TomCat39

Googled bad ball joint and I repeatedly got clunking and or clicking up and down as a bad ball joint.

What if it is just loose enough to spin freely (takes an impact to tighten the castle nut) but doesn't have any up and down play or noticeable side to side play?

Is that considered bad or just very worn soon to be bad?

And lastly, can extremely worn ball joints cause low (less than 10 mph), moderate (30-50 mph) and high speed (70+ mph) wobble? Added info: Wobble smooths out at certain speeds and becomes more pronounced at others.

I should note that I suspect the wobble is always present, just at certain speeds it resonates in such a way as to either blend with engine vibration or be absorbed by rubber parts (bushings/mounts etc).

redlinetuning

Speed variation wobble can be that the wheel/tire is off-balance. Bad ball joints can cause all sorts of noises and problems. If it is just spinning when you are trying to put on the castle nut that means there isn't enough weight/pressure on it to keep it from spinning. Jack up the lower control arm and you should be able to tighten it up without an impact tool.

TomCat39

I tried that first and it didn't work. Both times that ball joint has been popped an impact was needed to spin it fast enough to get it to tighten up.

As a test, once I had it cinched with the impact, I took my torque wrench and set it for spec torque of about 34 ft-lbs if I recall and it would still spin with resistance. I had to jerk to get the torque wrench to click and also to move the castle nut in line for the cotter pin. Sort of like the impact method but by hand.

When it was popped, like I mentioned, I couldn't get it to move vertically or horizontally even though the bolt moved around spherically very easily with next to no resistance.

Not to repeat myself but I'm not sure if that is considered bad or just pretty worn and will soon to become bad?

Oh and on the wobble, I've had it since I've had the car and I've had it through essentially 4 sets of tires via rotation of two full sets of tires. I know the tires were balanced at least twice. None of this changed a thing. I've since put on new axles as the CV boots finally split open and the joints were clicking. Still no change. Next on the list is probably new rotors even though I don't really notice throbbing braking. Also I know the tie rods are tight with no play so just trying to learn what suspension components may give that behavior if it's suspension related.

slowcivic2k

Non-serviceable ball joints normally use compressed plastic, which is generally impregenated with graphite or another high stress lubricant (similar to axle grease) in order to reduce wear. When this plastic hardens and wears, the pre-load on the joint is lost, which does not automatically disqualify the joint. Toyota actually specifies a pre-load torque on most of its ball joints. Any joint with zero pre-load is a suspect failure as the clearance can change as soon as the vehicle is lowered.

It sounds like the stud taper, or the knuckle taper is worn to such a degrees that the stud will not properly interference fit with the knuckle. If your contact area is tiny, you will snap the joint while driving as there is not enough load bearing surface to carry the load.

The game of vibration and wobble changes once the tire is on the ground. I was hunting a torque steer feeling during acceleration and braking on a 91 Honda I used to own, and the lower joint was the culprit.

The fact that the vibration changes as speed changes makes tire/rim balance/deformities and the ability for the strut to hold the tire down properly suspect. These conditions would also cause excessive wear in the ball joints on that side.

TomCat39

Thank you for your informative answer. Even though I'm not hearing clunking on rough roads, rail road tracks etc, from what you have provided, I am assuming it's bad and needs replacing regardless. It's on my immediate to-do list (meaning the next few months tops).

I know two of the rims are bent (currently on the front again), while the other two are not. It didn't matter if the bent rims were on the front or the back, the wobble has always been present. It is felt in the steering wheel which wobbles approximately 1/4"-1/2" maybe at it's worst (real slow speeds) and barely noticeable but still present at certain harmonious speeds only to return to the very noticeable but rapid setting at other even higher speeds.

I have temporarily given up on painting some alloy rims 13" rims I bought over a year ago. I'm nearly done sanding off my last attempted and failed paint job. I will be mounting new used in good condition all seasons tires and putting them on the car. I will see if the wobble is reduced or changed regardless of what I suspect due to the previous rotational attempts. Also of note, this time not only will all four rims be straight but I am having them road force balanced to take that out of the equation.

I will report back once done if there isn't any significant change.

Thank you once again, your knowledge and feedback has been invaluable.

Cheers.

slowcivic2k

When you have the road force done, if they cannot be corrected or are way out, demand the rim be spun. In most places you pay quite a bit to have this type of service done. Even though they may be able to clock the tire to reduce vibration, its is better to know if it is the tire, or rim, or both that are causing the problem, so that you can make the best decision.

Caoboy

The fact that you have a wobbling vibration that changes with speed makes me think it's rotational and I would look towards wheel bearings, if it's not out of balance wheels.
Your clunking sound, do you have a clunking sound? Most sound from a lower ball joint that is bad is usually a clicking sound when turning the wheel left to right, in my experience.

Any other clunking sounds I've attributed to blown shocks, they tend to clunk or rattle in variances in the road, yet the car doesn't not 'seem' to be hitting bumps/dips in the road.

TomCat39

I think you may have misread. I am not noticing any clunking/clicking. But if I'm to be realistic, it's rather difficult to tell being I have so much stuff in my trunk that creates noise in bumpy conditions.

Last I checked, the wheel bearings were tight for the 12/6 and 3/9 position wheel wiggle. But it has been awhile.

Also, I did get a used car inspection by a Honda specialist when I first got the car and the only thing he noted at the time was the trailing arm bushings were splitting and the the outer cv boots had cracks in them. I had the wobble then.

After some time, I spun all 8 steelies I had at the time to find the straightest of them (only two didn't have side to side wobble). Put those on the front and the least bent ones on the back. I mounted and balanced the tires myself after I had spun just the rims.

I recall the car feeling the same at low speeds after, but it was quite awhile ago so don't remember if it transferred into the steering wheel or just the body of the car.

I figure these newer tires I picked up mounted to the 13 inch alloys will finally put 4 straight wheels on the car and then I can go from there.

Plus I need to do the lower ball joints. Once these two steps are done (wheels and ball joints). Then I can have a couple of solid possibilities ruled out all the while fixing some old worn parts of the car.

TomCat39

Okay I finally got my 13 inch alloys on the car with 4 new tires, all balanced this weekend.

My wobbles have been reduce a lot being there isn't any bent rims on the car. Also I noticed one tire had a bulge on the tread (old tires and rims). I think I broke a belt when I smacked a curb accidentally one night. (long story and no I wasn't drinking).

Anyways, overall the car is less violent to drive, however I still have a small wobble at around 20 KPH and I can just notice it at 120 KPH and 90 KPH.

Not pronounced anywhere near it was.

So far the axles are new and now the tires and rims are in great shape.

I have another set of knuckles that I have planned to put new bearings in and new lower ball joints.

I'm wondering what other suspension related parts can cause wobble. The car doesn't have any sway bars, not even a front one.

I'm also in need of an alignment, it pulls to the right (used to lightly pull to the left on the old rims and tires). New rims and tires are a bit wider and just stick out from the front fender naturally. Would that be able to cause a wobble? I noticed these rims and tires track any issues in the pavement unlike my old rims and tires.

Had to wait until today and I did my stop and slow trek into work to see if the wobble was still present as it's the only time I'm continually under 20 KPH for any length of time.

And confirmed the wobble is still present through 3 rim and tire configurations. I can safely rule out rim and tires. Any ideas?