lude512

I just did the h22a4 swap in my 95 si and some how it jumped time so I'm in the process of changing the timing belt and I noticed the balance shaft belt was loose. I did some research and saw there was a delete kit for about 130 but I also heard that you can just remove the belt and it will relieve tension off the crank giving a tad bit more hp with the downfall being some vibration while driving. What are yalls opinons?

88h22_CRX

The "balance shaft assembly" weighs about 14lbs from what I've read, I've never weighed it personally. So it reduces a little extra strain from the rotating assembly when turning high rpms. Hp? Again, I've read around like 3hp.
As far as just removing the belt, idk if that's a good or bad idea, KStuned sells an amazing kit and also has a video taking you through the installation.
The reason it exists is because the engines are built in masses and it minimizes small vibrations in the engine.
Sorry I couldn't answer your question, just trying to help.

Tyler Dirden

iTrader: (3)

Do not remove the ballancer shaft belt. These high output VTEC motors (200+HP) are really MUCH better off with this harmonic management device. The belts just don't slip when properly adjusted and tightened. There is a huge benifit to removing the hydraulic tensioner assembly that controls the timing belt tension. ALL of the components needed to make this swap can be found in an F22 motor timing kit except for the belt; use the H22 belt. Hydraulic tensioners are unpredictable and can destroy a motor instantly when the timing belt slips.
Don't fall for the 3HP @ 8400 rpm pitch. Drag racing ONLY motors don't use the ballancer and live for sveral hours (couple years of hard passes) before a rebuild. Drag racing motors also do not use VTEC on these motors(completely disabled to the high cam) so there is no need for additional equipment.
Finish your build, time it right (look up the procedure) there are alot of steps and things to line up, and be totally amazed at the pure power in this swap. Most guys biuld quite a motor to get 200HP and yours is stock with some room to grow. You will never regret the swap once it's in right.

snobordboy

Since I first took the belt off of my old H22, I have seen no need to run one again. That engine is still fine without it 7 years later, and my h23 has the shafts deleted completely.

At the worst, leave the belt of when you dod the job, and if you notice any vibration, put a new one in.

spoolinlude

I don't know what the guy 2 posts above is talking about. I have seen/had motors with 50k plus miles and no balance shafts. One was a fully built turbo car/daily that had 50k of hard miles/track passes/city driving on it in a 5th gen prelude. Would of had many more miles but the car was reverted to stock/stock motor dropped in and sold. That motor was then freshened up (only because it sat for 2 years) and is now sitting in my car. My old h23 also had no balance shafts and no issues with vibrations. I've also had/seen stock h22's with no belts and no issues.

The power increase isn't worth the removal/no belt. I do it out of simplicity sake.

The vast amount of 'drag motors' still use Vtec BTW. The 800hp + crowd may use some web or other custom grinds that are vtec killers. However the majority of high hp h22s use stock cams or Skunk Pro1's...... both of which utilize vtec.

Roger made 800+ on stock cams in a h23vtec.

Sparksman

Its not a mod to "gain" HP. Its a mod to free up some of the HP you already make. Similar to a lighter flywheel, it is less weight on the crank every revolution. It will make your motor a tad bit more peppy and rev faster. I have the Kaizenspeed balance shaft delete and a 8lbs flywheel, havent installed engine yet, but this will help alot for autocross which i intend to use for. Also will help in a rolling start, but will hurt your launch from a dead standing. Unless you have driven your car for awhile, i doubt you could notice the difference when just cutting the belt. But its there.

DeadlockRiff

My uncle removed the Balance Shaft Belt when he got it 17 years ago. (96 Accord)

Me and him both drive pretty hard and for 200k+ miles without a belt I can happily say my engine has been fine.

EDIT: Granted it's an F series but that should change very little in this case considering the closeness of these motors.

lude512

Thanks to all of yall. I appreciate all your thoughts about this issue and it helps put me alittle more at ease with this. Will do the timing this weekend and will most likely leave the belt off.

Sparksman

oh and I know the shafts arent 14lbs... Idk where the guy pulled those numbers from...? When i removed them from my old block to scrap my best guess would be about 3 pounds each, maybe 6-7lbs tops. At least if you do the full delete kit the plugs you put in increase your oil pressure for better lubrication.

snobordboy

For giggles I weighed a set, and both shafts, along with the front gear casing that is removed if you get a block-off plate, is 12 lbs total.

friutoftheLude

even when you leave the belt off, remember to still replace the seals to the balance shaft...

Sparksman

How much were the shafts alone? The weight of the casing shouldnt be included. Maybe if you were just trying to just eliminate weight as your main goal. Im curious about rotating weight removed, not dead weight. If that makes sense lol.

DeadlockRiff

I believe he is referring to, the shafts and the toothed gears that are driven via belt. Assuming that's what he means by casing.

lude512

Fruitofthelude you said I need to replace the balance shaft seal regardless even when just pulling the belt? Would a loose balance shaft belt cause the engine to jump time? Sorry if I sound stupid.

DeadlockRiff

It shouldn't cause the timing belt to jump time or the engine for that matter but the shafts will no longer be in time and having out of time balance shafts are worse than no belt as far as vibration is concerned.

lude512

I was looking at the balance shaft pulley and noticed the slot where the key sits was chipped and doesnt allow the pulley to sit right. Can I use a balance shaft pulley off an h23a1 or would I NEED to use one off an h22. What could have caused it to jump time then?

the171

Ive tried both ways. I run all oem and i prefer it this way. Its a bit more smooth. Removing the system is ok too... Its all preference I guess. I like to be a nerd and leave Honda's majic in the bottom ends alone. Especially on the temperamental H series.

flyrod

It sounds like you already know the trade-off. If you take the belt off you get a small amount of power and some extra vibration. Either way, do the manual tensioner on the timing belt though.