eg9_fann

iv been researching as much as i can.I hate it when i dont undertstand something

im planning on boosting my b16a. i wanna run around 280bhp safely.I know (or iv read!) the stock internals can take it but i think id rather be safe than sorry so iv been checking out the cost of a build.

my options were to either just get lower compression pistons/rods etc etc...BUT if lower compression is better for boost, then what stops me from going as low as i can on compression?...but i dont wanna do a half build and then something else goes wrong!..so.....my.....

second choice was just buy a crower stroker kit...with the stronger balanced crankshaft too.

*standard b16a internals figures

# Displacement: 1,595 cc (97.3 cu in) 1.6 liter
# Compression: 10.2:1
# Bore: 81.0 mm (3.2 in) ok for me to have the bore at 83mm?
# Stroke: 77.4mm crower stroke to 84.5? (i like the way the b16a revs quick, does stroking more make a difference on this and why cant i just leave the stroke as it is or does it have to be adjusted with the bore?
# Rod Length: 134mm what rod length would I be using?
# Rod/stroke ratio: 1.745 what does this number mean?

now this is where im confused....i could bore out my engine (im not too fussed about boring for bigger displacement BUT does more of a bore mean a slightly weaker cylinder?..

if i bore my engine to lets say from stock 81 to 83, then i have to get 83mm pistons right?

how does stroke match upto to boring/size of pistons..a longer stroke gives better displacement but whats the limit with this?....does the stroke have to match the bore size like if i have too long of a stroke the pistons can hit the head? what numbers would be suitable for stroke for me to keep my engine safest?

generaly speaking do pistons come in different sizes to match the bores with the same compressions rates for all size of piston? (coz id be going for lowest possible compression?)

instead of boring the engine are sleeves a better option? (for a reliable/stronger engine at high levels of boost, lets say 350-400hp)

OR just a block guard?..if i get a block guard, lets say 3mm, do I have to knock off 3mm of the stroke so the pistons dont come up too much hitting the head?

ima total amataure when it comes to engine internals and iv been reseraching day and night over the last few days..iv learnt what i can but need some 1 who knows what there talking about to explain a few things that iv asked about....

im not gonna bother with any other engines/ or LS VTEC or anything like that..im set on the b16a as i already have it etc etc.

the cars more of a street car than a race car but i hit the 8,200 rev limit alot so a safe engine is the best engine for me.

TimKennard

too low of compression is not fun to drive, you lose responsiveness.

there are a lot of stock b16's making 300+. mine did not make it off the dyno stock.

with stock sleeves, 81.5mm is about it as far as bore. otherwise send the block off to be sleeved. and yes, if bore is 81mm buy 81mm pistons, 81.5 then buy 81.5.

block guards aren't worth it in my opinion

sounds like you need to buy a couple books before getting into this any further. or at least do a lot of reading on the forums first.

where do you live? i would find a good local shop to help you out if you are in doubt.

take a look at these books:

http://www.amazon.com/How-Rebuild-Ho...ref=pd_sim_b_1

http://www.amazon.com/Performance-Ho...ref=pd_sim_b_2

http://www.amazon.com/High-Performan...ref=pd_sim_b_4

that is how i got started. good luck.

lyncoors

yeah alittle research and your golden. the tune is most important

eg9_fann

im from the uk..im doing so much reading my eyes r hurting! lol....jst reading up on darton sleeves...and this tech article about crower stroker kits

http://www.turbomagazine.com/tech/tu..._kit/vtec.html

crower has a billet steel crank that they can stroke to any spec...i think same spec as factory would be good for me...then have the same spec rod lengths/rod stroke etc etc so its the same engine, maybe a slightly different bore but a solid build.i like the b16a engine as it is....driving around 3-4k revs + is always fun....bottom end torque i aint fussed about....i can wait till 3-4k rmp to whoop some ***...lol.

the only reason i dont want to bore is it weakens the cylinder walls and tht defies the whole purpose of my goal but then if i bore it out abit....n run lower compression pistons i wont have to worry about detonation and a broken cylinder wall from boosting will i?

eg9_fann

thanks for the book links by the way il be on them soon enough!

if i skip the crower stroker kit n opt just for the lower compression pistons/rods etc etc...will my stock crank be able to handle upto 350hp?

if it can i still run the risk of breaking the cylinder wall from too much boost pressure don't i? so a sleeved block is a MUST but can i have it sleeved and then bored out to 1.8/1.9, that would be around 86mm (and i knw some 1 said 83 is the max for safety but i'm talking about after getting it sleeved?) because the bigger displacement will be useful for torque at higher hp's? (but keep the same stroke ratios for high revving)

theirs no way id ever plan on running more than 350hp...but i dont want to risk breaking the crank, or cracking the cylinder wall.

TimKennard

your stock crank is better than the crower crank. alot of people agree with that. lots of people run 800+ hp on stock honda cranks.

if you sleeve, you can go 85mm safely i think. personally i'd go 84mm with room to bore out later if needed. also, if you sleeve it, the cylinder walls are probably one of the last things to worry about letting go. dudes are running 50+ psi of boost on sleeved built blocks!

keep reading man, you'll get it figured out. you will also probably change your mind about the b16 bottom end if you want any low end torque. ;-) my b16 doesn't really come alive until 5-6000 rpm. definitely build up the b16 head though! it can go on any b-series block.

personally would not do the crower stroker kit. i would sleeve block, pistons, rods, cams, valves, springs, retainers, a good quality turbo kit, and find a GOOD tuner. tuning is key to keep these blow torches together. :-)

eg9_fann

thanks for the book links by the way il be on them soon enough!

if i skip the crower stroker kit n opt just for the lower compression pistons/rods etc etc...will my stock crank be able to handle upto 350hp?

if it can i still run the risk of breaking the cylinder wall from too much boost pressure don't i? so a sleeved block is a MUST but can i have it sleeved and then bored out to 1.8/1.9, that would be around 86mm (and i knw some 1 said 83 is the max for safety but i'm talking about after getting it sleeved?) because the bigger displacement will be useful for torque at higher hp's? (but keep the same stroke ratios for high revving)

theirs no way id ever plan on running more than 350hp...but i dont want to risk breaking the crank, or cracking the cylinder wall.

eg9_fann

the only reason i was considering the crower kit was because of the crank...thought id rather be safe than sorry and as a package its a good deal...but your right, a bottom end build with out the crank should be ok, as for a headjob not too fussed with that as its not that complicated

i just wrote a reply (but it deleted somehow) about the b18c1 engines and that i dont like the way they rev due to there crank strokes....so there out the question for me....the b16 feels racey lika motorbike coz of its low stroke ratio and thats what i like.

so a b18c1z out the question....a b18c spec r on the other hand...lol well if i had that i wouldn't even bother with a turbo.

i may have a cheap k20a available to me in the near future..for like 500pounds, around 300dollars....but fitting that all in all would be around 2000pounds and then i thought what if im not happy with the power il have to spend even more money fine tuning it to extract more power so that option isnt really sticking with me either....i know a k20a is a desirable swap for a EG but thats all it is....id be happy with a nice b16 turbo sat in under my hood giving put good reliable power than a k20a thats costing me just to have it in there then costing even more tuning it up....lol

eg9_fann

its all about $$$$$,the more you have...the more of a better swap you can have..personally...a turbo'd b16 for me is perfect.u wanna quicker times on the strips then u have to put more money into your car...if i had enough money id opt for a forged 500bhp supercharged k20 in my EG9.they have them engines for sale properly built and tuned buts it all about money....

im planning on running around 300hp on my civic...if the cars on the street get any faster then il just sell whatever set up i have, work hard for a few months...save up a few thousand pounds and get 1 of them 500+ bhp k20a race engines built for an EP3 and take it from there.....lol....i love my EG and i think a few thousand spent on it to make it tht extra bit faster to compete with some of the newer cars is only fair....it has engineering in it that is almost 20 years old and for driving around town like the way it does it takes the **** out of some of the newer turbo cars that are around,lol....the turbo and extra 100hp or so will just make it FAIR GAME!

eg9_fann

also TIMMYDOG,what set up are you running?....and what do you think of edelbrock performer X? will the t28 be running outta steam after 6k revs?

TimKennard

keep reading man, the b18c1 and the b18c spec r are the same block. not trying to be an *** at all. just saying you will find your goals are within reach with a lot less cash than you thought.

i made 300 hp on a b16 w/ a 60 trim garret, log manifold, piston/rods/springs/retainers, and stock sleeves and 15 psi of boost. its been a year of constant abuse at the drag strip, prob 100 or more passes. changed turbos this year and am shooting for 400 hp. not touching the block or head.

TimKennard

performer x is not that popular. the victor x or the skunk2 pro is what most use. i bought a skunk2 recently. not results yet, just got my turbo today.

i'm not the guy for turbo advise. i don't know much about the t28. i had good luck with the garret 60 trim .63 exhaust stage iii wheel. switched to a precision sc6262sp this year.

eg9_fann

b18c1 and spec r are different...spec r is rated at higher hp and has slightly better internals...you can check wikipedia.

TimKennard

dude, the blocks are the same. the pistons may be different, but everything else is the same.

Schister66

Ok wow...i haven't read this novel of a thread, but i'll give you my 2 cents

You can make the power you want on the stock sleeves for sure...even on the stock block. If you're only hoping for 280-350whp, there is NO need to sleeve and very few reasons to build. All you really need is a good condition stock block, a quality turbo setup and a good tune. There is no need to confuse yourself and spend more money on trivial things.

Stock GSR + 57 trim + good tune + 3bar MAP = 350whp all day every day

eg9_fann

so whats a b18 GSR?...an integra type r has a b18c..or b18c5...these 2 engines make more power...yes the blocks are the same but the spec R's have a few little differences..you cant say that the normal 1.8 DOHC VTEC's are the same as the 1.8 DOHC TYPE R.

and yes after some more research iv learn its all about the tuning.....i read an article about tuners making 500hp on a stock engine but changing just the pistons to lower compression, everything else was the same rods etc etc...


your right TUNING is the key.and i dont think il have to be spending my money on a built engine apart from some new pistons.il be putting more money towards the tuning.(after a compression check test and hopefully my engine is ok i have been running it slightly low on oil a few times and revving past 9k coz it came with no rev limiter.....lol.)

i think edelbrock performer X as a starter kit for me would be ok.i hoping i can run this with an EMS because they have the pre-tuned maps for there turbo system?

then later when i decide to upgrade il go for a bigger turbo and an hondata s300

rs250nut

Im in a similar boat, I just got a b16a1 for $75 which I was pretty chuffed with.

efnitup4life

Thankx for the info....