AgentJam

Had a thread about this a few weeks ago and since then have tried everything i can think of any way to get the bolt out. It's my drivers side upper hing, the top bolt. The head and part of the bolt snapped off and about 1/2" of it is still threaded into the frame recessed about 1/8"...

I bought a $30 Craftsman bolt out kit with titanium or whatever reverse bits...didn't get anywhere drilling with that...

Bought a Cobalt 1/8" bit (Sears guy told me it would cut hardened steel), after a good 45 mins of drilling patiently and using lubricant i got hardly anywhere. I probably cut about 1/16" into the bolt in that time.

I also tried taking the steering column out and trying to get myself behind the bolt but as far as i can see there is only a small hole to that area ~ 5 inches below where the broken bolt is.


I'm really starting to get stressed out about this i have a new hinge ready for the door but no way of fully bolting it up. If anyone has any input or help to offer please do i need to get this fixed.

Thank You,

Vince

Filthy Focker!

a couple of things here...

1. the reason you are not cutting in the bolt with your drill bits is that you are probably turning a bit to fast. You should turn around 200 rpms and apply lots of pressure...

now if that does not work a all then:

1. try, with a dremel, to cut a slot in it. Using a flat screwdriver, try turning it..
2. Weld another bolt on that stud and try that...
3. Use heat - apply heat to the perimeter of the hole... Not the bolt itself. This will cause the hole to expand and possibly let go of the bolt.....

good luck

fs

AgentJam

I have been drilling slowly and using lubricant (WD-40...not the best but...)

I don't think i can get a dremel disc in there to cut a slot in the bult because it's almost 1/8" below the surface of the frame.

I may try hammering a washer; tapering it on one end, so it will fit into the crevace...then weld the inside of the washer to the top of the bolt, then welding a nut to the top of the washer.

I just cant believe that the cobolt bit wont cut into this sucker...i know i should be patient but at the rate i was going with it, i'd have been there for 8 hours!

Thanks,

Vince

P.S. - anyone else got some good tricks?

4drEF

If you hav the right bit then you won't have to apply much pressure at all. Drills weren't meant to be pressed... they snap if you do that too much.

Cobalt? You might want to try a carbide bit.

The bolts are probably made of hardened steel so no matter what you do it's going to take a long time. You only need WD40 if you are heating the bit up. Don't over do it or you won't get any friction and it will just spin without getting the initial cut into the bolt.

AgentJam

cool thanks...maybe i have been using too much WD-40...either way it's a pain. Through searching online i found a company in Cali that comes to your house to remove stripped/broken bolts/screws. Too bad there isn't one around here!!! Oh well one day at a time.

Vince

Filthy Focker!

What is this???

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 4drEF &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">If you hav the right bit then you won't have to apply much pressure at all. Drills weren't meant to be pressed... they snap if you do that too much.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Pressure is needed when you drill. If not, then the bit glides on the metal and scuffs itself...

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 4drEF &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Cobalt? You might want to try a carbide bit..</TD></TR></TABLE>

Cobal dipped drill bits are stronger than carbide tipped bits. Less brittle...

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 4drEF &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">The bolts are probably made of hardened steel so no matter what you do it's going to take a long time. You only need WD40 if you are heating the bit up. Don't over do it or you won't get any friction and it will just spin without getting the initial cut into the bolt.</TD></TR></TABLE>

It is not hardened steel, it is probably grade 8 steel... If it is hardened, then you will need a diamond tipped bit to cut through...

As a machinist, i have always used cutting fluid when you cut into metal, either on a lathe, milling machine, drill press and so forth...


If you can't drill into it, are you sure your bit is sharpened? I find this very peculiar...

fs

AgentJam

i just bought the bit last night so i hope it's sharpened! It's such a tight space i don't know if i could tack weld anything to it...same thing goes for using a dremel cutting wheel to make a grove in it...then i could use a flathead to turn it out...

This is driving me nuts.

Filthy Focker!

It takes about half a second to dull a drill bit when you are not turning at the right cutting speed...

I am puzzled at this too..

fs

AgentJam

Ok so i could have dulled the bit...what speed should i be using? I had the drill on the 1st speed setting and probably had it spinning at between 60-100 rpms with occasional spray of WD-40.

Vince

Filthy Focker!

That speed sounds right... The funny thing is that your bit can't cut in...

It is possible, that the heat from the drilling tempered the surface...

What happened when you center punched it? Are you able to make a mark?

How big is the bit you are using?

fs

AgentJam

1/8" bit...i could have tempered the surface because when it first happened i took a standard bit and started going at it in panic...probably screwing myself over even more.

So am i SOL?

Filthy Focker!

Try center punching it a few time.... then drill again with lubricant, pressure and slow turning speed...

Just a tip here, usually, when drilling metal, the shaving are supposed to be spiral and follow the flutes... That is when you know you have sufficient pressure. If the shavings look like really small chips or even heavy dust, you are not applying enough pressure...

But be careful here. Pressure does not mean putting 300 lbs on the drill, it simply means to put your body against it and drill that's it...

fs

AgentJam

Great, thank you for the info i'll try again tonight keeping everything in mind. Hopefully i can get somewhere

Vince

4drEF

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by filthy_shovel &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">What is this???

Pressure is needed when you drill. If not, then the bit glides on the metal and scuffs itself...

Cobal dipped drill bits are stronger than carbide tipped bits. Less brittle...

It is not hardened steel, it is probably grade 8 steel... If it is hardened, then you will need a diamond tipped bit to cut through...

As a machinist, i have always used cutting fluid when you cut into metal, either on a lathe, milling machine, drill press and so forth...


If you can't drill into it, are you sure your bit is sharpened? I find this very peculiar...

fs
</TD></TR></TABLE>


I know.

As you claim to be a machinist you should also know that drill bits are designed to pull through material and not be pressed through. Maybe and end mill bit would need to be pressed through to plunge and create a counterbore, but not the same with a drill bit. The only pressure you need on a drill bit is to get the conical tip to start and that's about it. On a drill press or a mill it's a lot of different since the part and drill are reletively NOT going to move. A hand drill is most likely going to wobble and you can easily snap bits if you apply a lot of pressure like you suggested.


You'll never see a seasoned construction worker putting all his weight behind a drill and they are only drilling into wood. A good machinist that doesn't like to break bits knows that tool speed and feed rate are improtant as well as material hardness (which you left out for some reason). If you are going to put a bunch of pressure behind a drill and force it into solid metal it's going to break. It's too much of a feed rate especially since you are suggesting that he uses a low rpm.


"High Speed Steel (HS): HSS is a baseline tool steel used for many basic machining applications and for short runs on older milling machines. However, it does not offer the speed and feed advantages of HSS-Cobalt and Carbide tools.

Cobalt: With a typical cobalt content of 8 percent, this tool is usually priced a bit higher than standard HSS. It allows for increased speeds and feeds because of greater hardness, though it still falls far short of the speed, feed, and durability advantages of carbide.

Carbide: Carbide tools can be run at speeds 2 to 2 ½ times faster than HSS tools and HSS-Cobalt."


You still want cobalt? Carbide coatings are carbide powder mixed with a cobalt binder. Carbide has the coablt in there for it's hardness characteristics so why bother with straight cobalt when you can get the abrasive effects of the carbide? How long have you been a machinist?


Center punch is a good idea. Just light taps so you don't damage the threads in the hole. A smaller bit is the way to go. This will be easier to start, but since it's a smaller diameter bit, it's going to be easier to break so use light sressure to get it to start. (Doh! - machinist and you're not even suggesting a pilot hole?)

Filthy Focker!

my mistake then....

fs

AgentJam

Phew, got it out...without damaging the threads as well!

I did everything both of you said several times and after 3 hours of everything i finally just grabbed a 1/4" bit and reamed the heck out of the bolt. after 3 seconds it spun the broken bolt through the other side...

Pretty ridiculous...

Thanks for all your help

Vince

Filthy Focker!

fs