Do I need to hone the cylinder walls?
01-08-2010, 08:13 PM
#1
Honda-Tech Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Road rage, state, us
Posts: 383
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Do I need to hone the cylinder walls?
Recently, I found out I have a bent rod no scoring though. Do I have to hone the cylinder walls? Also, I will be replacing all the rings, rod and main bearings.
Thanlks.
Thanlks.
01-09-2010, 06:46 AM
#2
Honda-Tech Member
iTrader: (1)
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: San Francisco, CA, US
Posts: 5,347
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Re: Do I need to hone the cylinder walls?
Different people will say different things about the pros and cons. The answer is that its your choice.
Some will say that the freshly honed cylinder walls will give the rings a better surface to mate to. Some will say that honing the block is a very difficult job to do WELL because of the material that H22/23 are made of (FRM) so machinists end up removing uneven amounts of material which will hurt the block more than it helps. For an FRM block like the h22 or h23, I personally would just give it a clean once over and call it a day.
Ask your local machinist what his opinion is and decide from there
Some will say that the freshly honed cylinder walls will give the rings a better surface to mate to. Some will say that honing the block is a very difficult job to do WELL because of the material that H22/23 are made of (FRM) so machinists end up removing uneven amounts of material which will hurt the block more than it helps. For an FRM block like the h22 or h23, I personally would just give it a clean once over and call it a day.
Ask your local machinist what his opinion is and decide from there
01-09-2010, 12:40 PM
#3
Honda-Tech Member
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: South Florida
Posts: 452
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Re: Do I need to hone the cylinder walls?
if theres no scoring theres really no need. you can if you want to but not too many people know how to correctly hone an FRM block so i would avoid the headache.
01-09-2010, 01:12 PM
#4
Honda-Tech Member
Re: Do I need to hone the cylinder walls?
And be sure this is NOT the 1st FRM motor they have worked on.
A Champion B series builder that hasn't touched an H series wouldn't be a choice I would make.
Very easy to screw up and you need special stones to do it.
A Champion B series builder that hasn't touched an H series wouldn't be a choice I would make.
Very easy to screw up and you need special stones to do it.
01-09-2010, 03:58 PM
#5
Honda-Tech Member
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: El Paso
Posts: 549
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Re: Do I need to hone the cylinder walls?
Even the Helms doesn't give the entire explanation on how to do it. I was reading an article on Hondatuning magazine the other day that was about honing FRM, it shows a special paste to polish the cylinders that's supposed to be used after honing to leave a mirror finish look on them, so yeah, it's hard to find someone that really knows how to do this.
01-09-2010, 07:43 PM
#7
Honda-Tech Member
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Jacksonville Beach, Florida, United States
Posts: 1,562
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Re: Do I need to hone the cylinder walls?
Honda service bulletin I read a while back...
Code:
SB618958 #18939 1990-2001 Prelude – Honing Fiber Reinforced Metal (FRM) cylinders 2000-01 S2000 All S2000 and 1990 and later VTEC and SI Preludes have Fiber-Reinforced Metal (FRM) cylinder liners. FRM honing is not required unless the cylinder has deep vertical scratches that run the length of the bore. Cylinders with light colored spots or flaking cannot be corrected by honing and must be replaced. To hone FRM liners, perform the following: · Use a rigid hone (not a ball hone) with GC-600-J or finer stones for nonferrous metals. The honing pressure should be 200-300 kPa (2-3 kg-cm2, 29-43 psi). · Use an oil type honing oil. · Hone at 45-50 rpm to a 60 degree-crosshatch pattern. · Do not stroke the hone more than 20 cycles. · After honing, thoroughly clean the engine block of all metal particles by washing with hot soapy water, then dry and oil them immediately. Never use solvent; it will only redistribute the grit. · Some light vertical scoring and scratching is acceptable if it isn’t deep enough to catch your fingernail, and doesn’t run the full length of the bore. (rm,sn)
Trending Topics
01-09-2010, 09:12 PM
#8
Honda-Tech Member
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 190
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Re: Do I need to hone the cylinder walls?
I asked this question for a week...
My Cylinders had no scratches and were fine...I didn't hone, dropped the Pistons in..car's running fine..still, my mechanic instincts always tell me to HONE, HONE, HONE...so everyday I start the thing i'm expecting something to go wrong but it hasn't, car runs strong and it's a beast...
My Cylinders had no scratches and were fine...I didn't hone, dropped the Pistons in..car's running fine..still, my mechanic instincts always tell me to HONE, HONE, HONE...so everyday I start the thing i'm expecting something to go wrong but it hasn't, car runs strong and it's a beast...
01-10-2010, 09:08 AM
#9
Honda-Tech Member
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: El Paso
Posts: 549
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Re: Do I need to hone the cylinder walls?
Honda service bulletin I read a while back...
Code:
SB618958 #18939 1990-2001 Prelude – Honing Fiber Reinforced Metal (FRM) cylinders 2000-01 S2000 All S2000 and 1990 and later VTEC and SI Preludes have Fiber-Reinforced Metal (FRM) cylinder liners. FRM honing is not required unless the cylinder has deep vertical scratches that run the length of the bore. Cylinders with light colored spots or flaking cannot be corrected by honing and must be replaced. To hone FRM liners, perform the following: · Use a rigid hone (not a ball hone) with GC-600-J or finer stones for nonferrous metals. The honing pressure should be 200-300 kPa (2-3 kg-cm2, 29-43 psi). · Use an oil type honing oil. · Hone at 45-50 rpm to a 60 degree-crosshatch pattern. · Do not stroke the hone more than 20 cycles. · After honing, thoroughly clean the engine block of all metal particles by washing with hot soapy water, then dry and oil them immediately. Never use solvent; it will only redistribute the grit. · Some light vertical scoring and scratching is acceptable if it isn’t deep enough to catch your fingernail, and doesn’t run the full length of the bore. (rm,sn)
01-10-2010, 09:21 AM
#10
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: Snohomish county, WA, USA
Posts: 2,392
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Re: Do I need to hone the cylinder walls?
I also simply dropped in new pistons and rings on an engine that had ~85k miles on the cylinder walls. Seems to be making power just fine and I don't notice any issues with oil burning. My advice, don't overthink Honda on this one. They wouldn't make this statement unless they were sure it was good advice:
"FRM honing is not required unless the cylinder has deep vertical scratches
that run the length of the bore."
"FRM honing is not required unless the cylinder has deep vertical scratches
that run the length of the bore."
01-10-2010, 09:31 AM
#11
Honda-Tech Member
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Jacksonville Beach, Florida, United States
Posts: 1,562
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Re: Do I need to hone the cylinder walls?
Next time I see my dad's friend who's been workin for honda since like the 80's I'm gonna ask him more about all this and see what that service bulletin says about replacing the sleeves because I thought they couldn't be replaced.
01-10-2010, 02:36 PM
#12
Honda-Tech Member
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Oregon City, OR, USA
Posts: 1,745
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes
on
2 Posts
Re: Do I need to hone the cylinder walls?
I don't think they mean replace the sleeves, I think you have to replace the block in that scenario.
I concur that Honda knows what they are talking about. They are so **** about their other tolerances, I don't know why they would be lax about this unless there was a good reason.
I concur that Honda knows what they are talking about. They are so **** about their other tolerances, I don't know why they would be lax about this unless there was a good reason.
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
