ivan93egreppin210

im ivan at JJ's Motorsports. we got bit by the h series bug and are putting out several h2b setups at IFO San Antonio.the build i need to discuss first is the hybrid setup. im doing a g23 using k20 type s pistons (4.25 cc x 30mm comp) and type s cams. i will be using an h22 head with f20b cams and euro r manifold. i have under 4 weeks to build, test and tune. this will be a 100% extra shop parts build including the ugliest riced out 96 coupe in San Antonio that we got at auction. parts around the shop include

f23 long block
f22bx long block
f20b crank,rods,pistons,cams valve train.
h23 long block(non vtec)
k20 type s pistons (2 sets)
h22 head,crank, pistons,
k24 injectors (soon to be modded)
and so much more that i cant think of right now. ill post picks of the parts and piece of crap coupe its going in tomorrow. lol

JJsMotorsports

iTrader: (1)

Bump for some feed back from people who have done this?

ESP.net

You seem like you have done your Homework. F23 rod width is shorter like you state then H22/H23. I haven't played with the K20 rods but how much work will it take to fit a H piston on it?

As far as H22 type S pistons if putting in H short must be OEM not cheaper knock off's or will have issues with FRM sleeves OEM H pistons have coating on skirt for the FRM. Mahle Gold Series only forged piston for FRM sleeves. If putting the H22 type s piston in F23 short knock off will work but your boring from 86-87mm and I believe on the F23 that is maxing it out.

I would probably spend a little more then Delta for a bigger cam it wanting the most...

ivan93egreppin210

hey bud thanks for taking the time to brainstorm with me. here's some more numbers to help you visualize this.


Rod widths
F23A - 19.81mm/.780
K20/24- 19.8mm (.780")
H22/ F20- 23.8mm (.938")

Crank Rod journal Diameters
K/H 48mm
F23A - 45mm

dam that sux. i was tired and didnt catch that last night. seems like the big end of the k20 rod is too big for the f23 crank . lol oh well a guy can dream. anyways that was just thinking out loud. this is the real setup im doing.

the bottom pic is an f20b intake against an h22. i also have the f23, f22b2 and an h23. still undecided on which is best intake manifold.

f23 crank and rods
k20 type s pistons +4.25 cc dome and 30mm comp ht 22mm floating wrist pin same as f23.
usdm h22 head with full f20b valve train along with f20b cams.

da59block

im gonna b doing the same build
got my h22 complete head
also got me a complete f23a1 long block

just need
a new H22 timing belt
new h22 arp head studs
h22 water pump
h22 gasket kit
and f23 bearings

and im on my way


if u can, show how u plug the head and the way u mod the water pump


hey r u going to remove the balance shaft
i heard u gotta put the k20 piston opposite or upside down it that correct

ivan93egreppin210

to be honest im doing this for the first time as well. i been following guys like PirateMcFred, Ghost, f20bjones. they are the ones that got me intrested in the g23 and h series all motor setups. with so many h/f series parts laying around, why not do a true junkyard build using old shop parts and just have some fun while trying to learn something new.

as for your question im not 100% on any of them. i was going to ask the same ones.lol are you using k20 pistons?

d112crzy

stick with stock f23 rods and use arp hardware. I'm sure Pirate can give you some help in that area.

d112crzy

What about an F20B rod? Sightly longer(4mm), which would call for some custom pistons, but they're high revving already and come stock with rod bolts.

Also, I'm not sure which K series rod you're using in your measurements, but the k20a3 has the same BE and journal as the f23. ACL lists them to have the same exact rod bearings. The length is 5.551(f23) vs 5.453(k20a3). With the h22 type s piston, it'd put you at 10.1:1.

tagperformance

what about using the f22 block and f22 crank f23 rods f20b pistons can yield 12.67:1 comp ratio.

d112crzy

F23/f20b rods won't fit on regular f/h cranks.

da59block

i am using k20 type s piston



your first time

check this out
http://www.importtuner.com/tech/impp...dge/index.html

that should give you an idea

post pics to help me out
you are a shop
and im just me lol

da59block

yea.. i havent started yet
im jus gathering all the stuff

f20b jones

You can not run any h22 piston not even a type s in a steal sleeved block will not work trust me ive tried it . Materials are not compatible just like you cant run a forged piston in a frm block . Call golden eagle if you dont beleive me and ask them . I got about 1,500 miles on each set before the pistons messing up. After three sets swqqpped to cp pistons no problems forn the last three years. Other then that you seem to have done your home work . If you can find a f20b block (I have three) it is alot easier to do these buids then the f23 block good luck.

yung_gsr210

cant wait to see this build run down the track bro

ivan93egreppin210

just to let everyone know. this guy is lending me his full f20b valve train and f20b cams. he is my sponsor.lol

yung_gsr210

jj"s built

hondasdohc

Im gona be doing a similar build but only with the f22a block. Build consist of f20b pistons and if i can i wanna use the rod bolts from the f20b to the f22 rods don't know if its possible but i will see. The setup is currently running and im using the f20b head it runs pretty hard right now but the block needs a rebuild the piston rings are shot and the block has 270,xxx miles on it thats why im trying the f20b pistons i have set.

ivan93egreppin210

you know that honda-tech member who inspired him. heres the thread.
https://honda-tech.com/forums/honda-prelude-4/f22b2-block-h22a1-head-f22-vtec-f22b-vtec-776837/

go under search and look up threads started by the members i listed above and you will learn alot.

kingofbattle909

iTrader: (6)

I bored my block out to 87mm and removed bs.
Im undecisive to use h22 pistons and custom cometic hg
or
buy a new block, have more fun removing bs and bearings again and using k20 type s keep the f23 head and go h2b...

Wdyt?

((sorry for thread jack))

ivan93egreppin210

first off thank you for chiming in. i was hoping you would. yes i am aware of the rod bolt situation. I've read post by you stating that if you got the piston weight down, the force on the pistons at higher rpm would be equal to the forces at stock f23 red line putting less strain on the rod bolt. am i correct and if so could i have my machine shop remove material from a stock k20 piston?

ivan93egreppin210

one thing i noticed is using the f head bumps up CR in these setup by alot. oh dam i just had an idea. f22a head/f23 shortblock with k20 slugs and that gives you 12.34 CR and a 0.000 piston to deck height. all i would need is a cam. i can have a stock cam welded and grinded for 150$ at Delta. keep in mind that this is a junkyard setup so no expensive bisi cams. could i use f20b valve train in a sohc nonvtec f22a head?

PirateMcFred

Thank you. Tom's a badass.

It's nice to know where your roots lie.

-P

kingofbattle909

iTrader: (6)

IMHO h22 is the best just port the inside.

Also there was someone with a 300hp+ h22/h2b swap runnin' 10's around that offered services to make a custom' top part of the h22 IM.

ivan93egreppin210

thank you. i have spent countless hours reading threads you and those other guys started.

lol my bad pirate. like i said i just found out about the potential for h series and im stoked because i have alot of parts lying around. as far as my build im 100% sure it involves f20b cams and valve train, k20 pistons, f23 block crank rods, 70mm omniman tb, we just bought an h2b kit but its going on our stock h23vtec. i might be running the lude trans for now as well. how big a difference is it with h2b kit (gsr tranny) over the lude tranny? im still unsure about what intake manifold to go with as well. thought i read f20b was a bitch to fit. gotta double check that.

all this week we are getting ready for IFO in Ennis but hopefully next week we can spend some time on my build. this wont be a 10 month build. im hoping for 2-3 weeks tops. at least by 12/11/11. IFO finals will be local so thats the day im aiming for. we shall see if it happens.

gstrudler

Most people seem to favor a good ported Euro-R or even a ported USDM manifold over the S2 or other IM's. Finding stock manifolds is pretty easy too if you don't have any around.

As far as rod bolts, I'm out of extras, sorry. There were rumors of ARP selling f23/k20a3 rod bolts, but I don't think it ever happened. Rods are going to be your weak spot if you want to rev this motor out at all. Either that or you're dropping $800 on Crower rods, which is sounds like you won't be doing either.

I think anyone will tell you to go the h2b route for racing if you have the resources. Good luck on the build