deadhero15

hi guys,

ive been trying to figure out my problem with leaking oil on my turbo center housings. turbo was rebuilt twice because of the leaking oil issue / and smoking hot side.center housing. compressor side is clean. and bare with me on this post i just back into honda scene after 10 years. center housing replaced by the rebuilder i dont know why he didnt rebuild the orignal housing. new turbine and seals.

is it normal to have small amount air blowby return oil line by the oil pan at IDLE?




Turbo is garrett 60+ trim t3/t4 Journal bearing. oil feed -3an and return line is -10an

engine is typical forged rod and piston and with built head. around 20,000 kms on the motor. it has ITR oil pump and at cold start i have 90+ psi and driving around it goes around 60-70 psi and more than 65-70+ psi at boost. Im thinking maybe i should put a .060 oil restrictor. too much crankcase pressure?

*turbo redone twice
*already fix the return oil line 3 times and still leaks same area
*has 2 -10an line valve cover vents
*changed oil twice already 5w30 synthetic


next on my list im doing a leak down test. i hope its not major. just wanna see any other ideas from you guys.

TheShodan

iTrader: (14)

Depending upon damage, sometimes its easier and (less expensive for you) to replace the entire CHRA vs. rebuilding the original.

This looks like oil pressurization backup. Not turbine sealing piston ring. I know you may have redone the return line a few times, but that doesn't mean it was done to stop the oil back up. If the CHRA is not as vertical as possible, and is over 15 degrees off of vertical, it's going to cause an oil backup. So more photos are needed to confirm.

Oil "blowby" from crankcase pressure would be from lack of crankcase ventilation, but symptoms are found in the compressor cover. So if the compressor side is perfectly fine, then there's no need to think that your ventilation in the crankcase is bad. So, go ahead and cross that off.

Also, check the feed line, to see if it is has the proper oil pressure and regulation. (You didn't state your engine type , oil pump type [mechanical vs. electric] , or your oil pressure at the oil feed line.) Photos of the feed line and other situations have to be shown first.

deadhero15

thnks for the reply.

here the pics of the return line. yes the CHRA is vertical 90°

Oil pump is mechanical and motor is LSvtec

TheShodan

iTrader: (14)

Use the IMAGE link (w/ the [IMG]{IMG} on both sides.)

deadhero15

sorry thats only pics i have. right now. as you can see its has lil bit of slope.


also is it normal to have air blowby at the oil drain. i took out the hose and theres air blowing out while on idle?

deadhero15

LSVTEC / oil mechanical ITR oil pump. i know im getting 65-70psi on my Oil Press. Gauge. at full boost and cold start.

TheShodan

iTrader: (14)

Well. Honestly, I'm ruling out that the turbo is bad, especially considering that there is a new CHRA being used after several rebuilds, which rules out worn journal bearings or actually bad oil piston sealing rings, or oil coking on the turbine shaft from constant hot shut-downs.
(IMHO, you probably didn't need it rebuilt the 1st time... Many users tend to believe that oil sealing rings are rings that are not unlike grommets; they're actually dynamic sealing rings that work like your piston rings. They only really keep oil from leaving the CHRA under oil splay at times of pressurization, such as when the turbine is rotating. It's also common to automatically assume that oil leakage is based upon bad oil sealing rings.) So, this really rules out the turbocharger

So, that leaves a couple of areas, that you have to investigate because we can't. I think i

A) Oil Drain Line
Oil Feed / Drain line Restriction I know we addressed the routing of the line, but if the oil drain lines are old or are not made of good quality, the nylon inside the braided line could be kinked or restricted in some way to where it can't be seen from the braided line and is causing a restriction somewhere. Even metal babbit or some oil debris could be in the oil return line itself, causing a restriction. You may have changed the oil several times, but that doesn't mean that you've flushed the oil system, and cleaned the oil feed and return lines themselves.

I recommend that you 1st use a .060" restrictor FITTING (not a flange plate with a hole on the bottom) first and foremost. That will solve a lot of your issue right there. But while you're doing that, (Only if the oil feed line is old,) flush it and visually clean it out.

Oil Drain Location / over-filled pan - You may have tapped into part of the oil pan (I can see it is more to the upper right of the oil pan a bit more than what most oil drain taps are for B-series, and you may have it tapped below the full line level of the oil pan, causing an oil drain backup. No different than having an overfilled crankcase , the oil draining back into the pan may be causing some crankcase issues to where it may be backing up the oil return line itself.

B) Crankcase Ventilation
As popular as venting crankcase pressure via the valve cover seems optimal, in most cases, it's not enough, without the rest of the crankcase ventilation being inline with the valve cover; meaning, valve cover vents alone don't ventilate enough crankcase pressure. I can't assume that your catch can setup is bad or good, because this is happening at idle and not under engine load.

The fact that this is happening at high idle means that whether or not you had a full catch-can system installed or not, the amount of ventilation is minimal, and shouldn't be enough to cause this type of oil drain back-up issue.

C) Engine Blow-by
This is really caused by something being wrong with the engine's piston rings and not crankcase ventilation, or having an over-filled oil pan, even though they can show the same symptoms. If you're experience actually engine blow-by (as you stated, a leakdown test of the engine is best), then that can easily cause the same oil back up issue, especially if at idle.


So, I recommend the following steps.
1. .060" oil feed restrictor fitting.
1a Clean and check oil feed line for any kinks/debris and flush it out completely or replace

2. Leakdown test - see if the piston rings in the engine are going. that can easily cause this backup.

3. Oil drain relocation. Oil fitting maybe sitting a little too low on the pan from the photo shown. A clearer photo could rule that out.
3a. Check / clean oil return line (if old and not new) for kinks / debris causing an oil back up. Flush / replace accordingly.

But I don't think it's the turbo at all in this case.

Hope this at least points you in the right direction.

deadhero15

all 10% leakdown. and good compression

TheShodan

iTrader: (14)

1 down, 2.5 more to go..Keep going.

deadhero15

put restrictor .060

still has small leaks abs smoke sometimes

TheShodan

iTrader: (14)

That's oil burn-off from what you already have. you're tackling this well. Keep going.

deadhero15

ill redo my oil pan return line and see if this is the problem.

TheShodan

iTrader: (14)

Clean it thoroughly before reinstallation

deadhero15

hey i just finished installing new oil pan and new fitting for the return line. looks like the leak is gone just very small left not like before theres a big leak everytime i drive my car.. but i think i damaged the turbo already. it smokes on a long idle after doing blip on the gas. a small puff of smoke comes out.


any ideas?

TheShodan

iTrader: (14)

Oil smoke? Sweet smelling white smoke? Specifics, please.

You won't know if its the turbo until you stop driving the car and remove it. Check for radial/axial shaft play, and look for burned oil in the turbine housing. Rebuilding means not just oil sealing rings, but journal bearings, thrust bearings and replacement collar plates. depending upon age and damage, you may be better off with a replacement CHRA.

You won't know until its removed.

deadhero15

its oil looks blue.

185psi all across compression

and all 9% -10% leakdown test

ive never drove car hard after all the test. just drove it to the car event. doesnt smoke when driving around. just idling and blip of gas puff smoke just small amount just enough to notice it.

TheShodan

iTrader: (14)

Ok. Time to take it off. Call it a wrap. Do it now, before it seizes...

Time to have it inspected and repaired by a facility.

LightningTeg

Sounds like you did everything right OP. I would agree turbo should be looked at at this point.