steronz

My steering has quite a bit of play in it. When the car (89 CRX Si, no power steering) is stopped, you can wiggle the steering wheel about a half inch in either direction before it catches the wheels. When I'm cruising, it's very disconcerting to be able to wiggle the wheel that much without moving the car. I've got new upper/lower ball joints, all new bushings, and new outer tie rod ends. I've also ruled out any problems in the wheel/column itself. Is this the rack? If so, will a reman Autozone rack come with new inner tie rod ends, or will I need to shell out for those, too?

sinneD

I have this exact problem. I also noticed when i had my front end jacked up that my passenger side wheel had about a half inch of play to wobble around. It was only on the passenger side. I just installed a new suspension so I was gonna have honda tell me whats up when i get an allignment. I don't know enough to know what parts were loose... i can identify them but dont know what they are called.

importboi22

i had this problem on my rx7, turned out to be my wheel bearings

ElementMotor

That happened to me and I picked up another steering rack from a junkyard and it fixed my problem. I could not find a remanufactured rack anywhere. They only seemed to make em for the LX and EX 4dr that had power steering when I tried to get one....

LudeEFv2.4

yea, my wagon is getting worse by the day. there seems to be about 2-3in. of play now. what exactly do I replace? just the rack itself? or did something come loose?

Dylanamus

Wheel bearings? Surely you could check that by firmly grabbing the wheel and trying to move it against the position of the hub? Ie pushing any extremity of the wheel towards the centre of the car and if it doesn't budge, the bearings are probably ok.

Also, I would have thought that a bad wheel bearing would become pretty damn noisey and easily noticeable...

Could be that the rack gear or worm gear is worn... could be that the two gears aren't engaging properly. Try tightening the rack adjustment screw (the procedure should be in your workshop manual). This screws up a spring loaded plate that locks the gears together. If it's loose, the most common symptom is play in the steering wheel before the wheels move. I've heard of some people shimming the rack adjustment.. but I have no evidence to back this up.

Good luck

2215_EF

Autozone gets their racks from a guaranteed used parts dealer. I had similar problems with my rack (very loose, mushy steering). The rack they send you comes with the Steering gear, inner tie rods, and tie rod ends. feels 100% better than before.

JOE BD-0

Did you adjust the end play out of the rack? check tyson's faq....deep in the rack and pinion thread you will find this crucial adjustment. It's also in the FSM....good luck

redboy183

im having the same problem...i am curently in the process of having my rack rebuilt...will let you guys know if it solves my problem

Dylanamus

JOE BD-0: please link us to this rack adjustment thread you've mentioned a couple of times. I have browsed the FAQ thread up and down so many times and can't find what I think you are referring to. Cheers

JOE BD-0

The information is DEEP in the "rack end bushing" thread in Tyson's FAQ at the top of the civic / crx forum...

https://honda-tech.com/zero...age=2
http://media.honda.co.uk/car/o...4.pdf

Let us know how it goes.......good luck

Tyson

4 things to check.

1. outer and inner tie rods. have someone else shake the steering wheel VIGOROUSLY side to side and feel for play at the balljoints. put your hand over the balljoint while its moving, it should be tight. the inner tie rod balljoint is inside the accordian boots.

2. turn the steering wheel all the way to the left, grab the portion of the rack sticking out and push up and down. any play is the steering rack end bushing. replace.

3. adjust the steering gearbox pinion tension. big *** lock nut on the driver side. you need a pipe wrench or something big enough to loosen that. then you can adjust the 12mm hex. tighten, then back out a bit, test drive and readjust until it feels ok to you. dont forget to do this after replacing the rack end bushing. its 20% of the steering play.

4. check the 10mm pinch bolt to the last universal joint at the base of the steering column. that can be loose. especially if you have inches of play at the steering wheel... this is easy to check, just annoying to reach under the dash. take the cover off and then find the pinch bolt.

if the boots are torn and been that way for a while, likely the inner tie rods are shot and so is the plastic rack end bushing on the passenger side. same with outer tie rod if the boot is torn.

jdmtunerchick

My old 91 rex was doing the same thing! and just like you i swiched out everything hoping to fix the problum but i still had play in the wheel. I looked up how much it would cost threw honda and it was arownd 175$ if you can get it at there cost.

x4thGenCafe

you need an alignment at your local honda tuning shop. theyll hook you up if they know what theyre doing

Dylanamus

Ok I have an update on my situation.

1. Replaced tie rod ends, which reduced bump steer.

2. Put on known good working coilovers, which reduced wandering under heavy braking or acceleration.

3. Tightened all sussy nuts in front assy to correct torque settings (swaybar ball joints were a bit loose), which had no measurable impact on handling at speeds I was going).

4. Did a backyard toe alignment and found around 10mm of toe-in, (which was supposed to be 0 degrees based on a recent alignment from a workshop). I set new toe to +1mm. This helped stability a bit. [You can get a good idea of if your toe is out quickly by firmly pressing your palm over the tyre and dragging it horizontally accross the thread. If it is notably smoother in one direction, then you have feathered wear, which is caused by excessive toe.]

5. I checked pincher bolt that connects the column to the worm gear shaft below the last universal joint. All was ok.


Ok.. now as for the rack adjustment fat-assed nut. I can't get to it because the power steering lines are riiiight in the way and the tool size for a nut that big just won't fit through, so what I am thinking of doing is getting an Energy Suspension steering bushing kit and just going the full overhaul.

I will get the OEM rack end bush through Honda while I'm at it. Tyson - you mentioned that you should invest in a new washer when doing this bush? Could you please tell me which part number you're referring to based on the below image.


The play in the steering wheel before the tyres move is within Honda specs, but it seems like I have to turn the steering wheel a lot further around than I used to to turn the wheels where I want. Before all these problems, if I suddenly turned the steering 45 degrees, it would instantly and abruptly swing into the next lane, now it feels spongey and it almost feels like body roll (but it definitely isn't).

Is this particular symptom most likely the rack end bush?


(I hope all of my long-winded commentry is helping someone lol)

Tyson

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Dylanamus &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I will get the OEM rack end bush through Honda while I'm at it. Tyson - you mentioned that you should invest in a new washer when doing this bush? Could you please tell me which part number you're referring to based on the below image.
</TD></TR></TABLE>

read the links above. the answer is in there.

Dylanamus

I am having difficulty interpreting the information above, but I did read it. My rack is power steering, as you can see.

Part 19 and part 20 are both bushes... I don't know if there's only one on the manual rack?

Part 22 is a Bush stopper clip.

Most of the washers are all listed as "O-rings" or "Piston seals" and I'm relying on terminology to find the one you're referring to. That's the reason I'm not certain.

My only suspicion is part 37 "Snap Ring".

Thanks .

Edit - I re-read my workshop manual gearbox overhaul and I think I can see what you're referring to here as lock washer:



Modified by Dylanamus at 9:55 PM 3/30/2008


Modified by Dylanamus at 10:33 PM 3/30/2008

biggee

The proper way to check the front end and steering on our cars is the following.

Tie rod ends: Have someone rock the steering wheel back and forth while you look and feel the outer tie rod end first. Look and feel for play. You cannot see the inner tie rod end because of the rack boot. You can pull the rack boot away, but hen you will need a new clamp. You can try to squish your boot and feel, but it is hard. Also grab as close to the inner tie rod as you can and pull up and down. There should be no play anywhere.

Lower ball joint: You must use a floor jack and lift on the lower control arm as near the lower ball joint as possible.( use a jackstand in case it falls off the floor jack. Lift until teh tire is off of the ground. Grasp the tire at 7 O'clock or 8 O'clock (looking at the rim) Pull in and out and see if there is any play.

Upper ball joint: Get a long bar or pry bar and place it under the tire. Lift up and down and look at the upper ball joint for movement. With the tire on the ground you can most of the time see or feel upper ball joint play by grasping the top of the tire and pulling / pushing in and out.

Wheel bearing: Besides hearing a growling while driving. With the suspension jacked up while you are checking the lower ball joint, grab the top and bottom of the tire and rock it back and forth. There should be no play. If you are having a hard time telling if it has play or not, look on the inside of the rim and you will see the rotor moving as well if it is the wheel bearing.

Besides all this you can look at the condition of the tire for feather, cupping, camber wear, etc.

Dylanamus

That's a good guide too, biggee.

That's pretty much what my mechanic went through with me. I was the cockpit monkey doing the shaking and turning hehe

Tyson

the information regarding replacing the rack end bushing is for NON power steering racks.

i recommend just buying a rebuilt power steering rack. its got all those sealss and whatnot that its worth having someone else do it.

Dylanamus

mmm where is the fluid pressure isolated to though? The valve body itself? I can't imagine it traveling the cylinder all the way to the rack end bush?