toohott4handlin

Well heres whats going on... I busted a heater hose on the freeway a while back, fixed it, then filled the radiator with just water, no coolant (because i didnt have any at the time) and have been driving like that since. Now, if im correct the purpose of coolane (antifreeze) is to keep the water temp up above freezing. So now on a cool night, my temp gauge needle just drops to the c point, and never really reaches the center of the gauge much. i need to put some coolant in i realize, but the question is, when i do, will the thermostat stay at 'normal' operating temp, or will it stay stuck open at drop low like its been doing? has anyone had this problem before?
-steve

MaxBoost

Sounds like your thermostat might be stuck open.

Also you have to understand that straight water will cool better then a 50/50 mix of water and antifreeze. Makes the motor run cooler. If you aren't anywhere cold, I would reccomend running a 90/10 distilled water / coolant mixture. You want more water to increase the efficiency of your cooling system, but atleast 10% coolant to keep o-rings and the water pump lubricated.

92TypeR

I've been running straight water on my ITR motors for the last 3 years. If the temps drop below freezing, a thick blanket over the hood of the car takes any worries away.

I've liked the motor running cooler, makes me feel a little more secure...I can drive on the highway for 20 minutes and my temperature is still around 1/4, and when I cruise in the city, it'll touch the C every once and a while.

The ONLY downside to running cooler is that your ECU will go into 'warmup' mode if the temps drop too much, causing high, erratic idle.

toohott4handlin

I noticed with my friends two cars, theyve been using only water, and their temps drop very low as well. Sometimes so low that vtec wont even engage. When they put coolant in though, it still stayed low. Can using only water damage the thermostat??

importboi22

no but running stright water can destroy your water pump over time.... if your gonna run just water atleast get water wetter or water pump lubricant i dont know the name of it but i know they have it cuz i ran it in my rx7 at the time

StorminMatt

Since pure substances generally conduct heat better than mixtures, plain water does indeed cool better than a water/coolant mixture. But there is one problem (other than freezing): corrosion. Anti-freeze contains corrosion inhibitors that help slow corrosion. So this could be a problem in areas where freezing is not a problem.

-KangaRod-

also if you blow your headgasket, distilled water will sit at the top of the oil and not blow your rings, but coolant and oil will mix, and increase chance of spinning a bearing. Come summer I'll be running like a 10-90 or a 20-80 distilled and coolant.

im_poor

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by StorminMatt &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">But there is one problem (other than freezing): corrosion. Anti-freeze contains corrosion inhibitors that help slow corrosion. So this could be a problem in areas where freezing is not a problem.</TD></TR></TABLE>



do you mean this kind of corrosion??
this is what happens when people run straight water.

Lsos

Yeah, corrosion is a big part of it. I imagine corroded walls don't conduct heat as well as clean walls.

Another thing people need to realize: running your engine cooler will not gain you power, it will make you lose power. Manufacturers design engines to operate at as high temperatures as possible, and you should take advantage of this fact as much as possible. Running your engine cooler is pointless.

Nid Styles

Yeah, but you can more advance if it's running cooler. Don't forget more compression too. Not that it still doesn't take tuning, but it make it more allowable so to say.

WAFFLES

Antifreeze also lubricates the seals. I run a 75%water 25%antifreeze mixture. Water is cooler, but antifreeze is necessary still.

Lsos

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by nd_styles &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Yeah, but you can more advance if it's running cooler. Don't forget more compression too. Not that it still doesn't take tuning, but it make it more allowable so to say.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Is this true? I never really heard about that but I guess I can see how it would be...

I wonder if the trade-off is worth it....

99-DC2

iTrader: (1)

they do this when racing though but if you want your motor to last it is not suggested to run just water... also, if the water temp is too cold you won't hit VTEC...

-KangaRod-

designers design engines to run hot for emission purposes mostly, however there was one guy on here that was explaining for short term racing ( drag racing, time trials) they often run an oil heater since the temperature of the oil wont get hight enough fast enough. For the long term though, you'll never find an engine that runs too cool (just add more advance / compression)

Gabe_

Coolant also raises the boiling point of water...

I have heard bad things about water wetter.

I will stick with Honda OE 50/50 coolant and a Fluidyne.

virginia_dude

antifreeze keeps corrosion from happening , lubricates the water pump also. Straight water is always a bad thing. Water boils at a lower temp than water/antifreeze blend too.

SOHCwarrior

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by virginia_dude &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">antifreeze keeps corrosion from happening , lubricates the water pump also. Straight water is always a bad thing. Water boils at a lower temp than water/antifreeze blend too.</TD></TR></TABLE>

werd,
Also theres a lot of metal in the engine and water makes metal rust, antifreeze helps resist rusting, which doesn't happen too often.
Also your thermostat controls the temp, so the motor doesnt nesseccarily run cooler, it just takes longer to warm up.
I'd never run straight water, just add a lil coolant and you'll have far less to worry about. And if water is so great why are there new types of waterless coolant

Nid Styles

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by SOHCwarrior &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

werd,
Also theres a lot of metal in the engine and water makes metal rust, antifreeze helps resist rusting, which doesn't happen too often.
Also your thermostat controls the temp, so the motor doesnt nesseccarily run cooler, it just takes longer to warm up.
I'd never run straight water, just add a lil coolant and you'll have far less to worry about. And if water is so great why are there new types of waterless coolant</TD></TR></TABLE>


YO DOG!

Umm, that metal is Aluminum, which doesn't rust. Seondly I've never seen it said anywhere that anti-freeze raises the boiling point of water. Actually I've seen quite the opposite. Please prove me wrong though.
Thermostat doesn't control anything it just prevents over-heating by opening at pre-determined temps. Straight water does make it take longer to warm up, but that's because it has a high rate of entrophy than mixtures of anti-freeze, and water.
If running staight water was so bad why is it a NHRA reg. that on the track you're supposed to? I was commenting on the fact most racers run it because when moving it keeps your temps lower by cooling ti faster. GEE, just put in a lower temp. thermo, or tap hole in the exsisting one and advance your timing. Cheap easy power.
I would say that newer waterless coolant's are being marketed for more $$$, or possibly to make everyone to switch-over. It is about the $$$ after all, and if you don't already know that you're in for a rude awakening.

Sobe_Death

YO DOG!!!
ummm, the sleeves in the engine arent made out of aluminum, last i checked it was ductile iron. which does rust. second, the whole purpose of ethylene glycol antifreeze/coolant is to raise the boiling point and lower the freezing point of water. water takes longer to warm up in the engine than the coolant mix simply because it is more efficient at transferring heat. the combustion process heats the water, the water transfers the heat through the engine block/radiator to the atmosphere, and does so more efficiently than your regular coolant mix thus taking longer for the water to hold as much heat as well as coolant mix.

do a little chemistry research, it has alot to do with specific heat.

SOHCwarrior

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Sobe_Death &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">YO DOG!!!
ummm, the sleeves in the engine arent made out of aluminum, last i checked it was ductile iron. which does rust. second, the whole purpose of ethylene glycol antifreeze/coolant is to raise the boiling point and lower the freezing point of water. water takes longer to warm up in the engine than the coolant mix simply because it is more efficient at transferring heat. the combustion process heats the water, the water transfers the heat through the engine block/radiator to the atmosphere, and does so more efficiently than your regular coolant mix thus taking longer for the water to hold as much heat as well as coolant mix.

do a little chemistry research, it has alot to do with specific heat.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Thank you

Pondus

And though Aluminum won't rust it will still corrode when exposed to water.

Nid Styles

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Sobe_Death &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">YO DOG!!!
ummm, the sleeves in the engine arent made out of aluminum, last i checked it was ductile iron. which does rust. second, the whole purpose of ethylene glycol antifreeze/coolant is to raise the boiling point and lower the freezing point of water. water takes longer to warm up in the engine than the coolant mix simply because it is more efficient at transferring heat. the combustion process heats the water, the water transfers the heat through the engine block/radiator to the atmosphere, and does so more efficiently than your regular coolant mix thus taking longer for the water to hold as much heat as well as coolant mix.

do a little chemistry research, it has alot to do with specific heat.</TD></TR></TABLE>


Wrong on the raising boiling point, there buddy. Anytime you something to water it will lower the mean effective boiling point in a ratio in accordance to said additives, and the percentages. This is why your car runs hotter faster with the mixture. Add salt to clean water it's the same thing you lower the freezing point, but you also lower the boiling point. The only way to get around this is to pressurize the water (WHICH IS DONE WITH THE THERMOSTAT WHEN CLOSED), or turn into "heavy water" which is used in nuclear reactors. I don't think you want to pay $350 for a simple gallon of water that also happens to be radioactive.

Also the coolant mixture it's more efficient than pure water that's just more mis-information. Latent heat of vaporization of Glycol is 800.1 kJ/kg. Water's is 2257 kJ/kg. Gee, which one there is greater?


BTW: I don't need Chemistry I'm out of school already. Yes, I took thermo too. So **** OFF!!!