictly for autocross, or the R6 if it is either strictly for road racing, or a combination of both road racing and autocross. If you go with the A6, Hoosier themselves are not reccomending heat cycling anymore, and if you look at the "care and feeding" links on Tire Rack for the A6, it also mentions that heat cycling is no longer necessary. Is this a marketing ploy by Hoosier to sell more tires, or is it really not needed anymore? Who knows.

The V710 is another great tire. It works great as an autocross tire, but as a road race tire, it requires some discipline in heat management. It will overheat pretty bad if you go 110% for more than 9-10 laps.

The Avon does not appear to be as fast a tire as the other 3 mentioned above.

The reason the A6 won't work well as a road race tire, is that the compound is substantially softer than the R6, and a bunch softer than the V710, so it will heat up fast, but overheat really soon as well. The V710 suffers from the same problems, but to a lesser degree. The soft compound is what make them both really good autocross tires.

nsxtasy

All of the above tires are very good R comps. So are others - Toyo RA-1, Michelin Pilot Sport Cup, Hankook Z211 and Z214, Yoko A048, Nitto NT01, etc.

I agree with Reid's comment about not using R compounds if you're a beginner.

The term "heat cycling" is used in two different ways. Some people use it to mean each time you bring the tire up to racetrack temperatures (VERY hot). Others, including the Tire Rack, use it to mean only using it enough to stretch the tire molecules. You can accomplish the exact same thing as the latter by putting the tires on the car, driving at least 15-20 miles on the highway at normal highway speeds, and then taking them off the car for a couple days. Which means, unless you need the tires in a hurry, you can save their $15/tire fee by doing this yourself...

SnlpeR

ive been using the nitto nt01s for about 9 months of 90% autox use
ive done about 200 50sec autox runs on these tires and only now are they showing cords on the outside edges
time to get another set

MiataRich

I agree. You should go to a few autocrosses, drive your car as is and ask questions of the guys who know what they are doing. This will save you a lot of money and headache.

Holding monSteR

I gotta agree with Reid and the others saying not to get R compounds if you aren't an experienced driver. I drove on streets for my first two auto-x seasons and graduated to Toyo RA-1's and now have two seasons on them (I'll be going to 710's or A6's next year). Running on R's will mask alot of beginner's driving errors and you likely won't be using the tire to it's full extent anyway. You'll learn alot more driving streets for a while, though you won't have nearly as impressive runtimes.

When my wife started atuocross last year i forced her to drive on her stock RE-92's (wrx). She quickly outgrew the grip they provided but driving on them forced her to be smooth and i think she's much better for the experience.

FWIW i think the RA-1's are a good first R compound (when you're ready), providing a good step up in grip from the best street tire, but long lasting and easy to care for. Although the 710's seem to be awfully durable for the grip they provide.

nsxtasy

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by CanadianR &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">FWIW i think the RA-1's are a good first R compound (when you're ready), providing a good step up in grip from the best street tire, but long lasting and easy to care for.</TD></TR></TABLE>

I agree. I also like the fact that they're cheaper than other R comps. I've been very happy with the RA-1 for my HPDE events.

For comparison, here are prices for the 205/50-15 size for R comps (prices from the Tire Rack except where indicated, and do not include shaving, heat cycling, shipping, etc):

Avon Tech R-A $165
Hankook Z214 $170 (Frisby)
Hoosier R6 $187
Kumho Ecsta V710 $156
Michelin Pilot Sport Cup $189
Toyo RA-1 $130 (Frisby)
Yokohama A048 $182

Vracer111

Forgot the Nitto NT-01's, $134 at Discount Tire...

Turbo Dan

here is my situation.
my car has power, it has suspension and also has braking.

ive been to 2 autocross events, both with a practise session and a figure 8 to try to dial in the car.

the tires i run right now are falken azenis, the turtle shell grip old school azenis.

i havent driven on an all season or milder summer tire in a long time so i don't know how much different it is.

but the azenis are suppost to be good for auto x, but all i do is slide around with them, the front end diggs into corners and the rear end will pitch even under braking, i can basically put the car into a four wheel slide into a corner. and with no abs its very easy to lock the front end under braking, and my take off is tire spin for days, even when i turn the boost down as low as it goes (5psi)

even braking, then downshift to first in a tight corner, this will put the front tires into a slide, even with no braking and just deceleration, and then as soon as gas is applied i get tire spin. and then i go into a slalom and the rear is all over the place.

i need a tire that will let me put power to the ground, and brake hard, and corner sharper and more precise.

and i wanna get serious into auto-x so i figured i should get a good set of tires, who cares if im just starting out, im a very good driver imo and i handle my car very well.

if you are wondering about my driving, i was a second quicker on a 40 second autox lap than two stock nsx's and 911's and a stock 350z and others. i ran 18 of 35 drivers and 10 of the 18 had the r compound slicks.

vietnameeh

doesnt really say much...thats kinda like saying i beat a couple of camaros and mustangs that ran ESP but im in FSP...

what class did u run.. and what place did you come in your class?

Turbo Dan

this one wasnt classes, it was just to get times, they didnt take into account different classes, it was straight times.
and to be honest, im not doing this to compete with other cars, i do it because i have fun doing it, and i would like to improve on my times, for the sake of becoming a better driver.
im not going out there to win or whatever, im just going out to have fun, and i want tires that are gonna let me get the most out of my car.

i didnt ask in this thread if i should get r compounds, i asked which r compound is best for auto x.
its simple, tires and driver are my weak link, and i can get better tires, after that i just have to improve my driving. no point in going to an autocross with the entire car modded and ditching out on one of the most important parts (tires).

GoodEyeSniper

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Turbo Dan &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> no point in going to an autocross with the entire car modded and ditching out on one of the most important parts (tires).</TD></TR></TABLE>

All these guys will tell you the same thing. Driver is far, FAR more important than tires. And it's easier to improve driving skills with milder tires.

SnlpeR

^^^ oh so very true

theres a guy in our region that is a couple seconds quicker than a few guys with awd monsters and stickier tires

underpowered car + sticky tires = quicker than awd monster cars + stickIER tires
whats missing? ...... driver

cibola

I understand that you didn't want to turn this thread into a "should I get R compounds or not" but it is what it is now.

It really sounds to me like you are making a real beginner mistake, i.e. I am sliding all over the place and I spin my tires at start. What is happening to you is called <U></U>over driving your car<U></U>. I have been an instructor for a couple of years now and I have seen it plenty of times. You need to learn how to drive you car with your current equipment. Seat time will make you faster. I recommend you get the book Going Faster by Skip Barber, this book will cut more seconds off you times than any R compound.

If you go into R compounds it will mask all the mistakes you are currently making. You will be initially faster if you switch now but ultimately you will be behind the learning curve since you never learned how to drive your car.

To sum up, learn how to drive your car then go to R compounds.

Stinkycheezmonky

Another good book is "Secrets of Solo Racing" by Henry Watts (I think that's the author anyway).

If you're locking up your tires left and right, it's because of the inputs you're giving the car. There are plenty of people with similar setups that drive the car just fine on street tires. Stick with them if you want to improve YOURSELF. At the worst, get a new set of Azenis, in case yours have had too many heat cycles put into them.

Turbo Dan

my problem is that the car is too light and too powerful for the tires.

plain and simple.

from my experience these things are key in auto-x.
-fast acceleration with grip
-fast braking with grip
-hard cornering with grip

fact is, the car i have is too powerful and too light for my tires.

imo, my driving could obviously use some work, i need to learn how to brake hard without locking and a few other things, but i dont think having good tires is a problem, i dont think it would cause me to stop learning how to drive.

one of the big problems that is unique to my situation that most of you dont have to deal with is i only have a 2 month racing season per year.

autocross only runs 2 months of the year and the nearest autox track is 3 hours of driving away.

for this reason its very hard for me to become a better driver in autocross because i have so much downtime in a year, and during racing season i can only make a few events.

at this rate it would take me probably 10 years to get to the point to where you people would suggest upgrading tires by the sounds of it.

so i want to rush my learning curve on purpose because i dont get to race every day and progress naturally i need to push it.
i wanna push my car as hard as it can go, and right now that means upgrading tires.

Aahj

You could spend $500 and maybe drop a couple tenths off of your time...or spend the same amount at an Evolution Performance Driving School and drop a couple SECONDS off of your time. I'm living proof. As soon as I started autocrossing, I had a turbo civic as well and the suspension and brakes were already modified. It wasn't competitive in its current class so after two events, I sold it and bought a stock Honda CRX and ran in G-stock with street tires. Took an EPDS and then made the switch when I was ready. It all depends on your priorities...I really wanted to become a better driver then make my car faster. But I thought "what's the point on improving its performance if I can't get the most out of it."

Just my 2 cents...you probably hate us all by now.

AJ

vietnameeh

ull prolly overheat the r comps anyways...

Jaker

If I had to guess, I'd say your somehwere in Alaska close to Anchorage, so I understand your predicament.

Turbo Dan

i would love to take a driving school in the future, possibly bmw driving school or whatever, but it might be wasted as you need to keep up your driving skills, and if you stop racing for a long time you can forget skills and lose practise. so its maybe not the best thing right now.

im in canada, i race in saskatchewan and manitoba, but i plan on moving to alberta closer to where i can autocross every weekend in the summer time.

azian21485

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Turbo Dan &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
one of the big problems that is unique to my situation that most of you dont have to deal with is i only have a 2 month racing season per year.

autocross only runs 2 months of the year and the nearest autox track is 3 hours of driving away.

for this reason its very hard for me to become a better driver in autocross because i have so much downtime in a year, and during racing season i can only make a few events.

at this rate it would take me probably 10 years to get to the point to where you people would suggest upgrading tires by the sounds of it.

so i want to rush my learning curve on purpose because i dont get to race every day and progress naturally i need to push it.
i wanna push my car as hard as it can go, and right now that means upgrading tires.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Semi-serious: Go get some steelies with snow tires and start rally crossing those 10 months of "off season." Everything you learn in the snow (and it will probably be hard as hell) will easily translate to dry grip pavement...except alot easier and faster.

Turbo Dan

yeah, ive got 5 years of full winter driving under my belt, so that in itself gives me a slight edge over thoes less fortunate.
i would never drive my crx in the winter, i have an 88 4 door sedan with studded tires that i rip around with.
ive avoided winter colissions most people would end up with two totalled cars.

thanx btw for all the interest and info posted in this thread everyone

LBHgti

Hoosier FTW!!

But seriously, if you're new to the sport, and only run a couple times a year, I'd figure that anything round and black without cords poking through is fine....or toyos. I run Hoosiers because there is no tire rule in my series and they are the only ones who make a 205 thats an inch wider than any other 205 and fits under my fenders. I use toyos on the back of the car when I tow it on the dolly.