Kent in KC

Hi guys. Okay, my '03 Element (same engine as a Civic) started acting up on a real, REAL windy day. Engine would race, then wouldn't idle. Threw a Check Engine light. After a couple days the light stayed on but the engine settled down, more or less, still idles too low (like 500 rpm).

So, I check the ODBII codes, I get two:
P0141 02 Sensor Heater Circuit Bank 1, Sensor 2 and...
P1121 Throttle Position Sensor Input Lower Then Expected

The Honda dealer is trying to tell me it needs the intake manifold replaced, for $500. What!?

Whadya think? Is the first one the o2 sensor downstream of the catalytic converter? What do I do about these problems? Also, how do you reset the Maint Reqd light?

Thanks, I really appreciate your time.

kharned08

https://honda-tech.com/zerosearch is your best friend on this site...

for the maint reqd light:
1) Turn your car off.
2) Push and hold the trip reset button on the instrument panel.
3) While still holding the button, turn on your car to acc.
4) Continue to hold the button (for about 5-10 seconds) until the light turns off.
5) Turn your car off again.

Kent in KC

Thanks! ANy ideas on the P1121 code? i.e. what to do about it?

Targa250R

The Element engine (K24A4) is not the same as a Civic engine; it's actually the same as an '03-05 Accord 4-cylinder (but not an '02-06 CR-V, since the Element does not have a dual-stage intake manifold).

As far as the P1121 code, the TPS is integrated into the throttle body. You may indeed need a new throttle body, but not the complete intake manifold. I have seen this TPS problem before on a few CR-Vs, but the CR-V throttle is a hefty $800+ for the part alone; Honda may have released a TSB on the issue but I can't remember the specifics.

The cost of the Element throttle is $255.13 new, gasket $3.82, plus labor to install and reset the computer. I'm not sure what the book specifies on labor time.

You may want to just reset the ECM for now and drive the car for a while to see if the Check Engine light comes back on again. If it doesn't, then the problem was just a random failure and shouldn't be a concern. If it does come back on, then you will have to replace the throttle body. If you're handy, you might want to pick up a used one from a salvage yard and install it yourself.

How many miles do you have on the vehicle?

Kent in KC

Thanks, Targa. I reset the ECM and the check engine light immediately came back on. How can a throttle body go bad? Its a piece of cast aluminum is it not? Why would it suddenly fail? Could it be a sensor instead of the throttle body itself? Would that error also lead to the O2 error? My toaster has 136,000 miles on it.

Targa250R

I checked my labor books; the labor time on the throttle body is 0.6 hours. I'm not sure if the Honda labor book specifies the same.

The throttle body itself isn't bad - it's the throttle position sensor (TPS) that is bad. Unfortunately, the TPS cannot be replaced separately.

Occasionally, O2 sensor errors can be caused by other problems with the fuel injection system (in which the TPS is included). I would fix the throttle issue first, then reset the computer and drive the car for a few days to see if the O2 sensor code comes back. Be prepared to replaced the O2 sensor if it does. Cost for the part is $139.02 ('03 Element secondary).