wantboost

iTrader: (2)

Mac, the one thing I have noticed is that every car using GSCT1s that posted a vid has a full exhaust (muffler, resonator, a few with a cat) It makes me wonder what my setup will sound like with a short exhaust and no muffling (maybe a resonator if it's raspy)

Hopefully I'll discourage the local "rednecks who hate anything not american or lifted crowd" from even trying to mess with me.... Lord only knows how bad their egos would be bruised after being stomped on by a civic with metallic pink wheels lol

and IIRC g0at is using the smallest turbo to date with these cams (less than 55lb/min I think, correct me if I'm wrong) so he has the closest example to what my setup SHOULD be like. I'll be running 20-25psi so that blue line would best represent my boost curve, however I don't recall what motor configuration he has.... so my 10.5:1cr, 46mm ITB, 8 injector ls/v might have a slightly better torque curve and better power delivery (again I hope)

PS I need to talk to you about my gt2871r when you have some free time (you haven't been on AIM in a while slacker (didn't you just have another child or am I confusing you with Muckman lol?))

(want to see if you have a wheel that would work with the existing garrett turbine wheel or maybe put the 76mm comp wheel on it.... really the goal, once I get a steady income is to put a BW EFR 6758 on it when I can, unless you decide to develop a gt2871(76)r or GTX2871(76)r competitor... *pretty please?*) I'm also going to bring the housing to the machine shop and see if my guy can machine a ported shroud into the t04b housing, depending on if I stay 71mm or go 76mm or whatever crazy thing you have laying around lol. Our Haas 5 axis mill with a .25" or smaller endmill should make simple work of the task (3 pockets, just like the 3076 comp cover, just need to know what the machined groove height/size needs to be)

I ♥ you

wantboost

iTrader: (2)

Very clean bay and a very well executed setup. Glad to see you decided to combat some of the heat energy lost by that topmount by using a turbo blanket and wrapping the downpipe... have you considered wrapping or coating the manifold? You'd see an even better gain in power under the curve, not to mention general response improvement (both in initial spool up and recovery between shifts, as well as part throttle boost response)

Also nice to see someone still using the SC61, it was definitely a nice unit when it was first developed and released and can still compete with today's similarly sized turbos. What sort of power are you aiming for, the only thing I see is if you're looking to get near the flow limit of the comp wheel then the E cover might hold you back a bit.


I am curious about this as well, as I was debating getting an AEM EPM to go coil on plug.

How do you like it so far? I was going to do the CBR coils but Okada makes some good ignition products, I've had a lot of experience with them on FormulaD Pro driver cars and they all say thay they love them, not to mention the fact they produce a much stronger, cleaner spark... I would really like to use their products for this build but I don't have much info on how they perform on a Honda platform.

I always thought the K series coils were too long to fit a B head, guess I was wrong lol.

What plugs are you running with the Okada K20 coils and the EPM?
I totally agree with this statement

aleEvo

wantboost
hoped only that it is possible to use oversized valves with gsc t1
power as I would love to be around 600hp at the crank (but with better power band possible)
epm seems to work well
Only problem I encountered was this (not my photo)

it was enough to put some thread locker (loctite)(my photo)

as I said I used aem coil (much like cbr coil) and aem twin fire
but burned two twinfire
so decided to upgrade to k20
I tried before with tired k20 coil (over 100,000 miles)
Now with okada coil k20
I have to say that much smoother engine
until now I was using ngk plug bkr9eix (lately gapped 0.6mm)
but would like to try a set ngkr r7434-9 (which I've already here with me)

Gunmetal_B20_Hatch

iTrader: (9)

Good info here guys... Ive been debating the same cam choice for my upcoming 6262 "street car" build.

wantboost

iTrader: (2)

Also, in regards to upgrading your intake manifold, wait.

The S2Ultra manifold is still too new and they still have issues

a lot of the high hp users on here swapped over (one 3.5l plenum, one 4.5 plenum) both said the car had drivability issues, as they aren't designed for stock bore/design throttle bodies (you need an adapter plate) they are designed for a 90mm (mustang style IIRC) throttle body and a few people have complained about drivability with the manifold/large tb combo.

Some also saw no real gains in power, some even saw losses across the rpm range (of course these setups were all tuned for the new manifold) and from what I've gathered, most aren't happy with it.

For the power levels that turbo will support, the victor x is more than enough, not to mention it's tried and true. Of course the shorter runners and large plenum are designed for high rpm horsepower production... at the sacrifice of some mid-range power and a good bit of mid-range torque. You could even try the Skunk2 Pro series manifold, which has longer runners and a smaller plenum. This would help you make good mid-range rpm hp and torque (and lots of it) while still making great top end power.

It won't make as much top end as the victor x but the gains in the midrange more than make up for it. Pair it with a 70mm or larger TB and port the manifold inlet to fit the bigger tb and top end won't fall off as bad

TheShodan

iTrader: (14)

He's looking at the STREET version, not the Ultra RACE.. That would give a LOT better midrange results than even the Pro Series manifold. Even for a turbocharger application like this.

As for "respect", remember, I'm in the Motor City.. Official home of the muscle car. These cams work well enough to gain their interest if not just respect, as even those that normally use GSC (Evolutions, DSMs, and most of all Supras, in which about 3/4 of the ones in the U.S use GSC) like what they've done with the Honda B-series powerplant..

That Z06 is nice and clean sounding, though considered subtle around here. Remember. Katech is right in S.E. Michigan, you're lucky to be able to work with them on this, as they are typically considered as a company for the elitists around here. But its clean indeed.

TheShodan

iTrader: (14)

You'd have to clay for that if its the Ferrea series. I find that at most only use a +1mm intake and leave the exhaust stock. Going oversized on the valves isn't necessary for what you're trying to do here. If don't have them yet, then don't do it.

Check with Muckman for his particular build on the use of oversized valves on GSC T1s.

@wantboost... Been busy with some endeavors. you'll see the results in January, hopefully.

wantboost

iTrader: (2)

second link is our z06 (is that what you're talking about) we did a lot of R&D with Katech for parts development on the C6 Z06/LS7 platform, as well as Pfadt, Kooks, American Racing Headers, Corsa Exhausts, Magnaflow, Akrapovic, Halltech, Dewitts Radiators, Lingenfelter, Aviaid (OEM drysump add on oil tank baffle and oil pan pickup trap
with doors and windage tray), MGW shifters, Sparco, Competition Brakes (brake cooling ducts) K&N, Brembo, Disc Brakes Australia, Goodridge, FAST (102mm LSX intake manifold, Dual wideband), NW (billet 102mm DBW throttle body, prototype testing and production run testing), RPM Transmissions, HPTuners, APR (carbon front race splitter with carbon brake ducts, carbon race rear wing w/ add-on wing lip), SKF, Seibon, Caravaggio, Brey Krause, HRE, CCW, Go Pro, Diamond Racing (test design 11:1 forged pistons designed to fit stock Titanium Rods, Comp Cams, Michelin (feedback on the new at the time Pilot Sport Cup), Hoosier (feedback on their new, corvette size specific R6 full slick and compound), Eibach/Callaway (coilovers and other things), Hypercoil, etc. the list goes on lor a while lol as we were the first people willing to take a new car apart multiple times, plus we do our own tuning and have free access to a dyno, so all of the companies loved that. It's been a test mule for sure but now that we've done all of the R&D and the various parts combos we've figured out what works and what doesn't

And that is just the list of companies we've done real world testing for, such as ease of install, fit/finish, overall quality, performance, etc.

The modification list is so long I think HT might actually break the post up at least 4 times lol. But even with taking the car apart so many times I still love the damn thing.

So Mac, you can see, I've been dealing with a lot of aftermarket industry heavyweights (going to SEMA pays off so much hehe) and after seeing what they do and how they do it, I have mad mad mad respect for GSC and how they've designed their products

Andy Pilgrim even said this was the fastest, biggest torque monster, biggest linear and lateral grip, most well setup Z06 he's ever driven that wasn't built by a full blown race shop (and is still street legal )... Which for me meant validation for all of the hours , sweat, tears, and blood I gave that car. I didn't get to go to track attack this year because I was going to try and swing by your way with the car... There's always next year

I understand the respect thing... again not bragging but given my experience with various platforms and teams over the years, I'm even impressed at what GSC has pulled off across it's entire product lineup. What I like even more is they did all of the initial R&D, setup, parts development on their own dime, and they didn't skimp in any department... I was most impressed by them using the proper blanks and not some cheaper, sub par blank, or even welding and doing regrinds (granted there is nothing wrong with a regrind, they serve their purpose very well but they do have limits and that is where the billet blank enters the picture)

Mac, I have a link I'll PM with some overall shots of the car... they aren't up to date.. as many things have changed but it gives you an overall look of the car in street trim and a brief (again, out of date, dad is too busy and he won't let me have FTP access to the site) parts list. Also if you look at the 2nd youtube link to our youtube channel you can find videos of Andy Pilgrim driving the car (2 in car from the harness bar, one down low on the front bumper) We have one looking either way mounted above and below the rear wing, long movie but the angle produced epic shots. I'll see if I can email it to you if you're curious

I wish like hell he would consider doing a "response/road course" turbo setup because I feel you would love working on this thing and every aspect of the car has been fortified to handle as much power as possible... but with it already making 600+rwhp and 580-690lbft of torque (before 4,000rpm :D ) it still spins on the Hoosier R6 slicks (14" rear tire) and we have to leave it in 3rd regardless of how slow corner exit speed is because in 1st/2nd it's nothing but an expensive smoke show... in 3rd it makes so much torque down low it will still push you in your seat at 2500rpm... Even Andy Pilgrim (Former Corvette Factory C6R driver, left that in 04 and now GM/Cadillac's CTS-V/R (CTS-V converted to NA for class rules) factory driver for the SPEED World Challenge Series) said he had to leave it in 3rd in slow turns because the car just makes so much torque down low (when a GM factory driver says a race car makes too much torque, that just makes me LOL)


Sorry for the off topic... sometimes it just flows from mind to keyboard

TheShodan

iTrader: (14)

Hehe.. I gotcha.. look forward to the PM. I didn't say I didn't like Katech.. (Tom Payne himself was one of the chief engineers there after he closed PayneTech), I'm just saying locally, some look at them as elitist because of ALL the R&D and testing they do for each customer's car be it big build or small upgrade.. but that R&D does cost.. SEMA is a great hand shake platform..

back to topic.

wantboost

iTrader: (2)

I hope the OP is reading the main GSC cam thread so he understands that while the cam gears say 0,0 that the cams themselves are installed at different timing positions... So he would then use adjustable cam gears to adjust the timing marks on the gear so he can properly time and install the timing belt.

Also, 1mm OS valves on both intake and exhaust present a problem with most low compression pistons, as the valve reliefs simply aren't deep enough. This is why a lot of the guys using these cams are running fairly high compression (10:1 - 13.5:1 static CR) pistons... the NA pistons have much larger and deeper valve reliefs due to how close the dome is to the combustion chamber. They also factor in that most people using pistons like that will no doubt have big lift cams and oversized valves as well...

Keep in mind that most NA pistons are designed to shave as much weight off of the piston as possible, using methods such as thinner dome material, as well as using a smaller ringland (the distance between the outside top of the piston and where the first ring groove is) as NA motors won't see such high cylinder pressures, EGTs, and load on the piston so they can get away with making the material cross-section at the dome thinner...

This is not good on a boosted motor, as the very high cylinder pressures, high EGTS, and a greater chance for knock/pre-ignition/detonation. This means that the piston has a higher chance of deforming, breaking a ringland, or melting/blowing a hole through the piston... they also utilize thinner piston skirts/large area of skirt removed, this is to decrease the amount of piston that has an oil barrier between it and the cylinder wall... decreasing drag on the rotating assembly, also these skirts are normally coated with a dry film to further reduce friction...and they use very thin walled, non tapered piston pins, again to save weight.

Muckman found this out the hard way. He used a "shelf" high compression piston designed for NA use and the thin, lightweight piston pins bent on the dyno around 500whp IIRC, all 4 were bent. He had a custom NA "profile" piston made, same identical dome and compression ratio as the NA shelf piston but a different piston alloy, thicker dome material, bigger and deeper valve reliefs, minimal amount of piston skirt removed to help support the piston, keep it stable on it's stroke and reduce the amount of piston "rock" at top dead center

OP, you would have to clay the motor, one cam at a time, through the cams various range of timing (retarded, advanced) to see what cam setting will give you the proper safe amount of piston to valve clearance... IIRC Calidad had 1mm OS valves all the way around and he ended up having to go down to .5mm OS instead, just to be able to run the cams.

Keep in mind that if the head and/or the deck of the block have been milled then that will have a major impact on clearances.

Calidad and a few others (check Calidads thread and then read through the GSC cam thread to see what I'm talking about) did some excel/data sheets showing individual data for each cam...

The sheets showed the timing of the cam at the top column... retarded, zeroed out, and advanced. Then it showed the degrees the cam had rotated/valve lift (left column) at each degree point, and the sheet was then populated with piston to valve clearance for each data point.. This data showed which settings won't work at all, have minimal clearance (bad idea, given how the rotating assembly will stretch) and then the cam settings that allowed for proper clearances.

These are not a "drop in" cam and it takes a fair bit of knowledge to get it right

and you don't really need bigger valves.. An old hotrod trick was to machine the valve seats for .5mm bigger valves but run the stock valve... It will still seat and seal with no issue and actually flow more than a bigger valve... because with a bigger valve you still have the large area of the face of the valve preventing air flow. A stock sized valve in .5mm bigger seats means you'll have more airflow since there isn't any valve in the way to hinder airflow.