MaTaLa

Hey guys,
Decided to make a hobby out of semi-restoring and light modding the best car I've ever owned, 1996 Accord LX Sedan, 2.2, MT. It's been needing struts/shocks for awhile, probably >300k on car and they're original, so I opted to add a mild spring upgrade and rear sway bar.

Got both from ST Suspension mostly because of their $100 rebate on any suspension item till the end of June. W/ discount from autoanything and rebate, I hate rebates, I'll have $46 in the bar and $116 in the springs shipped to the door.

I got the bar yesterday and have been searching intrawebz furiously from someone that had posted something in the last few yrs about the install. All I could find were old threads re: drilling holes in subframe OR putting up w/ bar on exhaust clanking.

After I got all the parts out it looks like, or at least I'm hoping, that ST might have remedied that.



Anyway, just wanted get out there a bit and if anyones interested I'll post what I can about the install.

PS:I'm a noob at doing much modding but that's gonna change.

EDIT:Anyone know if a 5th Gen EX front sway differs in diameter between 4cyl and V6, thanks.

Fitz Williams

iTrader: (1)

I put an ST bar on my 94 and, yeah, it hit the exhaust until the muffler shop made a slight adjustment. Now it is OK.

MaTaLa

How's the bar working for ya? It's 13/16ths diameter, right?
Are you running stock front bar?

Fitz Williams

iTrader: (1)

The bar is 20mm and I have the stock front bar. To be honest, I can't tell a lot of difference. I was hoping to cure at least some of the understeer. But then I don't take the car to a track, so it's just a "seat of the pants" opinion which can be a bunch of BS. I personally think that if the mounting points for the bar to chassis were farther apart it would work better. Now I am thinking a Progress bar instead.

chrisnick

I have an LX coupe with a stock front bar and progress rear. Everything else is stock. I'm probably going to completely remove the front bar as there still isn't enough rotation for my liking.

The progress install is pretty easy, but check your brake lines first. On my LX, they're in the way.

MaTaLa

Bummer, I was hoping to hear you say 'Night and day difference'.
I see Progress is 10% thicker but other than that what difference is there do think?

Fitz Williams

iTrader: (1)

The way it mounts. And the muffler clearance. The Progress bar mounts about where the stock bar does and not toward the center of the car like the ST. That may help some, but all this does is cause the inside wheel to lift some and that's the wrong way to balance a car's handling. But then I am not going to the track, so if I can take a nice, fast curve on I-40, or have a little fun at the Tail of the Dragon, then all will be well.

One more thing, the ST mounts are really solid, and for a 20mm bar that is a good thing. I don't know what the Progress mounts are like but they may require a little fabrication to make them stiff enough.

MaTaLa

So w/ the ST mounts towards the center you think the bar is flexing?


Does the Progress mount for 5th gen look like this:


And...man, I miss I-40 in the Smokies, especially during the fall. Moving back soon though.

Fitz Williams

iTrader: (1)

I have only seen pics of the Progress, but I think it mounts at the same place as the factory one. The ST mounts on the same bolts that hold on the rear lower cross beam. These are very solid but closer together. The stock ones don't seem so solid but then I haven't seen what Progress gives you. It may be a trade off. It may not make any difference at all. But if I can gain some exhaust pipe clearance that would be good. Especially since I now have the stock exhaust and would like to go a little bigger.

chrisnick

I'll see if I can crawl under my car and take a couple pics of the Progress bar. The endlinks do NOT mount in the same spots on the trailing arms. The bar bolts to the lower crossmember, and you MUST drill holes.

Here's the install on a CB7, has some decent pictures. On the CD chassis, there's not bracket that you have to remove, but there may be the lower splash shield for the gas tank in the way. You can remove it fairly easily. You can see in the pictures how the rear brake line may be in the way; this was the case with my LX that has rear drums, so I chose to get a longer bolt and put a large nut between the bracket and the trailing arm. This is only temporary until I find a better mounting solution. My exhaust follows stock routing so there's plenty of clearance. The only issue I've been having is contact between the bar and the rear toe arm, so I have to sort that out; I think it's because the sway bar endlinks aren't long enough. I'll probably just come up with a better endlink solution as these are pretty much crap.
http://www.cb7tuner.com/vbb/showthread.php?t=100692


If you have any futher questions on the progress rear bar/install, let me know and I can crawl underneath my car and take whatever pictures you're looking for.

MaTaLa

@chrisnick
Yeah, I found your DIY earlier when I was researching. Great write up!

TheMuffinMan

iTrader: (1)

The Progress rear does not mount the same. The Progress requires you drill four holes in rear subframe and use some metal spacers for the mounting. The endlinks are also different.

Fitz Williams

iTrader: (1)

Yeah, I have looked at a number of pics of what is supposed to be the Progress bar and they are all different, so I really don't know what the actual Gen 5 bar looks like. I want to see one before I get rid of the ST I have now.

19Accord97

I just ordered the front and rear ST Suspension bars. Considering I have an LX with no rear sway bar I am hoping to feel a bit of a difference. Ill only end up paying $104 for both sway bars....how can you beat that?!

Anyone know of a DIY for the front sway bar?

chrisnick

Not mine, but I used it as reference.

Yeah, it's really not too hard to do that stuff. Everyone makes a big fuss over it, but it's pretty simple.

I'd imagine the stock bar is pretty worthless. I'll crawl under my car tonight and snap a couple pictures, but FYI, it's EXACTLY like the 4th gen bar posted in the writeup.

Personally, I'd just keep the stock front bar. Mine is still way too neutral for my liking, but I'm an autocrosser who prefers cars on the loose side. Install the rear bar first, drive it around. If it's too tail happy for you(it won't be, believe me), install the front bar and enjoy the push. My car is otherwise stock(LX, like yours), and most likely staying that way(aside from better shocks). I may even take OFF the front bar to promote some more rotation.


For all those with Progress bars, let me know if you're encountering some rear toe arm interference. I'm still trying to figure out what I can do with mine to prevent this. It's looking like longer endlinks may be the only solution.

MaTaLa

I'm thinking about modding the bushings w/ zerks and grooving the bushings themselves to make lubing them easier.

TheMuffinMan

iTrader: (1)

The only 'issue' I had was I left everything bolted up to the car subframe wise, so I had a difficult time holding and positioning the nuts for the progress bar mounts. Beyond that it was pretty straight forward.

chrisnick

That part was just about the only pain. With a lift and a second set of hands, I bet it would install in about 10 minutes. Took me about an hour of real actual work. Spent about 2 because I kept getting out from under the car, drank a couple beers, was missing hardware(got it used), and other BS.

19Accord97

Installed mine today. The worst part was my neck cramping from being under the car trying to see the nuts, washers, and all that stuff. Took it out for a drive and noticed an immediate difference in the rear on hard turns. I definitely enjoy that! But, driving normally there wasn't much difference. In addition, the sway bar does not sit against or rub against the exhaust except for when turning very sharp at a high rate of speed so I was pleased that I won't be hearing much banging or anything like that.

I torqued the bolts that go into the subframe to 40lbs per the instructions. But as far as the endlinks, how much are we supposed to torque them? The instructions had no mention.....

Looking forward to installing the front sway bar when it arrives.

chrisnick

I don't think there's a torque spec, but this is what the Progress instructions say:

"6. Install the bushings and brackets onto the bar, and mount the bar to the backing plates. Tighten mounting bolts(fig 8) and end link assemblies. DO NOT over- tighten the end links! Tighten the end link until you cannot rotate the cup washer by hand, then one more full turn."

Sounds like hand tight+one turn. I'm going to guess your ST bar's endlinks will be fine following the same procedure, but it'd be best to call ST and ask what they advise.

Since mine's been on, I've had to re-tighten all the hardware once.

Really interested in seeing your pictures and how it mounts to the body/subframe and suspension.

19Accord97

Thanks! I probably overtightened them. Ill be retorquing everything this weekend. Yeah I'll have to give them a call. I took a couple pics and will post them when I get home.
The main bushings are attached to a plate using 2 bolts that attach the subframe to the body. The end links use an l shaped bracket attached to predrilled holes in the trailing arms.

chrisnick

Have any issues with the rear brake lines being in the way? I still need to figure out a way to either relocate the brake line or drill a new hole about 1" forward of the current one so it doesn't interfere.

19Accord97

Nope. It was touching at first but I loosened the bolt for the end links, slid the bracket over a couple mm, and then bolted it in that position.

19Accord97

Here are all of the pictures I took. I planned on making a DIY but then decided not too because my neck was hurting and I was getting annoyed! Hope this helps you!

Parts


before


Bolt for the subframe that needs to be removed/attached to the included bracket.


Bracket attached. (same for each side) (I added Zinc Primer to help against rust)


Both brackets installed. (torque bolts to 40 lbs)


endlinks (here you can see where the bracket/endlinks attach to the control arm)


Close up of endlinks. I was able to get it a few mm away from the brake line.




Rubs on exhaust when in the air. Once the wheels touch the ground the sway bar does not touch the exhaust.




installed

chrisnick

Interesting. I see now how my progress bar runs into toe arm clearance. I'll have to play with it a little bit, I think spacing it off the subframe more will improve toe arm clearance. I'll take pictures tomorrow for comparison. This is turning into a pretty good thread.