Removing needles
02-13-2008, 02:10 PM
#1
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Removing needles
How can I easily and safely remove a cluster needle without breaking it? I need to be able to put it back on.
A white retaining clip within my odometer housing has broken and I need to put the guts of another cluster into it to fix my current cluster.
I know what to do, but I don't know a reliable way to remove the needle.
This is on a '97-'01 CR-V cluster. It should be basically the same as any '96-'00 Civic cluster.
Thanks for any help.
A white retaining clip within my odometer housing has broken and I need to put the guts of another cluster into it to fix my current cluster.
I know what to do, but I don't know a reliable way to remove the needle.
This is on a '97-'01 CR-V cluster. It should be basically the same as any '96-'00 Civic cluster.
Thanks for any help.
02-13-2008, 02:14 PM
#2
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gently and slowly lift it over the retaining pin, let it droop down, mark location.
they're fairly strong as long as you grab the center peice and don't pry on the needle itself.
if I can't pull it with my fingers I slip a flat blade screw drive under the lowest portion of the needle and pry against the face. it's a slip fit so it tends to jump off when it goes.
Dont' rock it back and forth, don't twist it. Just lift.
I've done at least five clusters from various hondas and one hyundai. no problems with any of them.
they're fairly strong as long as you grab the center peice and don't pry on the needle itself.
if I can't pull it with my fingers I slip a flat blade screw drive under the lowest portion of the needle and pry against the face. it's a slip fit so it tends to jump off when it goes.
Dont' rock it back and forth, don't twist it. Just lift.
I've done at least five clusters from various hondas and one hyundai. no problems with any of them.
02-13-2008, 02:21 PM
#3
Re: Removing needles (NOFX)
I have removed needles from 96-00 Civic speedo successfully (not so much on the tach, bad experience).
To remove, use a metal fork and slide it under the needle base. Pull straight up.
To calibrate, install the cluster without the plastic cover. Turn your car on (don't start). This will prime the speedometer. Place the needle onto the speedo pin, but right below the stop pin. Then pull the needle up and over the stop pin.
To remove, use a metal fork and slide it under the needle base. Pull straight up.
To calibrate, install the cluster without the plastic cover. Turn your car on (don't start). This will prime the speedometer. Place the needle onto the speedo pin, but right below the stop pin. Then pull the needle up and over the stop pin.
02-13-2008, 02:28 PM
#4
H-T White Ops
Thread Starter
The needle doesn't look like it wants to come off at all.
And I can't post in here too much because since I've been told that I was "bad", I'm not allowed to ask for too much help.
And I can't post in here too much because since I've been told that I was "bad", I'm not allowed to ask for too much help.
02-13-2008, 02:32 PM
#5
Re: (NOFX)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by NOFX »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">The needle doesn't look like it wants to come off at all.
And I can't post in here too much because since I've been told that I was "bad", I'm not allowed to ask for too much help.</TD></TR></TABLE>
If you had another CRV speedo/odo, you could swap it in after adjusting the mileage. No risk of breaking the speedo.
And I can't post in here too much because since I've been told that I was "bad", I'm not allowed to ask for too much help.</TD></TR></TABLE>
If you had another CRV speedo/odo, you could swap it in after adjusting the mileage. No risk of breaking the speedo.
02-13-2008, 02:33 PM
#6
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Re: (NOFX)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by NOFX »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
And I can't post in here too much because since I've been told that I was "bad", I'm not allowed to ask for too much help.</TD></TR></TABLE>
??
And I can't post in here too much because since I've been told that I was "bad", I'm not allowed to ask for too much help.</TD></TR></TABLE>
??
02-13-2008, 02:36 PM
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Re: Removing needles (BlueIntegraBoy)
^^^^^ x2 with the ??
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by BlueIntegraBoy »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">To calibrate, install the cluster without the plastic cover. Turn your car on (don't start). This will prime the speedometer. Place the needle onto the speedo pin, but right below the stop pin. Then pull the needle up and over the stop pin.</TD></TR></TABLE>
I've tried that a few times, it never seems right.
marking the position (under the pin) before pulling it works the best.
OR
letting the car idle to 800 (full warm up, nothing on) and pushing on the needle pointed at 800.
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by BlueIntegraBoy »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">To calibrate, install the cluster without the plastic cover. Turn your car on (don't start). This will prime the speedometer. Place the needle onto the speedo pin, but right below the stop pin. Then pull the needle up and over the stop pin.</TD></TR></TABLE>
I've tried that a few times, it never seems right.
marking the position (under the pin) before pulling it works the best.
OR
letting the car idle to 800 (full warm up, nothing on) and pushing on the needle pointed at 800.
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02-13-2008, 02:38 PM
#8
H-T White Ops
Thread Starter
Re: (BlueIntegraBoy)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by BlueIntegraBoy »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">If you had another CRV speedo/odo, you could swap it in after adjusting the mileage. No risk of breaking the speedo.</TD></TR></TABLE>
But I don't have another one.
I only got 103.8 miles on this cluster before the odometer stopped working.
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by ke98248 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">??</TD></TR></TABLE>
I've been told I'm a problem member. When people talk about me, I respond, which is frowned upon. I don't insult anyone without first being confronted, but retaliating isn't allowed.
They told me I get post reported a lot, but I'm not sure what posts they're talking about since it wasn't brought to my attention before.
So I'm on a 10-posts-a-day (or maybe every full 24 hours? It stops you from posting whenever within the day). I've been told it's at least for a month, but I really don't know. It started the 26th of last month.
This is why I'm not posting so much in threads where I know I can help.
But I don't have another one.
I only got 103.8 miles on this cluster before the odometer stopped working.
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by ke98248 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">??</TD></TR></TABLE>
I've been told I'm a problem member. When people talk about me, I respond, which is frowned upon. I don't insult anyone without first being confronted, but retaliating isn't allowed.
They told me I get post reported a lot, but I'm not sure what posts they're talking about since it wasn't brought to my attention before.
So I'm on a 10-posts-a-day (or maybe every full 24 hours? It stops you from posting whenever within the day). I've been told it's at least for a month, but I really don't know. It started the 26th of last month.
This is why I'm not posting so much in threads where I know I can help.
02-13-2008, 02:49 PM
#11
H-T White Ops
Thread Starter
Re: Removing needles (Relic1)
Originally Posted by Relic1
^^^^^ x2 with the ??
I've tried that a few times, it never seems right.
marking the position (under the pin) before pulling it works the best.
OR
letting the car idle to 800 (full warm up, nothing on) and pushing on the needle pointed at 800.
I've tried that a few times, it never seems right.
marking the position (under the pin) before pulling it works the best.
OR
letting the car idle to 800 (full warm up, nothing on) and pushing on the needle pointed at 800.
Okay.. I used an LED light bar for lighting instead.
It's a large image so you can see the detail.
Notice the broken white clip on the right side next to the gears (the top part that holds the bar in). Then it looks like the black piece on the bottom is also broken in two.
The needle doesn't look like it's budging. I don't feel strong enough to get it to move (girl) and Eran's afraid to break it.
ALL OTHER RESPONSES FROM ME WILL BE IN THIS POST!
I know this could make it confusing, so I will quote who I'm replying to. It's all I can do though. Please check back occasionally to help me. I might also message you.
Thanks again for the help.
Originally Posted by BlueIntegraBoy
That bar is used to set everything aligned. It has no effect on how the odo performs. Having that broken white clip does not make the odometer stop working. The metal black strip also aligns everything. It puts tension on the white rectangular pieces and prevents the gears from skipping a tooth. Again, no effect on how the odo works. Your problem lies with the circuit board and the small gear that converts electrical signal to mechanical spinning.
Try to swap another cluster's circuit board (behind the odo and speedo face) into the CRV's speedo/odo.
Oh, from the looks of it, someone tampered with the odometer before, which is why the white piece and black strip are broken.
Try to swap another cluster's circuit board (behind the odo and speedo face) into the CRV's speedo/odo.
Oh, from the looks of it, someone tampered with the odometer before, which is why the white piece and black strip are broken.
The part that is broken is the white clip on the right on the white gears at the bottom. You can see the broken piece in the image above.
The entire tripometer section is just fine and has continued to work just fine.
Originally Posted by instrument
is it an auto cluster?
for some reason needles always break when trying to remove them from auto clusters, i've taken apart TONS of clusters, and this has always been the case.
the easiest way is to use either a fork, or two flathead screw drivers and simply lift up.
the key to placing the needles back on is to attach the cluster to the car with the plastic face off, and start the car with the needle OFF.
after the car has started place the needle back on, if you've ever looked the Speedometer needle will move slightly when the car is turned on, thats why you replace it with the car off.
some of the mods here seem to think a bit highly of themselves, so i wouldn't let it bother you too much. i think the board gets a lot of exposure and they're trying to keep it friendly....though that definition differs from mod to mod.
for some reason needles always break when trying to remove them from auto clusters, i've taken apart TONS of clusters, and this has always been the case.
the easiest way is to use either a fork, or two flathead screw drivers and simply lift up.
the key to placing the needles back on is to attach the cluster to the car with the plastic face off, and start the car with the needle OFF.
after the car has started place the needle back on, if you've ever looked the Speedometer needle will move slightly when the car is turned on, thats why you replace it with the car off.
some of the mods here seem to think a bit highly of themselves, so i wouldn't let it bother you too much. i think the board gets a lot of exposure and they're trying to keep it friendly....though that definition differs from mod to mod.
Oh, and now I'm being talked about in the EK SQUAD thread, but I'm sure nothing will be done.
Anyway though, it's back together. Everything works. And I have the guts of a CV-R speedometer if anyone ends up needing anything. I know you can't buy those parts separately from Honda (the speedometer is a complete assembly that costs abotu $265).
Originally Posted by BlueIntegraBlue
Nope, I was talking about the middle, darker blue gear. That converts electrical signal into mechanical movement of the odo gears.
Glad to hear you got it working.
Glad to hear you got it working.
The circuit board works fine. The blue gear works fine. The tripometer is measuring mileage, but the odometer isn't. If the tripometer is measuring distance perfectly, then that tells me that the circuit board and blue gear are probably fine.
When I hold the cluster in my hand, the white clip being broken DOES affect the odometer operation.
The white clip holds in the gears under the odometer. When that one white clip isn't there, the white gears sit crooked. It causes the odometer to not turn because hte black gears on the odometer aren't being touched.
Here you can see how it sits out of place and won't turn the odometer.
Modified by NOFX at 1:35 AM 2/14/2008
02-13-2008, 02:58 PM
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that right there is exactly what happens when you press the reset trip button and the odo is in exactly the right position. you have to hit it perfectly.
I had one that looked almost identical to that when I first did my teg cluster in my civic.
I had one that looked almost identical to that when I first did my teg cluster in my civic.
02-13-2008, 04:27 PM
#13
Re: Removing needles (NOFX)
That bar is used to set everything aligned. It has no effect on how the odo performs. Having that broken white clip does not make the odometer stop working. The metal black strip also aligns everything. It puts tension on the white rectangular pieces and prevents the gears from skipping a tooth. Again, no effect on how the odo works. Your problem lies with the circuit board and the small gear that converts electrical signal to mechanical spinning.
Try to swap another cluster's circuit board (behind the odo and speedo face) into the CRV's speedo/odo.
Oh, from the looks of it, someone tampered with the odometer before, which is why the white piece and black strip are broken.
Try to swap another cluster's circuit board (behind the odo and speedo face) into the CRV's speedo/odo.
Oh, from the looks of it, someone tampered with the odometer before, which is why the white piece and black strip are broken.
02-13-2008, 05:03 PM
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Re: Removing needles (BlueIntegraBoy)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by BlueIntegraBoy »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Your problem lies with the circuit board and the small gear that converts electrical signal to mechanical spinning.
Try to swap another cluster's circuit board (behind the odo and speedo face) into the CRV's speedo/odo.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
Could you elaborate on this a little more please?
My odometer stopped on my 97 Civic LX cluster, and the tach and speedo work just fine so the VSS is cool. Is there anyway I can fix that gear or circuit board? Thanks!
Try to swap another cluster's circuit board (behind the odo and speedo face) into the CRV's speedo/odo.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
Could you elaborate on this a little more please?
My odometer stopped on my 97 Civic LX cluster, and the tach and speedo work just fine so the VSS is cool. Is there anyway I can fix that gear or circuit board? Thanks!
02-13-2008, 05:19 PM
#15
Honda-Tech Member
is it an auto cluster?
for some reason needles always break when trying to remove them from auto clusters, i've taken apart TONS of clusters, and this has always been the case.
the easiest way is to use either a fork, or two flathead screw drivers and simply lift up.
the key to placing the needles back on is to attach the cluster to the car with the plastic face off, and start the car with the needle OFF.
after the car has started place the needle back on, if you've ever looked the Speedometer needle will move slightly when the car is turned on, thats why you replace it with the car off.
some of the mods here seem to think a bit highly of themselves, so i wouldn't let it bother you too much. i think the board gets a lot of exposure and they're trying to keep it friendly....though that definition differs from mod to mod.
for some reason needles always break when trying to remove them from auto clusters, i've taken apart TONS of clusters, and this has always been the case.
the easiest way is to use either a fork, or two flathead screw drivers and simply lift up.
the key to placing the needles back on is to attach the cluster to the car with the plastic face off, and start the car with the needle OFF.
after the car has started place the needle back on, if you've ever looked the Speedometer needle will move slightly when the car is turned on, thats why you replace it with the car off.
some of the mods here seem to think a bit highly of themselves, so i wouldn't let it bother you too much. i think the board gets a lot of exposure and they're trying to keep it friendly....though that definition differs from mod to mod.
02-13-2008, 06:20 PM
#16
Re: (instrument)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by instrument »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">is it an auto cluster?
for some reason needles always break when trying to remove them from auto clusters, i've taken apart TONS of clusters, and this has always been the case.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
That's weird. MT and AT speedos are exactly the same.
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by PJ »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
Could you elaborate on this a little more please?
My odometer stopped on my 97 Civic LX cluster, and the tach and speedo work just fine so the VSS is cool. Is there anyway I can fix that gear or circuit board? Thanks!
</TD></TR></TABLE>
There's a circuit board behind the speedo/odo when you remove it from the housing.
for some reason needles always break when trying to remove them from auto clusters, i've taken apart TONS of clusters, and this has always been the case.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
That's weird. MT and AT speedos are exactly the same.
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by PJ »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
Could you elaborate on this a little more please?
My odometer stopped on my 97 Civic LX cluster, and the tach and speedo work just fine so the VSS is cool. Is there anyway I can fix that gear or circuit board? Thanks!
</TD></TR></TABLE>
There's a circuit board behind the speedo/odo when you remove it from the housing.
02-13-2008, 06:58 PM
#17
Honda-Tech Member
yeah, thats the same thing i thought, but i've had at least five auto clusters and all of them the metal post which the needle is attached to snapped when trying to remove em.
never had a manual needle snap... never made sense to me either..... weird coincidence i guess.
never had a manual needle snap... never made sense to me either..... weird coincidence i guess.
02-13-2008, 09:41 PM
#19
Re: Removing needles (NOFX)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by NOFX »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">You're thinking of the blue gears on top. The part that's broken is UNDER the odometer. It doesn't have anything to do with the tripometer.
The part that is broken is the white clip on the right on the white gears at the bottom. You can see the broken piece in the image above.
The entire tripometer section is just fine and has continued to work just fine.
Anyway though, it's back together. Everything works. And I have the guts of a CV-R speedometer if anyone ends up needing anything. I know you can't buy those parts separately from Honda (the speedometer is a complete assembly that costs abotu $265).
Modified by NOFX at 8:47 PM 2/13/2008</TD></TR></TABLE>
Nope, I was talking about the middle, darker blue gear. That converts electrical signal into mechanical movement of the odo gears.
Glad to hear you got it working.
The part that is broken is the white clip on the right on the white gears at the bottom. You can see the broken piece in the image above.
The entire tripometer section is just fine and has continued to work just fine.
Anyway though, it's back together. Everything works. And I have the guts of a CV-R speedometer if anyone ends up needing anything. I know you can't buy those parts separately from Honda (the speedometer is a complete assembly that costs abotu $265).
Modified by NOFX at 8:47 PM 2/13/2008</TD></TR></TABLE>
Nope, I was talking about the middle, darker blue gear. That converts electrical signal into mechanical movement of the odo gears.
Glad to hear you got it working.
02-14-2008, 09:17 AM
#21
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Re: Removing needles (BlueIntegraBoy)
EDIT: NOFX those are awesome, very helpful pictures; thank you very much! They should be very useful in diagnosing my odo when I yank the cluster again. Thanks!
So is my best bet to just get a new speedo assembly from Honda and clock it to reflect my current mileage?
20789 SPEEDOMETER ASSY.
$106.91 from Majestic...
So is my best bet to just get a new speedo assembly from Honda and clock it to reflect my current mileage?
20789 SPEEDOMETER ASSY.
$106.91 from Majestic...
02-14-2008, 09:35 AM
#22
H-T White Ops
Thread Starter
Re: Removing needles (BlueIntegraBoy)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by BlueIntegraBoy »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Superglue the metal bar to the white part (where the clip is) so that the dials don't come unaligned. Superglue the flat black metal strip too.</TD></TR></TABLE>
I don't think Super Glue wold be reliable on the white clip. Super Glue doesn't stick well to metal, so I wouldn't want to tear it all apart again.
Plus I got it working by replacing the CR-V guts with the Civic guts. Which I believe is a much more reliable set up than gluing a mechanical part back together.
I also found out the year of car my CR-V cluster came out of since there's a date on the speedometer assembly (two stamps of the same date actually).
I don't think Super Glue wold be reliable on the white clip. Super Glue doesn't stick well to metal, so I wouldn't want to tear it all apart again.
Plus I got it working by replacing the CR-V guts with the Civic guts. Which I believe is a much more reliable set up than gluing a mechanical part back together.
I also found out the year of car my CR-V cluster came out of since there's a date on the speedometer assembly (two stamps of the same date actually).
02-15-2008, 09:33 AM
#24
Re: Removing needles (NOFX)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by NOFX »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
I don't think Super Glue wold be reliable on the white clip. Super Glue doesn't stick well to metal, so I wouldn't want to tear it all apart again.
Plus I got it working by replacing the CR-V guts with the Civic guts. Which I believe is a much more reliable set up than gluing a mechanical part back together.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
That part isn't really mechanical. It's stationary, only the gears spin.
I don't think Super Glue wold be reliable on the white clip. Super Glue doesn't stick well to metal, so I wouldn't want to tear it all apart again.
Plus I got it working by replacing the CR-V guts with the Civic guts. Which I believe is a much more reliable set up than gluing a mechanical part back together.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
That part isn't really mechanical. It's stationary, only the gears spin.
02-15-2008, 09:58 AM
#25
H-T White Ops
Thread Starter
Re: Removing needles (PJ)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by PJ »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Would it be possible to use a little JB weld to fix that broken plastic piece?</TD></TR></TABLE>
The clip is nowhere to be found.
The cluster is repaired in a more reliable way already.
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by BlueIntegraBoy »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">That part isn't really mechanical. It's stationary, only the gears spin.</TD></TR></TABLE>
But it's on parts that can move and I'm not going to try to make things work the way they're not supposed to. Especially when I had the means to fix it in a more reliable way.
The cluster is fixed and works flawlessly.
The clip is nowhere to be found.
The cluster is repaired in a more reliable way already.
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by BlueIntegraBoy »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">That part isn't really mechanical. It's stationary, only the gears spin.</TD></TR></TABLE>
But it's on parts that can move and I'm not going to try to make things work the way they're not supposed to. Especially when I had the means to fix it in a more reliable way.
The cluster is fixed and works flawlessly.