Toy Civic

I would like to have feedback regarding any interest in a proposed new product that I would like to develop in relation to JDM speedo clusters. Please read through this ENTIRE write up first, and read it again if necessary, to fully understand what I am trying to accomplish before any feedback is given.

I’m sure 90% of us are familiar with the JDM EG6 and EG9 white face speedo cluster with amber lighting, red lit needles, 8200k redline, and 190 km/h speedo. There are some versions of this for the 4 door Ferio, and then some with the TCS traction control. There is even the ultra rare Spoon cluster with 230 km/h speedo. On forums, magazines, and car shows, you see many JDM converted, and some not so converted Civics running these clusters.



The main question here is do people get JDM clusters for the looks? Is it the bragging rights? Or is it because everyone else is doing it?

Because quite frankly, JDM clusters in a USDM car on US roadways have diminished functionality. Unless you are “Rain Man” and have the kilometer to mile conversions memorized, you cannot adequately gauge your speed on North American roadways. Also, there may be legal or resale issues involved with changing a cluster to a JDM one due to the odometer reading being different as well as the odometer reading in kilometers.

Many want a different looking cluster and go with the tired old EL indiglo and EL reverse indiglo gauges, ricey guage overlays, etc. I’ve tried several myself and have not been satisfied. None of the aftermarket gauge faces ever offer different redlines to match the capabilities of the motor swap or build characteristics.

To my knowledge, Honda never ever made an OEM white face speedo cluster that read in miles per hour. Let’s just suppose that if there was a way to have the exact……………..I MEAN EXACT same look of the JDM cluster……………white face, amber backlighting, red lit needles, arial font, etc………………..
1) Would people be interested to have these gauges read in miles per hour?
2) Would people be interested to have the speedo gauge read up to 145mph much like the UKDM Civic speedo clusters?
3) Would people be interested in keeping the legal mileage intact?
4) Would people be interested to have redlines match their particular motor swap or build specs?
5) Would people running cruise control like to have a JDM looking cluster, but still like to keep their cruise control light indicator like they do in the USDM cluster?
6) Would people be interested in any other additions such as a VTEC indicator light designed into the temp / fuel gauge right below the open trunk light?

Therefore, I have done some R & D. I have drawn an accurate and full scale sketch of the JDM gauge faces, but with USDM calibration markings for miles per hour and tachometer. For my car specifically I would go with an 8500K redline, 9500K max, 145mph, cruise control indicator light, and VTEC indicator light.





I will purchase a JDM EG6 white face cluster and disassemble it. I have contacted several speedo gauge companies for their information and blessing. If there are any companies that I don’t know about, but you do, I would greatly appreciate any info. It would sure be cool to find the engineers who came up with the speedo cluster design in the first place. When I find a willing company, I will send in my drawings, the disassembled JDM speedo cluster, and the spare USDM black gauge faces.

When the prototypes return, then I will install the new gauge faces on my USDM cluster. The end result will be JDM looks with USDM calibration and functionality.

What about the red lighted needles you ask? If you still want them, you will still be required to source a JDM cluster. The cheapest JDM cluster with red needles is the JDM 92-95 Civic Vti with black faces. They can be found for $50-$100. You will have to disassemble both the JDM and USDM clusters and merge a few things to get the red needles to light up. I have an entire write up available for that. This is exactly what I did with a Civic Vti cluster and my original USDM cluster (see pics below). I still kept my mileage, know when the cruise control is on, and it looks 100% OEM…………..no rice. Once the cluster is assembled, I have an easy and proven DIY way to calibrate all the needles.



So in summary, I would like people’s feedback about clusters with true JDM looks and USDM functionality. Has this been attempted before? Would there be any legal or patent issues since these are out of production Japan spec parts?


Modified by Toy Civic at 11:54 AM 7/16/2008


Modified by Toy Civic at 11:41 PM 7/16/2008

OMGWTFBBQ!

Sounds like an awesome idea. I'd definitely be interested in finally having my tach numbered as high as my engine will rev without dropping a crap ton of money for the CTR cluster.

94EG8

I think a lot of people would be interested in something like this. I think the big appeal of the JDM cluster is actually the 8200 RPM redline, if you have a B16 or B18C its kind of nice to have a cluster with the correct redline. Some do it for the JDM factor as well, personally i like the look of the white faced gauge cluster, but only the JDM one, ebay white faced gauge overlays just look like crap. it has nothing to do with it being jdm, it just looks better imo, personally i think what i'd really be interested in something you hadn't suggested, JDM style cluster with a 7200 RPM redline, only thing is i'd want it in km/h because i live in canada, but i'm sure some people in the US would be interested in something like that in MPH.

Toy Civic

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 94EG8 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">personally i think what i'd really be interested in something you hadn't suggested, JDM style cluster with a 7200 RPM redline, only thing is i'd want it in km/h because i live in canada, but i'm sure some people in the US would be interested in something like that in MPH.</TD></TR></TABLE>

So you could get a white JDM cluster, transplant the speedo and temp / fuel section over to your cluster, and then just have the tach gauge face redone.

I'm sure that could be accomplished.

OMGWTFBBQ!

I didn't realize this earlier, but this is only for EGs, well don't leave the EK drivers hanging! lol

If this ever gets off the ground, you might consider making a limited number of tachs with 9000rpm red lines for those of us with Type R motors

Toy Civic

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by OMGWTFBBQ! &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I didn't realize this earlier, but this is only for EGs, well don't leave the EK drivers hanging! lol

If this ever gets off the ground, you might consider making a limited number of tachs with 9000rpm red lines for those of us with Type R motors </TD></TR></TABLE>

If this ever gets off the ground, I would expand this concept to other Hondas for sure. But I would never stray away from true OEM looks.

BTW, don't ITR motors spin to 8500 RPM...........ECU limited of course?

OMGWTFBBQ!

I have a JDM ITR motor on the stock ECU and it spins to 8900. The thing doesnt make peak power till 8200, but maybe the USDM ITRs rev lower. They do have a lower compression ratio after all, but I have no idea.

93dagsr

im in! so when can we be expecting it? and what would the cost be?

Toy Civic

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 93dagsr &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">im in! so when can we be expecting it? and what would the cost be?</TD></TR></TABLE>

I'm not promising anything at this moment in time. This is all very, I mean VERY premature.

I am just gathering info. My goal would be to get this going by the end of the year or early next year.

For the gauge faces themselves, I would hope for a cost of somewhere around $100..........give or take. If you want the red needles, you will still have to get a real JDM cluster for that. The service to disassemble, reassemble, and calibrate would take a few hours. If you could do this yourself, then the cost could be reasonable.

Toy Civic

bump

Toy Civic

bump

adobospoon

Subscribed. Really interested! Good luck brotha.

93dagsr

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Toy Civic &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

I'm not promising anything at this moment in time. This is all very, I mean VERY premature.

I am just gathering info. My goal would be to get this going by the end of the year or early next year.

For the gauge faces themselves, I would hope for a cost of somewhere around $100..........give or take. If you want the red needles, you will still have to get a real JDM cluster for that. The service to disassemble, reassemble, and calibrate would take a few hours. If you could do this yourself, then the cost could be reasonable.</TD></TR></TABLE>

i see! ok then i hope to hear more developement on this soon!

slvrcvc93

I think this is a great idea even for people with single cams so when the vtec turns on it would have some kind of indicator light what about the people that don't have cruise control ??? can they use that?? lol I'm just asking would be kinda cool. Ive seen people that use the check engine light as a shift light but thats done from the ecu.

I just hate the fact that you have to add a 5 inch tach with the light or if you use the one you plug into the astray you can see all the wires and those who have just a shift light that its bright enough for a dam satellite to see in space!. Sorry im just venting. but im in

94EG8

the VX cluster with tach has an upshift light where the cruise light on an EX/Si would be, i wonder if something like this could be incorporated into the design, even if you had to retrofit the shift light out an aftermarket tach in behind the cluster as long as the symbol was there i'd be happy.

Dasfinc

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 94EG8 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">the VX cluster with tach has an upshift light where the cruise light on an EX/Si would be, i wonder if something like this could be incorporated into the design, even if you had to retrofit the shift light out an aftermarket tach in behind the cluster as long as the symbol was there i'd be happy.</TD></TR></TABLE>

This is an Econ shift light though, it is in-operable at WOT unless you have a chipped ECU. (I have a CX, stock cluster only showed the upshift light when puttering around, not at WOT)

94EG8

yeah, i know what your saying, but thats not quite what i meant, what i was thinking was that if the symbol was in the cluster someone could rig up and aftermarket shift light behind the cluster and put the bulb in the socket for the factory upshift light.

Jsarv

im completely 110% in! i have a jdm cluster and cant stand the km/h ****, and was just talking bout this with my brother the other day. hell i would be willing to send you my cluster, to work on if you dont have one.

i use to have a b16a with this cluster and it was perfect now i have a h22a and the redline is now off.

i would love to have the white face gauges with the tach of an h22a and the speedo to read in mph.

i would lovvvvvveeee to see this happen! and would be willing to help in anyway possible!

Toy Civic

bump

EFSedanMan

wow....this is a great idea. i was just thinking about5 minutes ago that i cant get a nice looking cluster that actually reads in MPH. dude...do it...id buy one right away.

hamorhead

id like to keep the correct mileage cuz i just got a LX cluster from the junkyard and it reads 239xxx miles and my car has 95xxx miles on it
but the cruise control light acts as a shift light since i have a dx

94EG8

Pop the face off both clusters and swap the speedometer heads, its just 3 philips screws on the back of each cluster.

Toy Civic

bump

Creepsjr

How do you remove and then recalibrate the needles? I have a white face EG6 gauge cluster in my ride (in Canada, so km's are no problem) but I never swapped over my odometer because I was scared of breaking the needles. What do I do?

Toy Civic

Removing the needles takes kid gloves. You have to take the tach, speedo, and fuel/temp gauge mechanisms off the housing. Each of those has 3 or 4 screws from the backside and then they come right out. I then used a small flathead screwdriver and VERY GENTLY pried the needles off the posts.

Needle Calibration

Before you take anything apart, see where everything reads. It is also best to buy or borrow a digital timing light with tach readout.

1) Run the car to proper temp and allow the radiator fan to kick on. This will ensure that idle speed is normal and steady. Compare the tach reading with the digital timing light. If all is good, then you know the tach in the cluster is calibrated.

2) When the radiator fan kicks on, note where the temp guage needle reads, usually at about the 8 o'clock position.

3) Now drive the car on the highway with a passenger. You need to compare the RPM on the tach to the speed readings. I did this in 5th gear at 50, 60, and 70mph. Keep the speed steady and read out the RPM on the tach and have the passenger write the numbers down.

4) Now you can rebuild the cluster...............this is a whole write up onto itself.

5) When the cluster is all put back together, leave the needles off, plug the cluster in the dash harness, use just a couple screws to temporarily hold the cluster in place, leave the lens off, and leave the dash bezel off. Make sure you have the hazard switch plugged in or else the turn signals will not work.

6) Run the car the same as in step 1 and connect the digital timing light. When the idle is steady, then gently postion and lightly push the needle on the post. Do not push it all the way down in case you need to readjust. Once you are confident the the needle is where it needs to be, then push the needle down all the way. Make sure to not push it too hard as the needle could possibly get stuck on the guage face.

7) Now position the temp needle where it needs to be the moment the fan kicks on.

8) Now comes the tricky part..................the positioning of the speedo needle. The safest way is to have the car on a rolling dyno of some sort. If no rolling dyno, then you could run the car with the front end on jackstands and get up to speed. The least safe way, which I did, was actually drive the car while postioning the needle. So this will require that you are in little traffic and on some straight stretches of roads.

So I drove the car, loosely and GENTLY postioned the speedo needle as compared to the RPM's, then checked my readings compared the RPM at 50, 60, and 70mph in 5th gear. This took me a few tries to get it right since the little silver pole that protrudes out from the speedo mechanism can easily get misaligned. You would know what I am talking about if you took a cluster apart. Anyway, when I was confident that I had the speedo postioned correctly, I gently but firmly pushed the needle all the way on.

9) On the way home from the drive, fill the car up all the way, and position the fuel needle where it needs to be.

10) Put the lens back on the cluster, the little rubber boot over the trip meter post, install the cluster, dash bezel, and hazard switch.

11) Mission accomplished!!!!!