BillD123

Hi All--

This is a great forum, thought I would run a problem by all of you in hopes that it may relieve the heartburn associated with a problem I am having with my 2005 Accord EX 2.4L AT.

Vehicle originally had CEL and ABS lights. There was no communication at the DLC. Dealer had the car for several days and said that the MICU was blown and that it is related to the ABS modulator. Apparently when the Modulator is unplugged and the under dash fuse panel were swapped out communication at DLC was restored and trouble code was for coolant temp sensor. They plugged ABS connector back in communication was lost a few seconds later followed by a "pop" under the dash.

So, I got a quote of $2600 for new modulator and MICU/fuse box. Since I am very hands on and don't have $2600 I figured I would have them put the new MICU in and I would pick up a discounted new Modulator or one out of a wreck.

Questions:
1) Anyone ever seen this type of failure before?
2) It looks like there are two potential part numbers for the modulator: 57110-SDA-A22 and 57110-SDA-A23 are these interchangeable?

Thanks in advance everyone. Hope I covered most of the required pieces of information.

BillD123

I should have mentioned I asked them to pin test the harness to be sure there were not any shorts to ground there. Seems strange to me that the MICU is not fuse protected against a failure like this.

KWayRacing

Even at MSRP these parts are only 1500. I can't come up with 2600 out the door. 1500 parts, 500 labor, thats 5 hours at 100 an hour including shop supplies, and tax. Wheres the other 600. 5 hours is very reasonable time to install these parts for any technician. If the tech now wants you to pay to train him then thats a different story. THere is a sort of simple way of diagnosing no communication with the PCM. What is weird to me that in all of the branches of the troubleshooting sequence for no communication with the PCM does the manual suggest a MICU replacement. Or that an ABS modulator could be the problem. When one has no communication with the PCM, ultimately any other lost communication is secondary to that of the PCMs. Every branch of that troubleshooting tree pointed to opens/shorts in 5 or so wires or the PCM itself. Just sort of weird to me.

BillD123

Thanks for the reply on this. I got quoted a price of 1600 for the Modulator. The MICU replacement and troubleshooting time came in at around 900. I don't have the wiring diagrams or service manual yet--should be here tonight. Is the ABS even wired to the MICU? I honestly haven't seen a real good description of the MICU function. I know it controls windows, interior illumination, anti-theft etc...Does it also handle all the communication with all subsytems (ABS, SRS etc..)? Very strange.

BillD123

I received my shop manual today, and I have to say I am some what baffled by the diagnosis from the dealer. It seems very strange to me that 1) a MICU failure would cause a complete loss off communcation at the DLC. 2) that the ABS control unit would cause the MICU to "blow". The ABS control unit is on the FCAN and the MICU is the BCAN as best I can tell from a cusory look through the diagrams. I see what KWayRacing is saying in their post. At this point I have a vehicle that has a new MICU, is now communicating at the DLC but has the ABS connector unplugged. I am waiting for the new used modulator to show up but when I replace it I am going to be very afraid to plug it in. What to do is the question.

BillD123

Problem Solved! Let me first say that I am thoroughly disgusted by the service I received from my local Honda dealer. I will be down there having a conversation with the service manager and the general manager on Monday morning.

Here's what has happened since my last post:

I received the new ABS Modulator yesterday. I installed it, bled the system and checked communication at the DLC before hooking up the ABS 25 pin connector. Everything was good. No codes.

I then plugged in the ABS connector and put the IGN in II position. ABS Light stayed on and lost communication at the DLC. At this point quickly unplugged ABS connector before MICU fried again. Rechecked communication all is OK.

Took my Factory Manual wiring diagram and started testing the wiring (which the dealer assured me that had done). Found that PINS 24 & 25 had no continuity to chassis ground. Traced wires in harness to ring connector under the power steering Reservoir bracket. Removed, cleaned, reconnected and tested ABS Connector PINS 24 & 25 for continuity to ground. Good ground now present.

Followed same process as above (checked DLC communication, plugged in ABS connector turned on IGN). This time ABS light went out and communication at DLC stayed up--no codes.

Is it unreasonable for me to be upset? The ABS modulator did not need to be replaced they tried to charge me $1600 for a new one. The dealer had this car for a week and didn't bother to pin test the ABS connector?? Unbelievable. I am no Honda tech, just a guy with a half of a brain and can read a manual. Is it unreasonable to expect that a dealership should be able to identify a bad ground for $637 worth of labor when it took an untrained guy like myself about 1/2 hour with a meter to find it?

What would you folks do in this situation?

conker

You present yourself well, take the next step up to contacting American Honda. I have not had success in my dealings with them, but that really is probably your next best move. Best of luck.

speeder

I have exactly the same problem on my 2005 element . I went testing the pins on the ABS connector it seems the pin #23 is grounded... Can someone tell me it reffer to what ????
thanks a lot !!!

99blackcivicSi

no you have every! right to be upset i would throw that dealer under the bus and that tech through the ringer SHOW them what YOU found this is why tickets where i work are dispatched accordingly to skill level we can't have mis-diagnosis on that kind of level when it involves a comma its going to happen every now and agian but if something is popping another control unit its going to be wiring related 99% of the time you need to be rembursed your money because of their **** up end of story, i am disgusted to be lumped in with people of that caliber who have NO clue what they are doing there is no such thing as a tech anymore only parts installers if the book tells them thats the failure then they put that part on.

speeder

anyone have the diagram ???

sc6lou

I would complain. I am currently trying to find the wire diagram for the 05 accord for the ABS. I have a constant TCS activation light and trying to see why it is on and no check engine lite. thanks Leo

Lost Again

For around $27 you can get a pretty good service manual for this gen Accord. Check out www "dot" automanualsource "dot" com

leg911

Here are two pictures of the grounds. I am troubleshooting a ABS light and tried this ground issue first. My ground wires are not connected to the power steering reservoir bracket. The two ground wires were connected to the inner fender well below the

ABS module. If you follow the wiring harness from the ABS plug it will have the two ground wires for 24 & 25 connected with one bolt below ABS module. I removed the engine mount to access the location. Hope this helps.

leg911

As a follow up. My car with this issue is a 2005 Honda Civic Ex 1.7 Auto. I was getting a ABS error code 52. Motor stuck on.
This error and fix can apply to more than accords and civics. After resurfacing the ground area with a dremal and some emery cloth
I reset the the code. When I get ready to test drive it the code had come on. After driving the car about 1/4 of a mile the light
went out and never came back on. If you end up needing to replace the ABS Modulator then I found these two parts are applicable for my model.
57110-S5A-D60
and
0 265 215 983.
There are some Honda parts website that allow you to enter you VIN Nbr. Then look up the part nbr for your specific vehicle.
Even tho these two parts nbrs showed to be good for my car the one installed was 57110-S5A-D60.
This would have been the part nbr I would have sourced. They can be found used on ebay for $50-$100.
Good luck.......

leg911

I did check pins 24 & 25 prior to re grounding the connection and resolving the issue. I did get good continuity on pin 25. Pin 24 was reading 14.5 volts.

leg911