SiRCiviC94

Randomly I decided to take apart the b16 that didn't like 305whp on a dyno jet... Went on the highway by the time I ended 4th smoke came out.... I'm more into the mystery behind what happened cyl 3 and 4 had low compression. The tune was spot on it seemed tho.

Found this



Swapped a new set up a day later b16a cometic 30over and arp head studs... New bearings belts etc... Same pistons tho how do I avoid the issue? I have checked my tune on this swap it works great no issues this time. Runnin an ngk8 now but the 7s looks great coming out.

rich7777

You need to start considering forged pistons. Stoke cast pistons are simply not up to the job anymore for you.

Muckman

iTrader: (2)

Im going to say rings butted. Show us a pic of the top and second ring end gaps - looking at the face of the gap

Schister66

Cracked ringlands...that's the problem with factory cast pistons.

Muckman

iTrader: (2)

Yes but usually the top ring land is cracked too.

Schister66

Oh, I thought it was always the second and third that broke...I'm not much of a tuner and haven't ever popped an engine myself, so I am by no means an expert on instances like this

joe b

Stock cast pistons cant take that kind of power for long . Every time ive seen a stock motor go past 300whp this happens . Upgrade to forged pistons and while your in there rods should be done also .

Muckman

iTrader: (2)

I was wrong. I just checked my broken stock pistons which had cracked ring lands as well and they are not cracked on the top either. It must be an issue with the 2nd ring butting. Interesting.

Charlie Moua

iTrader: (3)

cast stock pistons aren't the issue at 300whp.

maybe someone can speak on the subject of ring gapping.
IIRC too tight of rings can cause flutter which leads cracked ringlands.

otherwise could be the tune.

Spawne32

iTrader: (3)

SiRCiviC94

So those are the ring lands. I just sold this block for a good price to some one doing a high comp b16b build over 13:1 and its going to Indonesia or something lol.

The rings looked mint! No pics tho.

I imagine 305whp is closer to 400bhp on this punisher... But feels average on the street tolerance for power is high now) that was using a 57trim at 11 psi.

I'm currently running the same tune on the new set up. Plugs and afr look great. Again tho 11 psi - 300+whp and around 7psi - 255whp. The car responds much better on high boost


This is going to happen again isn't it? 9psi/10? Lol anyway to add timing to those cyls to keep em safe? I'm open to everything here... New set up already built and in use (1 night build lol) I should also ad the car is being street tuned to clean up the low end stuff... And we'll do some top end pulls make sure the tune is safe. Should be making 10-20 passes this weekend !

SiRCiviC94

How are those gsr engines running 350whp with no issue. I imagine they are the same inferior design for boosting? I'm trying to stay stock long blocks and 280-320whp that's all I should ever need. I considered the beefed up bottom end but that's like $2000

sanman000719

think its hit or miss i have had a stock block at 600whp for 4 years now, and i have known a few others that have also.

Muckman

iTrader: (2)

sanman, do you know what your peak EGTs in the stock block are?

TheShodan

iTrader: (14)

In those cases it was both the grace of God, and the fact that those other blocks weren't running on an everyday commuter basis at those levels. Those are MUCH more the exception over the rule that I've experienced the last 15 years.

They were tuned well from the beginning, are being pushed to reasonable limits, and were in good mechanical order before it was even turbocharged.

You're going spend the money one way or another, be it for another block, upgrading the internal components in your current one, or doing this again with the wrong tuner. So, you're limited in your options.. except maybe to happen up on a good used "built" block, with a different tuner.

Its all coming together a bit now. first the head, now the block..

I hope you're learning a lot from all this.. Good luck.

SiRCiviC94

The head is a champ no issue there but it sits on a shelf! With what feels like 1000's of passes na/boost/nitrous.. To the max. Lol so I had to throw in another fresh b16... 30thou over gasket arp studs new bearings etc... A quick refresh and it shows.

I mentioned the hp... The torque however was a flat 225tq which is outrageous I thought. That's killing it? It comes on hard!

So that's a 65+hp and 55tq increase from last year! We all know 230-250 is near bullet proof I don't think it's the tune cause it was solid at that

New b16 -$300 from a friend no biggie

sanman000719

exactly the driver and tuner is the most important thing to keeping these stock blocks together.

egt's on a stock block i could care less about i drove mine to work for a year, and made over 100 passes at the track at 28psi.

the kids or newbies are thinking man hondas are getting it done so i want to build one and they do. well they are forgetting that you can't just beat the **** out of them on a everytime i turn the key on basis and expect it to last

sanman000719

the main advantage to running a stock block to me is that exactly $300 and replace the bottom end

TheShodan

iTrader: (14)

I'm not trying to bust your bubble here, but if you're loosing ringlands like this, the tune is not solid, even for that power level.

you're a b16, even in boost, its not going to make much torque, that's just the way it is.

DDTECH

Yea.. I had that happen on my own motor..

I was up against the wall on two instances. 1, too much compression for pump gas, or 2, install error. I didn't install the pistons on my last motor, I had another person do it for me(last time I do that), and it was mixed feelings.. My tune was also pretty dead on, and I "too" broke the middle ringland. See how the bottom ringland is cracked too? That leads me to believe it was a install error. You would have some pitting if there was some detonation, or pre - ignition.

Whats the afr?
Total timing? how much actual boost?? Its very possible a tuning issue could cause this, don't rule it out..
Just my opinion.

92egdxhatch

I recently broke ring lands on my stock bottom end.

It leaned out, due to what I believe was an exhaust leak at the manifold flange and cylinder head.

It made 348/295 and took a lot of abuse before this happened.

I would guess you had a fuel/tune issue.

SiRCiviC94

I've been straight up so far. And the b16 torque less remark :p 220+ is busting gsrs asses lol.

The tune... You hop on it in second it's 11.7 and dips to 11.4 then 11.2 and 11psi on my gauge. I didn't tune the car the rest of the info is hard to say its at 16* ignition at idle and don't know how much pulled but concervative for sure.

The story leading up to the issue was I got the tune adjusted for more boost, done several flawless pulls over 260-300whp drove the car half an hour or so then I hit limiter in second a few times third 8k 4th 7500 ish then in 5th I had low power I noticed cruising then the smoke came.

Gas is 94 pump, plug ngk 7 .025gap, 10w30 regular at the time.

I've done the same thing on my new set up with no issue but its a bit hp/tq much still?

Also something random I noticed... I have precision 680cc injectors they worked last year and my new set up never blew or leaned out. I noticed on cyl 4 I can "feel" the injector pulsing compared to the others. I never swapped em to see if it does it on another cyl is that a problem? Cyl 1 is the most noticeable cyl 2 I can't feel it tho. This raises some attention