gotgrip_st185

The usual....sitting at a red light, light turns green and I EASILY go to accelerate. Car stalls like I released the clutch wrong. I go to restart it and it is spinning over differently. Sounds as if just the starter is spinning and not engaging the flywheel. I take of the distributor cap, turn it over and the distributor doesn't spin. I was extremely low on gas, put some in it from a can and, like I was expecting, still the same spinning from the starter with the distributor not spinning. Not that I was expecting gas to fix it but was hoping that the free spinning noise was simply because there was no fuel to ignite.
Any suggestions? Starter? Timing belt (although I heard no clunk from the engine)? Bad dizzy?

Any help is greatly appreciated!

B16A2 in a 95 DX hatch with a GSR transmission.

NotARaCist

iTrader: (1)

Remove the starter, and verify that the ring gear on the flywheel is still intact. If it is, bench test your starter (any major parts store should be able to do this for you) and make sure that it's still engaging.

gotgrip_st185

Awesome! Thanks for the fast reply and I will check this tomorrow and let you know.

tony_2018

Oh no son....sounds like the timing is off it cam gear.

NotARaCist

iTrader: (1)

A snapped belt is a possibility. I'm trying to give OP a glimmer of hope before shitting on his fantasies here, tony

spAdam

iTrader: (1)

Snapped belt. Take the oil cap off and look at the cam while cranking to confirm.

joey1320

Definitely sounds like timing issues, best of luck.

DumpdEJ6

I'll jump in and can say with almost certainty that the timing belt has broken. Hopefully the valves are ok.

White_EG1

Well OP didn't say he was driving on the highway at 4500 rpms. Pretty sure it's the belt too, I'd just get a new belt and replace it. Seems like you were just barely above idle when this happened. So you have a good chance of it being that easy. But if you kept cranking the **** out of it after this happened, it won't apply.

gotgrip_st185

I'm headed to look at it now. Thanks for all the help and suggestions! I'll be back with some more information and hopefully it'll be just the starter but I'm thinking it's gonna be the timing belt.

gotgrip_st185

Sadly I did crank it afterwards. I've been driving a clutch for many years but I've been known to stall occasionally and that's what I thought happened as I was taking off when the light turned green. So, naturally, you go to restart it and it didn't start.

94EG8

Cranking the engine over after the fact wont change the outcome. Engine RPM doesn't have much effect on the outcome either. Sometimes you'll break a timing belt at 8000rpm and not bend valves, other times you'll break a belt at idle and bend all the intake valves. It's strictly luck.

spAdam

iTrader: (1)

Fact... But the luck is generally better when it happens at those low revs.

94EG8

Not from what I've seen...

TomCat39

I have to agree with 94EG8 here. RPM of the car isn't going to be a factor. I say this being I dropped a valve into my cylinder and raising the piston by hand, wedged it into the head a little. By hand is the softest and slowest possible and I saw the nicks in the head from that.

Any RPM that the engine maintains, if the piston and valves contact, it will bend the valves.

What is crucial is exactly where the cam shaft is when the belt stops turning the cam gear. I know every engine is different but from what I observed with the valve reliefs and valve operation, the valves are out their farthest about half way between TDC positions of the cam shaft. It's those points the valve reliefs tend not to be enough to avoid contact.

So really, it's pure dumb luck of where the camshaft stops that dictates if there is contact or not.

spAdam

iTrader: (1)

I agree that geometrically it shouldn't make any difference... just that every one that I've seen survive has either been at idle or in a scenario like the OP's. I've yet to see one survive with a high rpm/load break though. That's just based on the ones that I've personally dealt with over the years. I'm sure other people have had other results.

TomCat39

You know upon retrospect... Higher RPM does equal to higher inertia force. So in reality, the cam is likely to continue spinning longer at higher RPM than lower RPM. That in theory should increase the probability of being max lift just as piston comes TDC.

Lower the RPM the faster the valve springs will stop the cam at one of the TDC positions (12, 3, 6 or 9 o'clock).

NotARaCist

iTrader: (1)

I see where you're trying to go with that TomCat, but the cams and crank will decelerate at different speeds. Higher inertia = cam spinning longer = more chances for valves to try to make babies with the pistons. Theoretically, lower RPM means less cam spin until the valves all go fully closed. This is all just theory, though, so in the small sample sets we're talking about, it's pretty irrelevant.

OP hasn't posted since he said he was "headed to look at it", so let's relax and let him come back before we all go on about snapped belts.

TomCat39

I believe this was exactly what I was saying... If I miss wrote, this is what I was getting at on my last post. Realizing, higher RPM increases the probability of the doomsday situation.

But yeah, sort of irrelevant. OP needs to find out if the belt snapped, and then can test the valves with the simple leak down test in each cylinder with the cam TDC for each cylinder etc.

gotgrip_st185

Hey, guys! Sorry for the disappearing act. I had it towed home and left my phone on the tow truck. Obviously I had to get another.
As for the Civic/B16A2, I haven't looked at it. I'm probably gonna just get the engine rebuilt. I own a dental lab and have a few mechanics/builders/tuners interested in trading teeth for the rebuild. My main guy is back in town so hopefully he'll be able to look at it soon and we'll determine exactly what to do. I'll get back with the findings and future plan of attack! Thanks so much for everyone's help! It really is appreciated! Hope you all have a Happy Thanksgiving!

NotARaCist

iTrader: (1)

"Gonna just get the engine rebuilt"? Really? Just to put that in perspective, imagine you have a patient come in with a chipped tooth, otherwise healthy mouth, and they tell you that they want to pull all of their teeth and get dental implants. Would you tell them to go for it, or would you tell them that they are acting completely irrationally?

tony_2018

this just got nontechnical, please close.

gotgrip_st185

NotARaCist....Ummmm....Ohkay....your comparison makes about as much sense as outfitting submarines with screen doors but I'm not here to discuss that. The issue at hand is the engine and not your crystal ball, that has run out of minutes, as you try to diagnose my entire overall engine health and share your lack of odontological knowledge. However, I do thank you for your advice otherwise.

Anyway, back to the issue. As to rebuilding, what would a total labor and total parts be to rebuild a B16A2 stock? Any suggestions on complete rebuild kits and suggested upgrades like valve springs or cams?

My apologies for the sidetrack. I will do my best to not get derailed from the topic again.

NotARaCist

iTrader: (1)

Say what you will about my comparison, but you're the one talking about a full engine rebuild without even a tertiary inspection of what's wrong, not me. If that's what you want to do, then point your question to the value sticky. That's what it's there for.

rudebwoy

iTrader: (1)

Why not diagnose the car to see what went wrong?
Try start the car with in Gear, if the car move its not the starter.
or remove valve cover to see if timing belt is still there, these are too simple options, even though you may have options and can afford to rebuild why rebuild a working Engine when something external is the issue?
Sounds the European mentality they will replace a engine because of a Broken wire. Seen it a lot.