Backk InTheDA

Now before everyone gets all 'use the search/FAQ section' happy. I have followed this thread,

https://honda-tech.com/forums/honda-accord-1990-2002-2/1997-accord-brakes-tutorial-1281812/

to a T. I have all the tools pictured. I just for the life of my cannot break loose the 4 bolts pictures here loose.



I'm not sure if it matters that much, but everywhere I have read states this is a 12mm head. The ones on my car are a 10mm head and is also a 12point not a 6point. I have sprayed a lot of PB blaster, but it still won't budge. My offset wrench that I'm using doesn't seat all the way down, and in result of this, I have started to strip one of the heads a bit.

Is there another way to get these bolts off? I don't really want to have to have this repaired by a shop if I can avoid it.

It's a long shot, but I'm just throwing it out there. If anyone is in the Seattle area and is willing to give me assistance with this, I would gladly compensate them for their time.

Please let me know your thoughts/suggestions!

hondamark35

did you read some of the responses on that write up thread... some of the guys said that they take the axle out of the way to access these four bolts. this would also allow the use of an impact wrench if you have one available.

i usually have the car on a lift so i just pull the entire knuckle assembly off and set it on the bench. then i unbolt it and dissassemble.

nguyener

Remove the whole knuckle itself? Then you can easily remove those four bolts.

Different job, but same removal steps:
https://honda-tech.com/forums/honda-accord-1990-2002-2/diy-rotor-over-hub-conversion-2027047/

chofmann79

I just changed the front rotors on my 1994 Accord a few weeks ago. I was in the same situation as you, and there was no way I could get those 4 bolts off the back of the knuckle. It was an extremely frustrating process, but there was no way I was going to give up and take it in to a dealer.

This is what I ended up doing:
1) Disconnect the bolts/brackets holding the brake lines (and ABS sensor in my case) on to the knuckle
2) Remove spindle nut on axle. This was quite difficult. First, be sure to hammer out the little tab on the nut first so it can spin. The nut was VERY tight and I had to use an impact wrench.
3) Separate the joint between the tie rod/knuckle
4) Separate the lower ball joint
5) Separate the upper ball joint
6) Slide the entire knuckle/rotor/hub/bearing assembly off the axle, as well as the upper and lower ball joints. The passenger side slid right off...the driver side was frozen on there, and I had to run to AutoZone to rent their Flange Axle FWD Puller.
7) Now you can put the whole thing in a vice or on a workbench and use whatever tool you want (impact wrench worked really well in my case) to remove those 4 bolts.
8) Discover that the hub/bearing assembly is rusted on to the knuckle, and no amount of beating can get the thing off (I live in northern Ohio, so we get lots of rusted parts). At this point I realized that even if I had gotten those 4 bolts off the back without removing the knuckle from the car, I would never have been able to get the hub/bearing out, and would have had to remove the knuckle anyway.
9) Take knuckle assembly to local shop and have them remove the hub/bearing assemblies from the knuckles using a press. It took them under an hour, and cost me $45 total.
10) Put it all back together. At this point, I also replaced all of the ball joint dust boots (ordered honda parts from a dealer), as 3 of them were cracked, 1 was getting close to cracking, and I damaged 1 while I was getting the knuckle off the car.
11) Drive 150 miles and have the water pump fail (this step probably won't apply to you).

Hopefully this helps!

TouringAccord

if you don't want to remove the entire knuckle, just remove the axle from the hub. That way you can access those bolts with something more than an offset wrench, like an impact as stated above or just a regular ratchet with a 12 point socket attached.

Backk InTheDA

Thanks for the replies. Chof, what did you end up paying for all 3 dust boot covers?

chofmann79

I replaced 6 dust boots (1 upper, 1 lower, and 1 tie rod end on each side)...I was in a big hurry, so I ordered direct from a local dealer for ~$65 total. I probably could have saved a bit more if I had the time to order the parts online.

Backk InTheDA

How will I know if I need to replace the cotter pin? Only if its rusted completely out?

chofmann79

I generally always replace a cotter pin...they're almost always rusty, and even if they're not, repeated bending of the pin weakens the metal and makes it more likely to break. I forget what size pin was required, though...I just have a huge set of assorted sizes I got from the hardware store for about $5.

Backk InTheDA

Okay cool. I will attempt this again this evening. I am going to follow that guide where all the ball joints were seperated so I can remove those 4 backside bolts hopefully with ease.

Backk InTheDA

Unbelievable. I have the whole knuckle off and those 4 bolts on the back will still not break loose. I have sprayed a lot of PB blaster but they're not budging.

Suggestions?

nguyener

A long breaker bar with a cheater bar.

Or an impact wrench.

Backk InTheDA

Got an impact gun, that failed. I can't really use a breaker bar as I don't have a vice to clamp the whole unit down in once place as it moves around on the ground.

I called a shop, they said they could press the back off, and put the new rotors on each side. I'm just going to have this done then take them home and put the knuckles back on and call it a day.

chofmann79

Ultimately, that's what I ended up doing too.

I was able to get all of those bolts out with an impact gun (after soaking in PB Blaster overnight), but even then the hub assembly was rusted on to the knuckle so bad that it wasn't going anywhere. I read a bunch of stories of people in that same situation who tried to get the knuckle off on their own by various methods and just ended up separating the hub and bearing instead, opening up a whole new can of worms. Wanting to avoid that, I took both knuckles to the shop around the corner, and within an hour they had them both apart. I took everything home, applied some anti-seize between the hub and knuckle to make things easier next time. and had it put back together pretty quickly with no other problems.

TheMuffinMan

iTrader: (1)

Impact gun with chisel point. Chisel into the bolt's head to spin it off.

Backk InTheDA

This is what I am doing tomorrow. I am actually going to have the wheel bearings replaced too. Just don't want to have anymore problems in that area of the car anymore.

bryse68

the easiest way to replace rotors is to use a big slide hammer(10lbs) and pull off the hub.

Backk InTheDA

Chof,

I also noticed one of my ball joint boots were torn. What is the process to replace those?

I just need to buy the boot and get grease for it, right?

chofmann79

Yeah, it's pretty simple...just get a replacement boot at a local dealer (I recommend calling around for the best deal...I found prices ranging from ~$8-$26 depending on which dealer I called) or order one online if you're not in a hurry. None of the dealers I called had one in stock, but I had them order it overnight and I just picked it up the next morning.

There's just a wire clip holding the boot on at the base...I just used a small screwdriver and a pair of needle nose pliers to pry/work it off. Once you get the clip off, you can just pull the old boot off and clean all the old grease off the joint. Then I installed the new boot, and put the old clip back on. Putting the clip back on was by far the most difficult part...I found what worked best for me was to grab one end of the wire with a pair of needle nose pliers, and then use my hand to place the other end in the groove at the base of the boot. Then I just used the pliers to gently stretch/twist the clip all the way back into the groove (careful not to puncture the new boot).

Once you get the boot and clip back on, you just need to fill it with grease. Since there were no zerk fittings on any of the joints, I picked up a Syringe adapter at Advance Auto Parts...it was about $4 and fit right on to the end of my grease gun. I just carefully slipped the needle between the boot and the shaft of the joint and filled it up.

Backk InTheDA

Oh, I don't have a grease gun to fill it up with. Is there another way to do it?

Backk InTheDA

Since I was unable to remove those 4 bolts that hold the knuckle to the hub, I took it to a brake shop just to have them use a impact gun to remove them. The guy told me they weren't the correct bolts. The ones I had in there were a 10mm torx head. Kind of a pain in the *** that the person before me didn't do the job the right way the first time.

Anyways, getting new bearings pressed in today and then will assemble each side and call it a done deal!

Thanks for your help Honda-Tech.

Backk InTheDA

Back again unfortunately. I got new bearings pressed in today and I had to order 8 more of those bolts that go on the back of the knuckle that go into the hub.

Well when I went to install those bolts today(the 4 on the back)the bolts are backing out. I do about 3 full rotations and the bolts are already loose. Now if I tighten them too tightly down, the dust shield will start to press in and drag on the rotor and I will need to bend it back with my hands.

I haven't read anything about a torque spec for these bolts, and I can't figure out why they're backing out. If it matters, this is what I am doing exactly.

The whole assembly is on the ground resting on the 4 lug nuts on the front. I grab the knuckle from the control arm and spin that around. Now I am aware this is how the unit doesn't spin when on the car, but I don't believe the bolts should be backing out.

Can anyone explain why this is happening? And better yet, help me solve this problem.

Thanks again,

nus_dogg

Yeah, I've always been using impact guns. I know they're a b!tch to remove without air tools.

Backk InTheDA

Bump because I need to get my car fixed!

Backk InTheDA

So I got the driver side done today. Still waiting on bolts to hold the hub to the knuckle. Those will be in on Monday. This morning when I was tightening the upper control arm into the knuckle. The threads on the ball joint were stripped and it was only spinning when I tried to put the castle nut on. I ended up having to do this to press the control arm down so it wouldn't spin.



This is by far the biggest pain in the *** job ever. Everyone should just do a rotor over hub conversion and save themselves the trouble. I will for sure being doing that next time.