hondatuner020

iTrader: (1)

So i had my car tuned yesterday (stock b18c-r with ramhorn & stc Hunter) and it put down 380hp (7psi spring creeping to 11) on a dynapac and all was well till right before we took it off the dyno i noticed my coolant overflow bottle was full. I emptied it out to the full mark and drove home (2 hrs) towards the end of the trip i did some 4th gear pulls and then got off the highway. My temps started to climb as i sat at a gas station and my check light ( coolant at 230 degrees) came on. Again i noticed the overflow was full. I emptied it to full and drove home around 215-220 degrees. 4 hours later after the car cooled i opened the radiator and was able to fill it with a little less than a liter of coolant. re bled the system and it warmed up and sat at 195. I took it out and did 2 pulls in 3rd and 4th and the temps started to rise to about 206 and i returned home before it went up any more. the overflow had risen about 1.5 inches above the max line. (4/26 UPDATE): the following night i checked the overflow and the overflow bottle went from 1.5 inches above the max to 1 inch below the max line after sitting for a day

im currently running a new skunk2 half radiator and cap and have have heard this can be cap related, but also read alot that if you are overflowing the tank and having cooling issues its the headgasket. I was told i can do a leakdown test to see if the gasket is bad (if while preforming the test i see bubbles coming out the radiator neck then the gasket is bad) Im wondering if due to the power level the stock head bolts stretch causing some head lift under full boost. Car still feels fast and has clean oil and coolant with no mixing or smoking out the exhaust. Any thoughts or opinions?

2kdrift

Sounds almost exactly what happend to me, MAde a thread on it couple days ago(I get air bubbles in my rad tho) Similar setup, similar power level, I use ARP headbolts tho they are always recomended

Definetly do a leakdown test, if you replace the gasket put some ARP headbolts in there every turbo build should have them

the skunk2 comes with a 1.1 bar cap, meaning anything over 1.1 bar is bled to the reservoir however you shouldn't be reaching those pressure levels under normal conditions unless you just have a bad cap and its not holding the correct pressure

TheShodan

iTrader: (14)

It's hard to determine when studs are needed, as in some cases, there could have been a hot spot in the gasket itself. Studs won't solve that problem.

I would just change the gasket, resurface the head, and put the studs there at that time only. Don't put them in one at a time.

2kdrift

Agreed I think you misunderstood my statement

TheShodan

iTrader: (14)

No. I don't think so.. You just weren't detail oriented in your summation, that's all. It's something that isn't always necessary, and should be taken on a case-by-case basis for these builds.


Don't worry about it. . All is well with the Force.

hondatuner020

iTrader: (1)

Update i just checked the coolant over flow bottle (roughly 30 hrs since last drive) and the level is now 1 inch BELOW the max line


My friend had an idea about my coolant flow being an issue he sees my coolant flow as follows



I was under the impression this was how it would flow

TheShodan

iTrader: (14)

The coolant in the turbo is contained in a water jacket, And only goes through the coolant flow process during shut down via the siphoning effect from the heat transfer from the turbine housing to the CHRA.

As long as the coolant comes from 2 different locations, the flow direction (at the turbo, anyway ) is not add relevant

hondatuner020

iTrader: (1)

ok any thought on this?

I just checked the coolant over flow bottle (roughly 30 hrs since last drive) and the level is now 1 inch BELOW the max line so it appears coolant is flowing back and forth? does this indicate more towards a bad cap not holding pressure and the tank to fill up or still a headgasket? Also i read that a bad headgasket will bubble the overflow from the air being pushed into the system. i did not see any bubbles or bubbling. My tuner is still dosnt think its the gasket as he said he didnt see any of the signs of a bad gasket while tuning that he has encountered countless times when people have bad gaskets and he is tuning.

LightningTeg

Probably the rad cap. Cheapest and easiest thing there if you're not going to do a leakdown.

Make sure your heater lever is on hot so the air in the heater core doesnt get trapped.

hondatuner020

iTrader: (1)

checked the cap and it had some small gravel pieces around the seal. Im wondering if it fell over on my driveway while i was putting the car together. the rubber seal looks pitted from the pieces.



I cleaned out the radiator neck of all the pieces and put on a new oem style cap i got at autozone while picking up a block tester. Im going to do the test tomorrow to see if im getting exhaust gasses into the coolant.

TheShodan

iTrader: (14)

I would tend to agree with Jeff Evans, and there isn't a bad head gasket, but more likely (if anything) a bad radiator cap, and that's all. Many overflow bottles will fill and empty due to changes in pressurization. That's rather normal. But you shouldn't be losing a A LOT out of the bottle and filling A LOT in a short period of time. An Inch off of the "max" area isn't bad.

I just don't want you to start panicking seeing ghosts when there are none. The more you describe, the less likely your symptoms indicate a bad headgasket.

I would also think that keeping standard "autozone" cap is not going to help the situation with a turbo car that sees extreme changes in engine cylinder temperatures and therefore, can't keep up with the pressurization changes that at least a 1.1bar could. (OEM is like .8BAR)

hondatuner020

iTrader: (1)

It was just a temporary fast solution to change the cap, its a .9 bar cap the skunk 2 was 1.1 bar. I plan to order a new reputable aftermarket cap after this sorted out. My thought was for 6 dollars if the skunk2 isnt sealing or has an issue any properly sealing and functioning radiator cap should improve the situation.

Today i will warm the car up and bleed the system again and the perform the block test. If it comes back negative ill go for a ride with new cap and see how it does. So i should have some good information tonight.

hondatuner020

iTrader: (1)

Update - Sometimes i think this project wants to really test my patience.

So i went to perform my test last night and the car didnt want to start, fuel pump prime was weak and the car wouldnt crank. Odd being the car has a brand new optima yellow top and has been starting strong since being installed. got my jump box ( which was also nearly dead, always when you need it right) and the car struggled to a start. warmed it up and boosted it 3 or 4 back to back pulls in 3-4th to about 197 temp and parked it at idle. performed the block test on the over flow bottle which had raised and got a negative result indicating NO leak. The temps also dropped to 190 after 5 min at idle.

im going to do the block test again off the radiator neck just to be sure but first i need to figure out this electrical issue. it was giving me multiple issues of no crank, then strong crank and no spark to then a weak cranking actual start. All this with weird power dips from turning the lights on once the car is running (radar detector would reboot - 12v constant cig lighter power source). The alarm randomly going off hile trying to start it etc... so many odd issues at once. After i recharge the battery i have to check the alternator and electrical wiring. The symptoms are so inconsistent and i need to first check the how a fully charged battery changes the situation and then how the alternator is performing to start.

Ill update after the weekend

LightningTeg

Sounds like bad grounds. Make sure you tightened them all (transmission, ecu ground by tstat etc).

Also check the parasitic draw when the car is off. Should be less then 0.01 amps IIRC

hondatuner020

iTrader: (1)

Re did all the grounds, checked the whole electrical system with a multimeter and all systems are performing well. The random no start is fixed. As far as the cooling goes i just installed my new 1800 cfm fan, but am still waiting on my 1.3 bar radiator cap and fan relay kit to properly power this fan.

hondatuner020

iTrader: (1)

It would appear my cooling and electrical issues were related.

After installing the new mishimoto 1800 cfm fan i noticed my idle go bad and the voltage making it to the battery would drop after the fan had been running for 2-3 min. It got down to 9 volts and wanted to stall. i have replaced the alternator with a Reman unit from Denso (strong 14.3 volts with fan running at idle now), replaced the rad cap with 1.3 bar spoon unit and bled the system with the special radiator cap funnel.

i believe a bad sealing cap matched with a weak small fan getting low voltage and amperage created my cooling / overheating issue. I took it out for a rip and all the temperatures rose and fell as expected. Hopefully my issue has been solved.

Esser

Thanks for this!! It's simple, but helps a lot when you're thinking things out lol

Turbo-LS

iTrader: (4)

First question that should always be asked. Oem thermostat or aftermarket garbage? Second did you block off any coolant flow or the hoses that loop to the bsck and side of the head? If no AC in the car do you have the side blocked off next to the radiator to direct airflow to the radiator. Best fan I the world won't keep an engine cool if the setup is wrong. Coolant will go back and forth to the overflow bottle. Keep it half way full and see what happens. Bleed the shot out of it and a simple inexpensive head gasket test is the test strips you put in your coolant will tell You if there is combustion gases entering the cooling system

IN my educated opinion as I have many dealings with overheating issues it's usually **** parts, failing parts, airbound, blocked off coolant flow and blocked off airflow. Then maybe head gasket issues. If you lifted the head the gasket is junk and will also cause this problem. IMO 300+ needs head studs.

hondatuner020

iTrader: (1)

Currently the car has had a new oem honda thermostat installed, mishimoto 1800cfm fan with direct power wiring. new spoon 1.3 bar rad cap. I bled the system with radiator bleeding funnel for 3 hours.

After bleeding the system for 3 hours the car still produces some bubbles, this is with the car on an incline ensuring the radiator cap is the highest point.

The car cruises on the highway way at 203-205 in 75-85 degree weather, once off the highway the car cools to 189-192 with the fan on but wont drop lower that 187-189 even with 5-10 min of idle time with the fan on.

Currently the coolant overflow has been doing this forcing me to re fill the radiator with the un returned coolant after a few days and re bleed the system.

TheShodan

iTrader: (14)

Have you tried another radiator at this point? I think that's next. Not for leaks, but for efficiency purposes

hondatuner020

iTrader: (1)

what would you recommend? the skunk2 i have is a dual core half rad for the crx.

TheShodan

iTrader: (14)

I misread.. skunk2 rad with mishimoto fans.. I got it. I can only recommend the Koyo 1570R.

hondatuner020

iTrader: (1)

Im going to perform another block test on it tonight to check for combustion vapors.

duugle

iTrader: (2)

I had a similar problem, my head would lift under boost and push boost into the water jackets. I could drive around all day out of boost without a problem, but as soon as I did a few pulls under boost the temps would creep up to ~210 and the overflow tank would fill up. The car wouldn't stay under 200 after that until I waited until it completely cooled down then it was fine again. Driving around out of boost the car was ~189-195 without any issue.

I replaced the headgasket and replaced my ARP head studs (they had been torqued 4-5 times at that point) and I have not had a problem since. It did not display the normal blown headgasket issues (milky oil, etc) but eventually I started to see headgasket coating material in the radiator and overflow tank.

hondatuner020

iTrader: (1)

The left over coolant from bleeding has a black film to it and there are tiny black particles that got burped up from bleeding